[donlin]

You're that guy. lol, ok

Yea, that guy.

 

[Wildcatsare1]

Why would I even post about them if I had not? That's the 'norm' around here I guess.

See my review of them here:

Well then my apologies, I don’t agree with your summation, but in the end preference is subjective. No headphone will ever compete with a solid two channel system. I’d be interested in hearing how many hours you had on the Clear? Now I’ll have too watch your video now

 

[SaddleSC]

That’s the problem with the HD800. The soundstage is artificially wide and pulls everything too far apart with coherence lost. Wider doesn’t always mean better. Soundstage should serve the music not the other way around.

I agree 100%...well said!

 

[Wildcatsare1]

Why would I even post about them if I had not? That's the 'norm' around here I guess.

See my review of them here:

Very nice review, I was wondering which songs were you using when you heard issues in the treble? I did not your reference to Metalica, I’ll listen as soon as I can.

 

[Bern2]

Why would I even post about them if I had not? That's the 'norm' around here I guess.

See my review of them here:

Thanks Mediahound....excellent review IMO.

Bern

 

[S-O8]

Not quite as wide, close, however Utopias themselves are not that wide a soundstage at least when comparing to HD800.

Yep, owning both I totally agree.

 

[Mediahound]

Very nice review, I was wondering which songs were you using when you heard issues in the treble? I did not your reference to Metalica, I’ll listen as soon as I can.

Thanks! Try a song like this one, which has a lot of bass, but also vocals and strong highs such as bells:

Thanks Mediahound....excellent review IMO.

Thanks!

 

[Paulo Abreu]

Thanks! Try a song like this one, which has a lot of bass, but also vocals and strong highs such as bells:






Thanks!

Hey @Mediahound you have good taste! Dead can dance, I have ALL their discography

 

[Wildcatsare1]

Thanks! Try a song like this one, which has a lot of bass, but also vocals and strong highs such as bells:






Thanks!

Thank you, I’ll give this a listen!

 

[givemetacos]

So Massdrop Focal Elex just dropped down to $699 along with faster ship date of February 19th. Interestingly enough, Will from Massdrop responded to questions in the discussions and is insinuating,without explicitly saying, that the Elex is basically just a Clear.:

"Hey BigGreg,

Thanks for summarizing a couple of the main questions from the thread. I figured people would look at the measurements on the page and that would answer most of the Elex vs Clear vs Elear questions but I'm glad to provide an accompanying explanation.

Let's examine the similarities and differences between the Elear and the Clear.

They use the same housing, they use the same driver diaphragm material (an aluminum/magnesium alloy), and the same driver architecture (put a clear driver next to an elear driver, there's no visible difference).

They use different earpads and headband pad (perforated micro fiber on the clear vs solid micro fiber on the Elear), the drivers have different impedance (it's the same magnet in the Elear and the Clear, but they charge the magnet differently resulting in 55ohm impedance compared to the Elear's 80ohm), they use different cables, and the Clear includes a case where the Elear doesn't.

Given that context, here are two statements which are both true.

The Elex is a Clear with 25 ohm higher impedance, no case, no 1/8" cable, and a blacked out colorway for $700 (vs Clear MSRP of $1500).

The Elex is an Elear with perforated earpads and headband, a much lighter 1/4" cable, an additional 4-pin XLR cable, and a blacked out colorway for $700 (vs Elear MSRP of $1000).

Overall, the Elex is much closer to the Clear than the Elear, but which sounds closer? The Elear and the Elex, or the Clear and the Elex? Take a look at the FR graph attached to this post comparing the Elex and the Clear.

The widest delta on that graph is ~2.5db, very close to the margin of error for measurements due to positioning differences on the coupler and environmental factors from measurement to measurement (we have the same GRAS 45CA as Jude at our office, it's easy for a couple mm difference in position to show ~1-2db differences, or shift things forward or back by ~300hz)
Now take a look at the THD of the Elex vs Clear:

This one looks a little more different, that's the impedance change manifesting, but note the widest delta is still roughly a tenth of a percent. In relative terms, that's about 10% higher.

At this point, it should be pretty clear what I'm alluding to and a critical thinker might ask "If it's closer to the Clear than the Elear, why'd you describe it as a refinement of the Elear rather than a refinement of the Clear?"

Same reason I'm not helping all the Europeans in this thread by providing a recommended forwarding service but we're not removing recommendations from other members: Business relationships are complicated. Do you think it's easier to convince a company to present a product as a revision of their newest, most well regarded product, for ~54% less than retail price, or a revision of their oldest, least well regarded product, for ~20% less than retail price?

I'm sorry I have to phrase all of this in rhetorical questions and alluding language, but business relationships are complicated, and I may have to take down this post anyway depending who calls who over the next couple days.

As always, thanks for your interest and questions, even if I have to answer them in a roundabout way."

 

[Rowethren]

If I am honest what I get from this is that Focal are just being a pain in the arse for no real reason... Making something that is a cheaper and a very similar headphone to the Clear but then only having limited areas of sale, anyone think of any real reason they would stipulate that? Just USA I would sort of understand as it is Massdrop but Australia and Taiwan as well? I mean I wasn't going to get either anyway but that kind of behaviour is the kind of thing that puts me off doing business with a company.

 

[Wildcatsare1]

I’m sorry, but why would Focal choose to undercut a newly launched product, “with essentially the same thing for $700 less,” I’m calling B.S..

 

[Wildcatsare1]

If I am honest what I get from this is that Focal are just being a pain in the arse for no real reason... Making something that is a cheaper and a very similar headphone to the Clear but then only having limited areas of sale, anyone think of any real reason they would stipulate that? Just USA I would sort of understand as it is Massdrop but Australia and Taiwan as well? I mean I wasn't going to get either anyway but that kind of behaviour is the kind of thing that puts me off doing business with a company.

You aren’t missing a thing, I’d be surprised if Focal ever does another Massdrop, this stinks to high Heaven (and I’m not talking about Focal).

 

[SomeGuyDude]

I’m sorry, but why would Focal choose to undercut a newly launched product, “with essentially the same thing for $700 less,” I’m calling B.S..

I concur. I don't buy into the Massdrop crap. It makes zero sense that they'd launch a new product and then immediately offer the same thing for half the price. That goes for every Massdrop x (Whoever) that gets launched.

 

[donlin]

I’m sorry, but why would Focal choose to undercut a newly launched product, “with essentially the same thing for $700 less,” I’m calling B.S..

I agree, that explanation has so much vagary and double speak that it sounds like it was written by a politician.