[Zanth]

Quote:

Originally Posted by J-Pak Everyones guessing the HP-2 (how can this be a mystery...when everyone... ) Trust me I'm a huge non-fan of the HD650. Balanced they are quite different. I think with a good replacement cable in balanced mode they are pretty good for classical. The bass is controlled, but you'll never be able to bring out high end like any Grado can. These were much less "colored" to me than the GS-1000. The HD580/HD600 is definitely more neutral compared to the HD650, it's a mistake on my part that I didn't include it. Sorry about that elitism comment rob, just a little annoying when people blow off new users. It's really obvious in the IEM threads, I just try and avoid them now.

One of the best systems I have ever listened to was a Sony SCD-1-->Headroom Max (older model)-->HD650 or 600 with Mobius cable. I could easily live with this setup. It was incredible. The main reason I don't own a pair of Senns is because I find they clamp and I get a headache. I always marvelled at the comments that Grados were uncomfortable and Senns were very comfortable. This was a complete opposite for me as well as my wife. Just goes to show that different strokes for different folks also pertains to the fit and finish not just the sound.

 

[Audiofiler]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zanth Not sure if he was a head-fier or not, but he wrote for Stereophile (the reviews I speak about were all in Stereophile, I have copies) and then he went on to another mag, and maybe an online one now.

Pretty sure it is the same guy..how weird

wonder how he feels about the GS VS the RS these days

 

[J-Pak]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zanth One of the best systems I have ever listened to was a Sony SCD-1-->Headroom Max (older model)-->HD650 or 600 with Mobius cable. I could easily live with this setup. It was incredible. The main reason I don't own a pair of Senns is because I find they clamp and I get a headache. I always marvelled at the comments that Grados were uncomfortable and Senns were very comfortable. This was a complete opposite for me as well as my wife. Just goes to show that different strokes for different folks also pertains to the fit and finish not just the sound.

I agree that Grados are very comfortable.

I started with the SR-60, I just had to stop using it after more than an hour. This is with the headband not bent out and before I know that you could even do that. After bending them out you really could use them for hours on end without feeling like you were wearing a headphone.

Same for the RS-1 (wow these are light), HF-1, SR-225. Even the MS-2i and PS-1 weight never bothered me.

 

[blessingx]

Quote:

Originally Posted by J-Pak Trust me I'm a huge non-fan of the HD650. Balanced they are quite different. I think with a good replacement cable in balanced mode they are pretty good for classical. The bass is controlled, but you'll never be able to bring out high end like any Grado can. These were much less "colored" to me than the GS-1000.

The HD650 is pretty colored on the low end (with a blanket warmth - far more encompassing than the GS1000 out of my source). Overall they're far less colored than the non-GS1000 production Grados. As for balanced HD650 or GS1000 being more colored, as you implied, I think it's where you look at the spectrum. And for the record, although I greatly preferred the Zu Mobius to the Senn stock cable single-ended, balanced (out of the DA10 we both share) the Senn stock balanced and Mobius balanced equaled each other (with quite different sounds) and which was more or less colored again depended on the spectrum area focused on.

 

[purk]

Very nice discussion indeed. Beside the HE-90, Ultrazone Edition 7, and GS1000...I have tried just about all of them...so this thread gives a very nice picture of the GS1000 for me.

 

[robm321]

Quote:

Originally Posted by J-Pak Sorry about that elitism comment rob, just a little annoying when people blow off new users. It's really obvious in the IEM threads, I just try and avoid them now.

No problem buddy

- I enjoy your posts and think you have a lot of credibility here, so no worries at all.

I can be a bit brash with my comments, but never want to dismiss someone new to the hobby. Maybe it's me who should work on my tact.

 

[robm321]

Quote:

Originally Posted by blessingx The HD650 is pretty colored on the low end (with a blanket warmth - far more encompassing than the GS1000 out of my source). Overall they're far less colored than the non-GS1000 production Grados. As for balanced HD650 or GS1000 being more colored, as you implied, I think it's where you look at the spectrum. And for the record, although I greatly preferred the Zu Mobius to the Senn stock cable single-ended, balanced (out of the DA10 we both share) the Senn stock balanced and Mobius balanced equaled each other (with quite different sounds) and which was more or less colored again depended on the spectrum area focused on.

You raise a very good point (I think you raise it here anyway).

If the Senn 650 needs recabling and a particular balanced amped to sound it's best, I would assume finding a particlar amp, possibly balancing, and recabling the GS-1000 would be necessary for a fair comparison.

audiofiler has already mentioned that the BD cable with the GS-1000 smooths out the highs and does a number of other things to help the GS-1000 sound better, and since they are relatively new - we don't really have a consensus on a synergistic set up yet. So, the GS-1000s may have much more potential than they are showing so far.

