[Progisus]

Next to the Lazuli Reference the original rubber monster stock cable sounds best imho. The Utopia sounds great with any cable and responds well to rolling. The cable is an important part of Utopia and discussions here are relevant and important.

 

[bfreedma]

Next to the Lazuli Reference the original rubber monster stock cable sounds best imho. The Utopia sounds great with any cable and responds well to rolling. The cable is an important part of Utopia and discussions here are relevant and important.

sigh…. It seemed like such a reasonable request…

In your opinion, cables are audibly significant but there is no validated evidence that there is truth to that statement beyond ergonomic issues.

I’ll leave it there and hope others in this subforum can be a little more respectful of other viewpoints and consider a separate thread for cable discussion where subjective views will be universally welcome.

The real fun will start in 2-3 years when new truth in audio advertising standards currently in development will (hopefully) become part of the commercial standard. If the draft is implemented with minimal change, vendors will need to support their marketing claims with some form of hard data. Could be measurements showing audibility, results of controlled testing, and/or validated adherence to applicable known science - anything reasonably viable.

Rational control of marketing claims have worked well in the UK and other countries, helping to avoid misrepresentation of performance. And when marketing goes over the line, consumers have recourse- recently Chord (the cable company, not electronics vendor) was forced to remove unproven claims around their Sarum T and Ethernet cables.

 

[thecrow]

sigh…. It seemed like such a reasonable request…

In your opinion, cables are audibly significant but there is no validated evidence that there is truth to that statement beyond ergonomic issues.

I’ll leave it there and hope others in this subforum can be a little more respectful of other viewpoints and consider a separate thread for cable discussion where subjective views will be universally welcome.

The real fun will start in 2-3 years when new truth in audio advertising standards currently in development will (hopefully) become part of the commercial standard. If the draft is implemented with minimal change, vendors will need to support their marketing claims with some form of hard data. Could be measurements showing audibility, results of controlled testing, and/or validated adherence to applicable known science - anything reasonably viable.

Rational control of marketing claims have worked well in the UK and other countries, helping to avoid misrepresentation of performance. And when marketing goes over the line, consumers have recourse- recently Chord (the cable company, not electronics vendor) was forced to remove unproven claims around their Sarum T and Ethernet cables.

Now we all do this so don’t take this as a personal dig (but having said that) you go from writing one paragraph and then writing “I’ll leave it there” to writing two longer paragraphs to put your opinion further forward.

you could have included somewhere in the middle “having said that….”

 

[Tanalasta]

The cable discussion on the Utopia has been quite informative and polite to date.

There are people who are believers of changes to their perception of sound via cables. How? I don't know. I wasn't a believer until I used two different pigtails (both well regarded audio companies). I wasn't expecting any difference. But there was. Obviously, this may or may not be perceptible to others.

Not everything is based upon scientific proof. Sometimes that's because of lack of evidence or the means to objectively measure a change yet to be derived. There may also be a human factor element that is immeasurable. However, what cable may work best for one person may not be another person's preference.

Just as some believe that drinking wine out of certain glasses changes the taste and aroma and there are entire lines of stemware catering for different varietals. That said, I could buy a whole cupboard of stemware with what the damned cables cost.

At least Danacable have a return and 100% refund guarantee. That in itself is enough for me to give it a go.

 

[bfreedma]

Now we all do this so don’t take this as a dig but you go from writing one paragraph and then writing “I’ll leave it there” to writing two longer paragraphs to put your opinion forward.

you could have included somewhere in the middle “having said that….”

“I’ll leave it there” was in reference to asking if cable discussion could be moved to a separate thread. Clearly, based on the replies, there is no point in continuing to suggest that be done. No need to be rude.

I look forward to seeing how truth in advertising regulations impact the ”high end” cable vendors (and audio vendors in general).

 

[Progisus]

With digital cables the differences in sound are debatable and hard to prove. Once in the analog domain cable resistance, capacitance, inductance, shielding and insulation types can all have an effect and should be measurable.

 

[llamaluv]

The real fun will start in 2-3 years when new truth in audio advertising standards currently in development will (hopefully) become part of the commercial standard.

Do you have any additional info or links on this? This piques my interest. On the other hand, if it's something being initiated from inside the industry, maybe not so much, lol.

 

[bfreedma]

Do you have any additional info or links on this? This piques my interest. On the other hand, if it's something being initiated from inside the industry, maybe not so much, lol.

No public information I can share at this time. This is a private initiative within a relatively small group of non industry people. We are still developing the proposed language in the hopes that it can be presented to the appropriate governing bodies by the end of the year. It's taking many revisions to distill the language down to something that remains fair to the industry without presenting loopholes.

The goal is to create a fair set of standards to eliminate unsubstantiated marketing elements portrayed as hard facts. The objective is to establish a more level playing field where consumers can make choices based on either hard(er) data from manufacturers or their subjective preferences, whichever suits their purchasing model. For example, marketing claims like "our customers love our cables" would be fine, but claims such as "our cable improves bass" or "cryogenics improves transient response" would require supporting evidence.

Hopefully, the end result will enable a review board to address issues in a similar manner to this: https://www.asa.org.uk/rulings/the-chord-company-ltd-a14-274211.html#.VLaZ1UyCOrU

 

[TDinCali]

To me discussing cables as it relates to the Utopia is completely on topic and should be discussed here. Discussing whether cables make or don’t make a difference is a different topic and should go somewhere else.

 

[up late]

^agreed that discussing cable options for the utopia is not off-topic. debating whether or not those cable options affect or change the sound of the utopia is off-topic.

 

[up late]

sigh…. It seemed like such a reasonable request…

i hear you but as it is unlikely to happen, i just skip those posts

 

[thecrow]

^agreed that discussing cable options for the utopia is not off-topic. debating whether or not those cable options affect or change the sound of the utopia is off-topic.

I’d agree with your post (as i guess many others would too).

i know you didn’t raise it and i know i have not read all of the 15,387 posts in this thread and i’m probably mistaken but i haven't read anyone saying "take the cable talk somewhere else" if/when someone else has expressed their beliefs that cables don’t make a difference.

personally i enjoy my nordost heimdall 2 cable with my Utopia.

having said that, i’ll leave the cable discussion there

 

[Pastwa]

Hopefully, the end result will enable a review board to address issues in a similar manner to this

It would be great if consistently implemented by law and would bring down the whole audio review industry as I haven't seen a single review that complies with the requirements (pure facts/measurements when describing the sound improvements).

 

[iamoneagain]

The other thing is this headphone has almost been out for 5 years. Not too much more to talk about other than different amp, dac parings and cables. No one is saying anyone has to swap out the stock cable. It’s just discussing the opinions of those who have. Anyone can take their opinion as just that. if you want to talk the science behind cables, there are the science, non opinion threads just for that.

Not sure if makes sense for every headphone to have their own separate cable thread as well. But there are separate threads just for specific cables, so people can further discuss there. Same as there are specific threads for amps and dacs.

 

[teknorob23]

For me silver OCC cables are best with Utopia. Lazuli maybe great with them too but they are garden horse.

A big +1 for UPOCC silver as long as it 22awg or heavier per core. IMO it’s the best conductor headphone cables full stop, super dynamic, resolving, textured, smooth with a tiny bit of warmth, perfect match for utopia, stellia, Susvara, etc