[helmutcheese]

Nearly every earbud I have had (not all) have been able to power on/off and enter secondary pairing mode from the buds themselves.

 

[TK33]

I was just wondering because I remember a number of comments about how much the sound improved with the updated firmware. I guess it was not just the "hi-res" codec support.

AptX is fine. I try not to get too caught up with codes and just try to enjoy the music. I currently use with a Samsung Galaxy S22+ and Pixel 7 Pro and will use them with a Fold5 whenever that gets here. I just use over aptX even though I do have the LG V60, which can do aptX adaptive.

I left my MTW3 in my other bag so I cant take a screenshot but I don't think hires mode is the same "Hi-Res" audio that everyone assumed you were talking about. I believe all it does is force the higher bitrate for aptX adaptive (someone please correct me if I am wrong but that was my recollection).

Edit: forgot to add that the recent updates improved the EQ functionality by adding a 5 band EQ (from 3 band) and an improved sound personalization mode that is, in my opinion, pretty cool. I recall the MTW2 had a "hires" tuning mode that many liked but that does not exist on the MTW3.

 

[highlightshadow]

You may lose passive seal so ANC as they are pretty thin, you could have gone with the denser AZLA SednaEarfit Crystal (TWS version also available), they worked well for me on the MTW3.

Ok -- so i decided to give them a punt since i do like the Xelastec's so much.
You're not wrong -- the Crystals are PERFECT for the MTW3 -- they have enough surface grip to provide that reassurance on fit and the seal is better than the C1025s and without touching anything i've got what feels like a 2-3dB bump in bass/sub-bass
The sound i'm getting now feels so full and rich across the spectrum. I like a little bass skew (just a bit) and the crystal's have given me that.

Get's a little tiresome sometimes of tip-rolling so much but these are worth it.
Thanks for the recommendation

 

[james444]

LDAC can transmit Audio CD Quality lossless and up to 96/24 with lossy compression in 909/990kbps mode and thus meet the requirements for certification since it exists.

Uncompressed Audio CDs have 1440kbps, when you have FLAC with 1400 you made something wrong.

The largest FLAC in my collection that is not Hi-Res audio is 950kbps. So maybe check your encoder settings

Maximum bitrate of the LDAC encoder with 44.1kHz content is 909kbps, not 990kbps. 990kbps is for 48 and 96kHz content only.
https://habr.com/en/articles/456182/ (scroll down to the 'LDAC' section)

So your largest FLAC compressed CD quality files wouldn't fit the LDAC bandwidth for 44.1kHz content.

Btw, user "yamamoto2002" posted an incompressible WAV file in this thread to demonstrate that lossless compression doesn't necessarily lead to smaller file size:
https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/...41khz16bit-red-book-cd-files/#comment-1075713

Bottom line, we can conclude that LDAC cannot possibly be lossless for all 44.1kHz content. Maybe it is for the most part though.
Afaik Sony never explicitly said that LDAC was bit-perfect at 44.1kHz. They phrased it 'same as CD quality', which leaves some room for interpretation.

 

[Not so fat head]

They had Hi-Res via aptX Adaptive at launch, but I assume it may have been only 24/48 as they put in a Toggle for 24/96 in the GUI with a later FW, the newest FW adds a type of personal EQ type tuning thing that may or may not be a gimmick but if you like the sound then why not.

They sound good with 16/44.1 CD rips via aptX, you do not need to play Hi-Res files or have aptX Adaptive support.

I did not use or need any EQ with High Quality CD rips but lower quality older files I did need to, same for the FW5's and my FiiO Neckband+FH5's and FH7's (wired).

I’m not completely sure, but the M2’s do, and that’s save the EQ setting to the TWS device hardware….might be unique to Sennheiser. To me, this is a huge selling point, all music going forward will subscribe to those settings..
You have to physically change back to flat and reset…

 

[newworld666]

Maximum bitrate of the LDAC encoder with 44.1kHz content is 909kbps, not 990kbps. 990kbps is for 48 and 96kHz content only.
https://habr.com/en/articles/456182/ (scroll down to the 'LDAC' section)

So your largest FLAC compressed CD quality files wouldn't fit the LDAC bandwidth for 44.1kHz content.

Btw, user "yamamoto2002" posted an incompressible WAV file in this thread to demonstrate that lossless compression doesn't necessarily lead to smaller file size:
https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/...41khz16bit-red-book-cd-files/#comment-1075713

Bottom line, we can conclude that LDAC cannot possibly be lossless for all 44.1kHz content. Maybe it is for the most part though.
Afaik Sony never explicitly said that LDAC was bit-perfect at 44.1kHz. They phrased it 'same as CD quality', which leaves some room for interpretation.

Anyway .. as far as we can make a direct A/B comparison with Bluetooth Codec Changer, LDAC lossy CD quality at 909kpbs instead the true 1411Kps CD quality sounds already is far better on android then AAC at 256Kbps.

What is noticeable is that the ultra tiny Sony 1000XM5 is the only TWS to offer a real continuous 9 hours playing time in LDAC 909/990 (without ANC) mode.. no other of my LDAC TWS can manage to do this (usually I get max 6 hours, more often 5 hours or less)..

