[TSAVJason]

I’m very impressed by you guys today. No offense but sometimes it’s like some of you step into a hole hoping it’s not a hole but it is. Today you guys are on it!

 

[Mediahound]

So Massdrop Focal Elex just dropped down to $699 along with faster ship date of February 19th. Interestingly enough, Will from Massdrop responded to questions in the discussions and is insinuating,without explicitly saying, that the Elex is basically just a Clear.:

"Hey BigGreg,

Thanks for summarizing a couple of the main questions from the thread. I figured people would look at the measurements on the page and that would answer most of the Elex vs Clear vs Elear questions but I'm glad to provide an accompanying explanation.

Let's examine the similarities and differences between the Elear and the Clear.

They use the same housing, they use the same driver diaphragm material (an aluminum/magnesium alloy), and the same driver architecture (put a clear driver next to an elear driver, there's no visible difference).

They use different earpads and headband pad (perforated micro fiber on the clear vs solid micro fiber on the Elear), the drivers have different impedance (it's the same magnet in the Elear and the Clear, but they charge the magnet differently resulting in 55ohm impedance compared to the Elear's 80ohm), they use different cables, and the Clear includes a case where the Elear doesn't.

Given that context, here are two statements which are both true.

The Elex is a Clear with 25 ohm higher impedance, no case, no 1/8" cable, and a blacked out colorway for $700 (vs Clear MSRP of $1500).

The Elex is an Elear with perforated earpads and headband, a much lighter 1/4" cable, an additional 4-pin XLR cable, and a blacked out colorway for $700 (vs Elear MSRP of $1000).

Overall, the Elex is much closer to the Clear than the Elear, but which sounds closer? The Elear and the Elex, or the Clear and the Elex? Take a look at the FR graph attached to this post comparing the Elex and the Clear.

The widest delta on that graph is ~2.5db, very close to the margin of error for measurements due to positioning differences on the coupler and environmental factors from measurement to measurement (we have the same GRAS 45CA as Jude at our office, it's easy for a couple mm difference in position to show ~1-2db differences, or shift things forward or back by ~300hz)
Now take a look at the THD of the Elex vs Clear:

This one looks a little more different, that's the impedance change manifesting, but note the widest delta is still roughly a tenth of a percent. In relative terms, that's about 10% higher.

At this point, it should be pretty clear what I'm alluding to and a critical thinker might ask "If it's closer to the Clear than the Elear, why'd you describe it as a refinement of the Elear rather than a refinement of the Clear?"

Same reason I'm not helping all the Europeans in this thread by providing a recommended forwarding service but we're not removing recommendations from other members: Business relationships are complicated. Do you think it's easier to convince a company to present a product as a revision of their newest, most well regarded product, for ~54% less than retail price, or a revision of their oldest, least well regarded product, for ~20% less than retail price?

I'm sorry I have to phrase all of this in rhetorical questions and alluding language, but business relationships are complicated, and I may have to take down this post anyway depending who calls who over the next couple days.

As always, thanks for your interest and questions, even if I have to answer them in a roundabout way."

They have different drivers. The Clear has a copper voice coil. The Elex is actually more like the Elear with aluminum voice coil.

The Elex is just Focal's way of offloading surplus Elear drivers as they will likely discontinue the Elear.

 

[SomeGuyDude]

Unfortunately, the more i read, the more it does seem like the Clear will not be replacing my LCD-X. I'll still give them an audition, but I'm not feeling the descriptions I'm seein'.

 

[MAV15]

Has anyone tried the Focal Clear with the Schiit Jotunheim? Are they a good match?

 

[cskippy]

Narrow sound stage of Clear with very upfront/no sound stage depth of the Jot probably won't mix well. I'm not saying there won't be synergy but there are probably better options like Lyr 2 to tame the possible slight brightness of the Clear depending on personal preferences.

This is more or less conjecture at this point as I only had about 10 minutes head time with the Clear so far. I'll have a demo unit in about a week.

 

[bgbkt]

So Massdrop Focal Elex just dropped down to $699 along with faster ship date of February 19th.

Ship date went back to April 30.

 

[SomeGuyDude]

Ship date went back to April 30.

Massdrop: For when you want to save money but also wait so long for it to ship you forgot you bought it.

 

[Ojisan]

Has anyone tried the Focal Clear with the Schiit Jotunheim? Are they a good match?

