[Currawong]

Music_man: totally understanable. Some people just aren't into a "nothing but the music" audiophile presentation. I can easily imagine, say, someone who loves AT L3000s hating the HD800s for example. I think what people forget the most is the kind of music we like being very important with headphone choice. I don't imagine someone who likes hip-hop liking the HD-800s.

 

[music_man]

rangen, i am very poor at explaining sound. the best i can say is as i already have. they are dependent on the source. i really don't know what would be the right source to make them please me. to that end i have used them with a ear hp4,cullen modded gcha, and dac1. all of those were fed by a g08 into a lavry gold, valhalla cables. except in the case of the dac1 wich was the dac of course.

you might laugh that i have the stock cable on the headphones. i'll probably get a different cable. i guess that makes a big difference to most people that have the hd800.

still, not loving them with what i have suggests to me they they are either too picky or just not my "flavor".

edit:currawong, i sometimes listen to stuff like flim and the bb's,spyro gyra,weather report,manhatton transfer,quincy jones. however what i really listen to is(please don't laugh) prince,madonna,b. spears,michael j.(r.i.p.),george clinton. are these the wrong headphones for those genres? please don't anyone flame my listening preference, for one thing that is not allowed here! i catch enough heat for it already.

music_man

 

[Beagle]

Quote:

Originally Posted by music_man /img/forum/go_quote.gif beagle, every thing you quoted is spot on. i agree with all of it. i bought the hd800 and will buy the ps1000 because i collect headphones. there are only a few i listen to. it's a collection to me. people have collected more odd items, right?

For sure. I just didn't fully comprehend the idea of collecting headphones you didn't like the sound of, but if it's the thrill of the hunt and adding something to the collection, by all means, keep on keeping on and enjoy!

Quote:

as far as the beyer, it is probably not technically superior to anything anywhere near the hd800. i just like it. it is like neutral with added pizazz. i know those terms contradict each other. it is hard to explain. the hd800 just sits there and lets the music through.

I understand the point you are making. The Beyer is more communicative for you.

Quote:

it has been said many times that you might not want to wish for a perfectly flat headphone. i will use it but it doesn't "impress" me. i don't think it is intended to impress.

Again, I hear you. The HD800 does not strut it's stuff. It does not participate in the music.

 

[rangen]

Quote:

Originally Posted by music_man /img/forum/go_quote.gif still, not loving them with what i have suggests to me they they are either too picky or just not my "flavor".

Or both.

I do not laugh that you are using the stock cable -- I have done no messing with cables on my rig. I am not closed to the possibility of cables providing an improvement, but lacking a plausible theoretical basis, I've declined to lay out money blind. I'm open to the possibility that a comparative audition someday might make me willing to make such expenditures, but until that happens, I'm holding onto my wallet.

"Not my flavor" is perfectly understandable and not remediable. "Picky" is a different story, if the right synergy might present you with a very different picture, which is perhaps more likely with these headphones than others. If you have opportunities to plug them into other amplification, it might be edifying.

By getting a pair with 500 hours, you have neatly circumvented the issue of physical breakin. But there are people here who have made a good case for the idea that breakin is partly or wholly mental. If they're right, it might make some sense to give yourself time to possibly adjust before passing them on to the next set of ears.

I do have to say, though, that I found the clarity, transparency, accuracy (e.g. on piano) and the light-handed sense of air of these headphones very appealing from the first. So maybe there's not much hope for a happy marriage between your ears and the HD800.

 

[music_man]

couple of intresting things. per currawong, i went and found my leatherhead. yes, i like them much much better than the hd800! i guess that explains that. in fact i think i like them better than the beyers. i can't keep them on my table due to pet teeth though. the beyers are the champs of cheap to me.

now, some might say if the leatherhead is colored and he likes it better that makes the hd800 a technically superior bargain! well, i just thought some people might think about that. i guess it just boils down to what you like. for instance, i don't like the 010 or sa5000.

now here is what is intresting. i got out the good 'ol presonus central station. it makes me happier with the hd800 than the hp4 does! that must say one of three things. 1. my ears are past their time. 2. the central station is not as neutral as i always said it was. or 3. it just somehow jives with these headphones(for me at least). if this works for anyone else it lays to rest the notion that one must have an uber expensive rig to enjoy the hd800! actually i am rather surprised about this myself.

i am also glad that at least one person did not recommend that i must purchase a headphone cable for the hd800. a whole 'nother story but i feel that all cables are created equal. except valhalla! who was that guy that did all those "experiments"? yeah, i am as crazy about it as he is. well, almost.

music_man

 

[myk7000]

congrats on your 1337 post.