 

[Zanth]

Synergy is the key with most phones. When dealing with Grados, because they are pretty easy to drive in terms of getting them loud from puny sources, many discount the need for an amp. They need current, lots of it and the more one gets the better control in the bass, the more cohesive the sound with quicker transients, better decay rates and much better highs. That said, getting an amp that does this right isn't necessarily easy. There are some amps that pump out a lot of power but not a lot of current. So some may spend 1500 on an amp, pair them with a Grado, not enjoy the sound and blame the phone not the ancillary components. Is that fair? Or...conversely if one loves a phone and pairs it with an amp that will underpower it, is it fair to declare the amp crap? Nope!

This hobby is not just plug 'n play. It can be, and some may be quite content to just listen without fuss. But to get the most out of anything one has to tweak, test, experiment etc. This is the same with anything - computers, cars, houses, etc. Improvements are to be had in many places but the big deal for this hobby is: if I have X and I want Y, can X do well enough with Y? Do I need to change X or Z? Do I need to swap out X? Sometimes the answer will be "stop worrying enjoy the music" but if one isn't enjoying the music something needs to be change or part. Maybe that means the amp, maybe that means the phone or maybe that means the source.

Many remark about legendary combos:

RS-1/RA-1
RS-1/Ear HP4
RS-1/Cary
PS-1/Melos
PS-1/Supra
HP-1000/Melos
R10/SDS
R10/Cary
HD600s/Blockhead
HD650's/New Max
HD6x0's/Moth 2a3 or 300b
K1000/Ear V20

Etc...people have put in the effort to find which mates well with what. When something connects I mean really connects many people chase after the same combo. I mean...no one would go out buy an older Moth with Grados, the tubes can't handle the low Z of the Grados (or R10's for that matter) and the sound was noted to be rather lackluster yet HD6x0's sounded awesome (and Moth even recommended them in their ad for the Moth amps). So if one owned a Moth and then bought an RS-1, would it be fair to say the RS-1's suck because the Moth isn't powerering the RS-1's properly? I woudl hope not, not really fair to a fine product poorly matched with an amp. Best idea: sell one or the other or both.

 

[cabilyo]

I was today in HI-FI meeting in Israel were the GS-1000 was inroduced
I must say I am very dissapointed with that HeadPhone.
Highs was harsh,Bass was boomy,Grado Midrange Don't exist

I almost payed 850$ for used one,glad I had the chance to hear it.
HD650 are way better that GS-1000 for my taste.
By the way the Stax 007 is AMAZING

Never heard so realistic sound from Headphone.

 

[Jahn]

cab, what was the amp used with the GS1k?

 

[omendelovitz]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cabilyo I was today in HI-FI meeting in Israel were the GS-1000 was inroduced I must say I am very dissapointed with that HeadPhone. Highs was harsh,Bass was boomy,Grado Midrange Don't exist I almost payed 850$ for used one,glad I had the chance to hear it. HD650 are way better that GS-1000 for my taste. By the way the Stax 007 is AMAZING Never heard so realistic sound from Headphone.

My GS1's had boomy bass in the beginning. I had to disconnect the bass boost feature (built into my amp, not a switch) and now it sounds perfect! As always, a cursory listen (especially before the diaphragm settles in) is a poor way to test this (or IMO any) headphone. When my 650's were new, they also had boomy, rattly bass!

 

[Jahn]

you know what amp had great synergy? Mercuttio's MisterX PPA. dunno if we used bass boost or not. that baby was feeding the GS1K some monster current - I liked it better than the tubey amps I tried the GS1K with!

 

[GoRedwings19]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zanth Seriously...Benny Goodman on stage through RS-1's, can't be bettered by any phone I've tried (to my ears in my system ) same goes for many other performers, there is something just magical about RS-1's. Back in the late 90's there was a reviewer (Cory Greenburg I believe) who prefered the RS-1/RA-1 and RS-1/Melos over the Big O! In fact, he prefered it over the Omega II's as well. He even dropped his HP-2's (he had them along with the Melos) when the RS-1's came out. He loved them that much. It really goes to show that it really is all about taste and Cory Greenburg was not a "bought off" reviewer, he was likely one of the most honest (and fun to read) reviewers to come our way in decades.

There is also Ken Kessler (emp a.e and rs) and also another prominent hi fi hack who uses the melos and rs combo although his name slips me at the moment.

 

[Blackmore]

Please tell us which set up did you use with GS1, AMP+CD player

Quote:

Originally Posted by cabilyo I was today in HI-FI meeting in Israel were the GS-1000 was inroduced I must say I am very dissapointed with that HeadPhone. Highs was harsh,Bass was boomy,Grado Midrange Don't exist I almost payed 850$ for used one,glad I had the chance to hear it. HD650 are way better that GS-1000 for my taste. By the way the Stax 007 is AMAZING Never heard so realistic sound from Headphone.

 

[Zanth]

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoRedwings19 There is also Ken Kessler (emp a.e and rs) and also another prominent hi fi hack who uses the melos and rs combo although his name slips me at the moment.

I forgot about Ken Kessler. I've not read (m)any of his reviews but I do know he enjoys EAR products (he owned the Ear 834p for ages before just recently upgrading) and seems to be in line with what I like out of music.