See my series of comments here using Jot. I thought it sounded great. Just keep in mind that I don't come from bass-heavy background.
https://head-fi.org/threads/focal-clear-headphones.861727/page-63#post-13904828

 

[Beagle]

Massdrop: For when you want to save money but also wait so long for it to ship you forgot you bought it.

They are making Kickstarter seem like the transporter room on the Starship Enterprise.

 

[SomeGuyDude]

They are making Kickstarter seem like the transporter room on the Starship Enterprise.

Seriously. At least with KS it's a startup company building everything new. Massdrop versions of things, ostensibly, are mostly the same products that these big companies are already making.

 

[catscratch]

Got my Clears today. Preliminary impressions follow. Note that these are brand new, any break-in magic hasn't happened yet, the pixies haven't yet shown up with their magic wands, and I haven't sacrificed virgins or goats on the altar, though come to think of it, I do need to hose off my porch.

1) These look great. They feel like real luxury headphones. If you want to impress others with your luxury headphones at yoga classes or over chai lattes, then these are the ticket. If on the other hand you think the SR-Lambda looks great, then these will feel a bit tacky and overwrought. But then again, if you like the SR-Lambda you probably have a beard, therefore, according to Jeremy Clarkson anyway, anything you think about style is irrelevant.

Spoiler

I resemble this remark.

2) They are heavy. Focal needs to keep in mind that humans need to wear these on their heads, and not just stare at them in their shop window.

3) They are reasonably comfortable. The pads are good but could be a bit bigger. The fit is damn near perfect. The headband, however, is the weak spot. If you look at the HD650, you'll see that the top of the headband has a cutout in it. That is there to make sure the weight is distributed more along the sides of the head. Focal seems to not know this, and the weight is exactly at the top of the head, and there is more of it. This could be an issue going forward. I had the same problem with Beyers, too.

4) The accessories are great. The carrying case is just the ticket, and you get 3 cables, though they're a bit stiff.

5) They sound good. Not sure how good yet, exactly, I need more time. They're very neutral up to about 3.5khz. Then there is a small dip, and after 6khz things get spiky. However, overall, they don't sound bright. Bass extends all the way down, and generally speaking, they just sound right. Comparisons to Sennheisers (6X0) aren't too far off base.

Spoiler

Comparisons to Sennheisers are also forthcoming

6) They are detailed. They very nearly keep up with electrostatics. I did some comparisons against the Stax L700, and at times I felt the Focals were resolving more, while at other times I felt the Stax were resolving more. Overall, I think the Staxes sound a bit softer, but do seem to resolve things better. Music sounds more three-dimensional and holographic on the Stax, instruments sound more distinct from one another, and the tonal background is blacker. However on the Focals the bass is more resolved, I could hear the fundamentals more clearly, and everything is a bit more immediate and less soft. Weirdly, the Stax is more dynamic. I don't know how this happened, but I'm guessing the SRM-717 I'm using with it helps, and the Schiit Lyr 2 I'm using with the Focals isn't doing them any favors. With the stock tubes in the Lyr I really didn't like the sound, but switching them out for the LISST tube-analogue-weird-pipe-looking-thingies cleared the sound up a lot. I do feel like a better amp will even the playing field more. Everything was sourced from the Ayre QB-9 DSD.

Spoiler

Of course, the L700 is not the most resolving electrostat, though it's not that far off the mark. The Focals did well, honestly. I expected them to get beat up, and they didn't. However I did enjoy the Stax more... #electroweirdo

7) They're a bit grainy, but it's not that bad. Weirdos who think real life music has grain will find these right up their alley, but me, I find 'stats to be more lifelike in that department. Though I have to admit, live music and fermented grain go quite well together. Maybe barley, wheat, or even some rye...

So far, I like what I'm hearing, but I'm not 100% sure I will keep these. They're great, but are they $1500 great? I will listen more and report back once they're broken in, the pixies are free of dust, and my neighbor has less goats.

P.S. Anybody know when the pads will become available? Has anybody who has both the Elears and the Clears tried the Elears with Clear pads? Do they sound similar to the Clears then?

 

[Ojisan]

Nice impressions @catscratch

I think you are the first one beside myself who hears a dip in the presence region, as far as I can recall. Looking forward to further impressions!

 

[joseph69]

I received both the Utopia/Clear this evening. I've been listening to the Utopia for the past 3-1/2hrs. Switched to the Clear about a 1/2hr ago (balanced).
I know the Utopia are burned-in, but I think the Clear are brand new, not sure, but I'll find out tomorrow. I definitely prefer the tone of the Clear over the Utopia. Again, that's with only listening to them for a 1/2hr, so these are my immediate impressions of the Clear. As for the Utopia, as I've mentioned a year or so ago when I borrowed them, again, their tone just isn't for me. I find the Clear to be much more musically involving too me.