I can't imagine collecting headphones that expensive and never using them but im glad you're financially fortunate

I suppose its about taste but I can't help but commenting that I've heard the hd800 next to the beyers and just thought that there was absolutely no comparison in just about every category. The HD800 destroyed the DT880 ( and i still think the dt880 is a great headphone )

 

[M3NTAL]

I sleep with my cans on too.. Different head shapes I guess. The HD800 and SA5000 both work great for me.. HD800 being better.. Downfall of laying on your side with them is that it turns one driver into a sealed enclosure essentially - this kills the sound on one side. Don't even try it with electrostatics HAHAHA.

 

[majkel]

I had the HD800 at home for several days and I fully understand what music_man says. I'd rather have the DT880 Pro's for $300 than the HD800 for $1399. The HD800 are unemotional. Live concerts are not. The HD800's pretend to sound flat and transparent but they don't. They have kind of shortened decay which makes them sound odd and unengaging. They don't compare neither to Grado RS1i nor to the GS1000i which was proven in the reviews, and the latter I can confirm every day. Live concert is something more emotional than any audio equipment I have ever listened to, including >$100,000 setups. The HD800 try to put it on the opposite pole. For me it is not transparency.

 

[music_man]

well, the people that wanted me to explain what i meant by "flat soda" majkel just explained it better. that is exactly what i feel.

i have not compared my gs1000 to the beyers. in case no one remmebers my gs1000(not i) have burled walnut cups to the exact dimensions of the mahagony cups and valhalla speaker wire. i don't know if they sound better or worse than stock but they look real cool

i won't keep them out because i do not want them chewed by pets. i will compare them though.

i wonder if i will like the ps1000 when i get it. i guess i prefer a ethereal,euphonic pleasing sound. not a sound that has no substance but a sound that massages your senses. an enlightened sound. i guess i was wrong about calling the dt880 neutral. it just makes the music come alive in a very pleasing way to me. i am sure more so with my gs1000. i will compare them soon.

edited: i was asking majkel what he thought about gs1000,ps1000...i read his review. off topic: i don't know if i will like the ps1000 either. i like the headphones to create emotion and make me feel like dancing. the hd800 was just to plain. i beleive headphones and loudspeakers can be neutral and also "active" in some manner. none of these have completely flat graphs. so they all do something, they just do it differently. i think most of the top loudspeakers to not tout transparency as much as "your there" feeling. ie, as if to be at the venue.

music_man

 

[Karlosak]

Quote:

Originally Posted by majkel /img/forum/go_quote.gif Live concert is something more emotional than any audio equipment I have ever listened to, including >$100,000 setups. The HD800 try to put it on the opposite pole. For me it is not transparency.

Depends on what you mean by a "live" concert - if it's an amplified performance, where the reproduction chain adds its own dose of flavor, I can see your point. But if it's an unamplified performance of real instruments in a real acoustical space, the HD800 come really close to the real thing for me. That's what I call transparency.

 

[majkel]

music_man, find "Grado PS1000 initial impressions" thread. There are my PS1000 impressions against GS1000, not "i" which is a bit more resolving.

Karlosak, yes, I meant unamplified, classical concertos or choir performances. Talking about fidelity of recreating amplified event is IMHO stupid. Pair of speakers or headphones faking up another set of loudspeakers. This wouldn't even make sense and sounded terrible. Life "plugged" performances are mastered from various microphone tracks and recreated. You never hear as it was like there. Then you have all those mastered studio albums and here there is a chance of sounding as if it was live instruments playing or the music, like electronica, is a creation on the level of mastering as well, and then you care for what you like. I feel happy with headphones which recreate the live, unplugged and unamplified event best as I trust they'll fare well with other kinds of music, and I like what they do with it.

 

[music_man]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karlosak /img/forum/go_quote.gif Depends on what you mean by a "live" concert - if it's an amplified performance, where the reproduction chain adds its own dose of flavor, I can see your point. But if it's an unamplified performance of real instruments in a real acoustical space, the HD800 come really close to the real thing for me. That's what I call transparency.

well, since i listen to synthesizer pop i guess i can see what my problem with these is then

music_man

 

[JaZZ]

Quote:

Originally Posted by majkel /img/forum/go_quote.gif The HD800 are unemotional. Live concerts are not.

The latter is true. And the former... well, partly, yes. But I think the main reason for this is the incapability of conveying the full threedimensionality of a live event. So what's left is a rather two-dimensional picture with no colors and spices added.


Quote:

The HD800s pretend to sound flat and transparent but they don't. They have kind of shortened decay which makes them sound odd and unengaging.