 

[Not so fat head]

I don't think Sony's TWS are really made for AAC apple users => when we make instant A/B comparison with Bluetooth Codec Changer (android 10+) between AAC and LDAC@990kbps, there is a really significant sound quality change (maybe concerned with 3 times more compressed Codec from the old CD quality ? or it is maybe just a better sound science with LDAC from Sony ?..

Sony is not a simple integrator, like 90% of the TWS & IEM sellers on the market, of any Qualcomm BT hardware combos, Sony is for decades totally involved in Music and conceiving sound devices.
I think their devices are perfect for what they are intended to do.. and XM5 seems to be for LDAC android users only, for me, sound quality is on par with another giant of music hardware for decades like Technics.
Till now, ANC is basically a sound quality killer for most of the TWS (too much electronic with DSP involved in the sound), but Sony this time, managed significantly to be less worse than Technics on this point (by a big margin ?)..

Ha!!! Wow, are you kidding, Sony did the same thing for SACD.. I BS you not that Sony purposely dummied down redbook CD, to make SACD sound much better..
Gotta hand it to Sony, they are consistent.

 

[Andrew_WOT]

aptX Adaptive sounds better than LDAC both set to 24/96 IMO any a few others here even on same earbuds (FW5's).

How do they manage 24/96 over aptX Adaptive, it only supports 24/48 with significantly lower bandwidth than LDAC
https://www.soundguys.com/aptx-adaptive-explained-18768/

EDIT: found this spec on Qualcom site, looks like the article is wrong.
https://www.qualcomm.com/content/da...ts/aptx-adaptive-product-brief_87-ce932-1.pdf
But even LDAC is lossy at above 24/48 even at 990kbps, to get similar image quality at less than half bit rate is a miracle.

 

[erockg]

Praise indeed. If it's a thumbs up from @erockg, us mere mortals know it must be good.

I'd be interested to know how you now think it stacks up against this forums rated sets like NTP/Perl, Mystique, Svanar, AZ80?

Trust me, nothing more than a dumb mortal here who buys way too many gadgets.

I'm using the MTW3 on a Pixel Fold and only getting aptX. I don't think the PF supports adaptive. I'm usually an iPhone guy. Rocking Android for a few months now, but still have an iPhone for work.

I don't have the Perl (fit issues), Mystique (fit issues) or the AZ80. I regret returning the AZ80 but prefer the sound of the MTW3. Feels more alive to me. Haven't bit the bullet on the Svanar, but look at them every other day. I'm sure they'll be here soon enough. Sound on the Mystique is stellar due to that triple driver setup. But no ANC and Qi found them in a drawer too much. I also remember to activate transparency wasn't quick like most buds. Really looking forward to the Prestige though. I'm sure I'll buy them. The sub-bass you get from the Perl is a force to be reckoned with. All the features work flawlessly. ANC is decent with a good seal. Zero bugs. It was that fit. If they weren't so $$$ I probably would have dealt with it and kept them. In a perfect world I would have kept them all. These days I only keep a few around and sell off others before they lose resale value. It's my curse.

Now, switching to my Moto Razr+ I can get aptX Adaptive with the MTW3 and my metal abused ears hear a slight difference in clarity, but it's negligible.

All the above said, I've been using the MTW3 for two days straight. If you can get them at 40% off like I did, they're an incredible value and, as we've all discussed, sound much better now. Are they worth it at full price? No. Which leads me to another favorite - the 3ANC - which are on sale for $199 these days. Sad thing is they're only AAC/SBC. Some might find that sacrilege. Switching over to the Status Between 3ANC, yes, sound is better than the MTW3 imo. Separation for sure because of those 3 drivers. Case is smaller, but fit isn't for everyone. But I'll be damned if the Sennies soundstage is little wider than them now. They sound open, airy and sub bass is a bit more full.

 

[Pastapipo]

They sound open, airy and sub bass is a bit more full.

Do the MTW3 have the fuller sub bass or is this the 3ANC you're describing?

I just returned the Sony C700N. Although they possess a lovely dynamic midrange. The subbass is definitely lacking.
I'm currently using the Samsung Buds 2 Pro, they sound great, but their fit is an issue. Also, physical buttons would be nice for bicycle use.
Any suggestions for flat sounding wireless IEMs with a nice deep subbass?

 

[sgtbilko]

Trust me, nothing more than a dumb mortal here who buys way too many gadgets.

I'm using the MTW3 on a Pixel Fold and only getting aptX. I don't think the PF supports adaptive. I'm usually an iPhone guy. Rocking Android for a few months now, but still have an iPhone for work.