 

[TSAVJason]

Got my Clears today. Preliminary impressions follow. Note that these are brand new, any break-in magic hasn't happened yet, the pixies haven't yet shown up with their magic wands, and I haven't sacrificed virgins or goats on the altar, though come to think of it, I do need to hose off my porch.

1) These look great. They feel like real luxury headphones. If you want to impress others with your luxury headphones at yoga classes or over chai lattes, then these are the ticket. If on the other hand you think the SR-Lambda looks great, then these will feel a bit tacky and overwrought. But then again, if you like the SR-Lambda you probably have a beard, therefore, according to Jeremy Clarkson anyway, anything you think about style is irrelevant.

Spoiler

I resemble this remark.

2) They are heavy. Focal needs to keep in mind that humans need to wear these on their heads, and not just stare at them in their shop window.

3) They are reasonably comfortable. The pads are good but could be a bit bigger. The fit is damn near perfect. The headband, however, is the weak spot. If you look at the HD650, you'll see that the top of the headband has a cutout in it. That is there to make sure the weight is distributed more along the sides of the head. Focal seems to not know this, and the weight is exactly at the top of the head, and there is more of it. This could be an issue going forward. I had the same problem with Beyers, too.

4) The accessories are great. The carrying case is just the ticket, and you get 3 cables, though they're a bit stiff.

5) They sound good. Not sure how good yet, exactly, I need more time. They're very neutral up to about 3.5khz. Then there is a small dip, and after 6khz things get spiky. However, overall, they don't sound bright. Bass extends all the way down, and generally speaking, they just sound right. Comparisons to Sennheisers (6X0) aren't too far off base.

Spoiler

Comparisons to Sennheisers are also forthcoming

6) They are detailed. They very nearly keep up with electrostatics. I did some comparisons against the Stax L700, and at times I felt the Focals were resolving more, while at other times I felt the Stax were resolving more. Overall, I think the Staxes sound a bit softer, but do seem to resolve things better. Music sounds more three-dimensional and holographic on the Stax, instruments sound more distinct from one another, and the tonal background is blacker. However on the Focals the bass is more resolved, I could hear the fundamentals more clearly, and everything is a bit more immediate and less soft. Weirdly, the Stax is more dynamic. I don't know how this happened, but I'm guessing the SRM-717 I'm using with it helps, and the Schiit Lyr 2 I'm using with the Focals isn't doing them any favors. With the stock tubes in the Lyr I really didn't like the sound, but switching them out for the LISST tube-analogue-weird-pipe-looking-thingies cleared the sound up a lot. I do feel like a better amp will even the playing field more. Everything was sourced from the Ayre QB-9 DSD.

Spoiler

Of course, the L700 is not the most resolving electrostat, though it's not that far off the mark. The Focals did well, honestly. I expected them to get beat up, and they didn't. However I did enjoy the Stax more... #electroweirdo

7) They're a bit grainy, but it's not that bad. Weirdos who think real life music has grain will find these right up their alley, but me, I find 'stats to be more lifelike in that department. Though I have to admit, live music and fermented grain go quite well together. Maybe barley, wheat, or even some rye...

So far, I like what I'm hearing, but I'm not 100% sure I will keep these. They're great, but are they $1500 great? I will listen more and report back once they're broken in, the pixies are free of dust, and my neighbor has less goats.

P.S. Anybody know when the pads will become available? Has anybody who has both the Elears and the Clears tried the Elears with Clear pads? Do they sound similar to the Clears then?

Quite a few of us have tried that at TSAV. My impression or take away was when you put the Clear pads on the Elear it sounds like an Elear with less bass quantity of course in my opinion. Because of that it did make the mids seem lifted but the essence of the Elear remains. Maybe @TSAVAlan and the others that have tried it our showroom can give you their thoughts on that topic.

 

[catscratch]

Cheers Jason. Do you know anything about when pads will be available? If I were to need new pads before they become available, do I send my headphones back in to the vendor to have them replaced? Or Focal? How long do focal pads last, generally? I understand that all of these headphones are new and you might not have that info.

I think you are the first one beside myself who hears a dip in the presence region, as far as I can recall.

I mainly heard it listening to a sine sweep. Generally that's where my comments on the frequency response come from. At the same time, not everything you hear in a sine sweep translates into actual music. I'll need to spend more time with these, really.