I've seen you state this several times and can't really reproduce it. Technically a shortened decay is barely possible, so there must be some psychoacoustics in play. To my ears the HD 800 has the ability to provide an impressively natural soundstage (for a headphone) without adding near-field reflections. Maybe it's this «dryness» that you interpret in your way. To me it doesn't sound perfectly flat, there's the mentioned treble emphasis, but I perceive it as extremely transparent and maybe more accurate than any other headphone I've auditioned.
.

 

[pearljam5000]

interesting stuff in this thread....
to me the real question would be,do music and instruments,and human voices sound real via the HD800?
for example,when i had my K1000 and i heard an electric guitar through it,it didn't sounded as"distroted" as via the SR80,and this would mean it would be less pleasing for some people i guess,but for me realism is the real deal-that is the real pleasure in music,to hear instruments and music as close to life as possible.

 

[Currawong]

Quote:

Originally Posted by music_man /img/forum/go_quote.gif edit:currawong, i sometimes listen to stuff like flim and the bb's,spyro gyra,weather report,manhatton transfer,quincy jones. however what i really listen to is(please don't laugh) prince,madonna,b. spears,michael j.(r.i.p.),george clinton. are these the wrong headphones for those genres? please don't anyone flame my listening preference, for one thing that is not allowed here! i catch enough heat for it already.

I've been listening to a bit of MJ lately, and I like the odd Madonna track, no nothing to flame here. One of the things relevant to me with high-end gear is its ability to bring through detail. I like to hear the music, un-coloured, but with some impact when I'm not casually listening. A lot of pop music I feel doesn't have as much one can appreciate with a high-end rig, eg: synthesised instruments, or overdubbing of poor-quality music and sounds. Compare this to classical or jazz and instrumental music where, IMO, one wants to ideally here the most detail of the performer(s) playing.

For me, the HD-800 had to stand up to electrostats. The first time I listened with a Stax rig, my dynamic rig at the time sounded like a try-hard effort at music reproduction. The HD-800s come close (importantly, with my main amp) -- enough so they are my preferred headphones at the moment -- but what the achieve over my Stax rig is the epic soundstage/headstage that comes from their design. The Stax still provide an effortless listen, delivering the music most effortlessly.

Quote:

Originally Posted by music_man /img/forum/go_quote.gif now, some might say if the leatherhead is colored and he likes it better that makes the hd800 a technically superior bargain! well, i just thought some people might think about that. i guess it just boils down to what you like. for instance, i don't like the 010 or sa5000.

I prefer the HD-800s over a pair of bass-heavy R10s I tried. I was thinking about this tonight and how some people prefer the R10s. I also know at least one manufacturer who makes two ranges of hi-fi gear, one range all "straight wire with gain"-sounding, and another range more warm and "tubey"-sounding, as he found people usually have one or the other taste in hi-fi.

Quote:

now here is what is intresting. i got out the good 'ol presonus central station. it makes me happier with the hd800 than the hp4 does! that must say one of three things. 1. my ears are past their time. 2. the central station is not as neutral as i always said it was. or 3. it just somehow jives with these headphones(for me at least). if this works for anyone else it lays to rest the notion that one must have an uber expensive rig to enjoy the hd800! actually i am rather surprised about this myself.

A comment elsewhere from someone was that each rig he tried HD-800s on sounded very different, so your experience doesn't surprise me.

Quote:

i am also glad that at least one person did not recommend that i must purchase a headphone cable for the hd800. a whole 'nother story but i feel that all cables are created equal. except valhalla! who was that guy that did all those "experiments"? yeah, i am as crazy about it as he is. well, almost.

You're thinking of Patrick82. I don't think though that a re-cable would suddenly make them great for anyone who didn't like them, but for me it made an improvement in a couple of areas I wasn't completely happy with. I can totally believe that people with different gear wouldn't feel they have the same issues.

Quote:

Originally Posted by majkel /img/forum/go_quote.gif I had the HD800 at home for several days and I fully understand what music_man says. I'd rather have the DT880 Pro's for $300 than the HD800 for $1399. The HD800 are unemotional. Live concerts are not. The HD800's pretend to sound flat and transparent but they don't. They have kind of shortened decay which makes them sound odd and unengaging. They don't compare neither to Grado RS1i nor to the GS1000i which was proven in the reviews, and the latter I can confirm every day. Live concert is something more emotional than any audio equipment I have ever listened to, including >$100,000 setups. The HD800 try to put it on the opposite pole. For me it is not transparency.

Maybe they should have been made by AKG and called K800s, because this reminds me of K701s at one particular time with a certain amp and source.