I don't have the Perl (fit issues), Mystique (fit issues) or the AZ80. I regret returning the AZ80 but prefer the sound of the MTW3. Feels more alive to me. Haven't bit the bullet on the Svanar, but look at them every other day. I'm sure they'll be here soon enough. Sound on the Mystique is stellar due to that triple driver setup. But no ANC and Qi found them in a drawer too much. I also remember to activate transparency wasn't quick like most buds. Really looking forward to the Prestige though. I'm sure I'll buy them. The sub-bass you get from the Perl is a force to be reckoned with. All the features work flawlessly. ANC is decent with a good seal. Zero bugs. It was that fit. If they weren't so $$$ I probably would have dealt with it and kept them. In a perfect world I would have kept them all. These days I only keep a few around and sell off others before they lose resale value. It's my curse.

Now, switching to my Moto Razr+ I can get aptX Adaptive with the MTW3 and my metal abused ears hear a slight difference in clarity, but it's negligible.

All the above said, I've been using the MTW3 for two days straight. If you can get them at 40% off like I did, they're an incredible value and, as we've all discussed, sound much better now. Are they worth it at full price? No. Which leads me to another favorite - the 3ANC - which are on sale for $199 these days. Sad thing is they're only AAC/SBC. Some might find that sacrilege. Switching over to the Status Between 3ANC, yes, sound is better than the MTW3 imo. Separation for sure because of those 3 drivers. Case is smaller, but fit isn't for everyone. But I'll be damned if the Sennies soundstage is little wider than them now. They sound open, airy and sub bass is a bit more full.

You had me at '...buys way too many gadgets.'

Agree with you on price for the MTW3. Then again, if any of the top end TWS were $200 or less, I might have tried them instead. My lizard brain sees $300-400, says they're not twice as good as my other stuff and shuts down.

Re: MTW3's 'airyness', that's definitely something that only comes from their sound personalisation feature. Certainly helps them a better stage and musicality.

Having been buying TWS' since Soundcore started out as Zolo, I've never been a fan of long stem sets or ones that stick out too much. I had the Jabra 65t's for years - which is about as big as I ever wanted to wear.

 

[Andrew_WOT]

Bottom line, we can conclude that LDAC cannot possibly be lossless for all 44.1kHz content. Maybe it is for the most part though.
Afaik Sony never explicitly said that LDAC was bit-perfect at 44.1kHz. They phrased it 'same as CD quality', which leaves some room for interpretation.

True, there are some tests these guys ran. Good read to understand limitations, yet still seems like it's the best thing on the market today, and mostly fulfill lossless RedBook promise, until we see wider adoption of AptX Lossless, if it takes off.

The first item we put to the test is LDAC’s frequency response. In Hi-Res mode, the codec should pass audio data up to 48kHz, and in CD mode should reach 20kHz untouched. If you want to configure these settings yourself, you can find them in the Developer Settings of your Android smartphone.

First the good news: The 990kbps setting works as advertised. The codec transmits audio right up to 47kHz before slowly rolling off, granting it Hi-Res status. The 660kbps mode rolls off incredibly steeply at 30kHz, making it an odd middle ground between CD and Hi-Res—but that’s more than enough for most people. Both codecs roll-off at 21.5kHz when in CD mode, which is pretty much bang on the money.

 

[erockg]

You had me at '...buys way too many gadgets.'

Agree with you on price for the MTW3. Then again, if any of the top end TWS were $200 or less, I might have tried them instead. My lizard brain sees $300-400, says they're not twice as good as my other stuff and shuts down.

Re: MTW3's 'airyness', that's definitely something that only comes from their sound personalisation feature. Certainly helps them a better stage and musicality.

Having been buying TWS' since Soundcore started out as Zolo, I've never been a fan of long stem sets or ones that stick out too much. I had the Jabra 65t's for years - which is about as big as I ever wanted to wear.

Oh yes, I remember owning the Zolo and the 65t. Before that, I was an early adopter of the first gen Earin. I stupidly suffered their disconnects and still fell in love with them. Sigh... Pretty awesome to see how far it's all come.

 

[erockg]

Do the MTW3 have the fuller sub bass or is this the 3ANC you're describing?

I just returned the Sony C700N. Although they possess a lovely dynamic midrange. The subbass is definitely lacking.
I'm currently using the Samsung Buds 2 Pro, they sound great, but their fit is an issue. Also, physical buttons would be nice for bicycle use.
Any suggestions for flat sounding wireless IEMs with a nice deep subbass?

I would say the MTW3 have fuller bass after the Sound Personalization, but the 3ANC bass is much more refined. I would say if you're biking like @clerkpalmer does, the MTW3 would fit better especially with the wingtips included. Now as far as wind noise, not sure as I'm not an avid biker. Someone else here might be able to chime in.

Those GB2P used to slip out on me. I used some Azla tips and that solved the issue.

I'd have to think hard on your question. I'll come back on that one if I think of a good bud. Flat with deep sub-bass doesn't seem to go hand in hand without some EQ.

 

[sgtbilko]

Oh yes, I remember owning the Zolo and the 65t. Before that, I was an early adopter of the first gen Earin. I stupidly suffered their disconnects and still fell in love with them. Sigh... Pretty awesome to see how far it's all come.

The Zolo Liberty + came out in late 2017, so I'm guessing the Earin was the year before?

Like you say, we've come a hell of a long way in just 6-7 years.