[proedros]

ever since i got my first CIEM back in 2016 , it was game over

Unis no more.

 

[efftee]

If only that was an option where I live... I don't think we even have 3D scans here, only 3D scans of actual impressions (if we're lucky). At this stage it's a bit too much of a gamble, but thankfully my ears are happy to accommodate most universals I've tried so far, only the ones with longer nozzles being an issue.

And there is the variable of tips that Customs eliminate, making the sound as pure to the intent of the IEM designer/engineer as it gets. Perhaps you can get molds done in Naboo heh...

 

[gLer]

And there is the variable of tips that Customs eliminate, making the sound as pure to the intent of the IEM designer/engineer as it gets. Perhaps you can get molds done in Naboo heh...

The flip side to that is that I like how I can shape the sound to my liking with tips. You can get the exact sound the designer intended (with stock tips) or mix to up for sound and comfort with third-party tips. Resale is also much higher with unis, and almost non-existent with CIEMs. So there's pros and cons to both. I think the only time I'll consider a CIEM for a TOTL IEM is if it's going to be a CIEM for life.

 

[efftee]

The flip side to that is that I like how I can shape the sound to my liking with tips. You can get the exact sound the designer intended (with stock tips) or mix to up for sound and comfort with third-party tips. Resale is also much higher with unis, and almost non-existent with CIEMs. So there's pros and cons to both. I think the only time I'll consider a CIEM for a TOTL IEM is if it's going to be a CIEM for life.

No doubt. And I think it is, ultimately, the resellability of Universals that's making them infinitely more popular. I lamented elsewhere how this trend is affording brands the luxury of foregoing the Custom market completely. So you needn't be rushed into considering a CIEM any time soon with the EVOs, PHonixes and EXTs all launching without Custom options anyway.

 

[proedros]

i have 2 customs , that i have been using for 4-5 years now

their resale is low sure but i don't think a 5 year old uni would fetch a huge price , also.

so the resale part is valid if we are talking about selling something that's 3-12 months old

my advice , try something in uni before going custom , and only go custom if you know this will be in your ears for the next 2-3 years (which is an eternity for most 'i wanna try the new toy' syndrome-affected people in here)

me , it's only customs from now on - and i also look iems that come in custom version.

 

[Sound Eq]

Any interest for the Fiio M17? Saw some quick updates from their co-founder James.

https://m.weibo.cn/2388602863/4672933391765530

I will give a quick summary.

• ETA: October of this year.
• Price: TBD, but will be around 10000-15000 RMB (roughly between $1500 and $2300).
• Headphone output: 2.5, 3.5, 4.4, 6.3. LO: 3.5, 4.4.
• Intended use case: desk side and bed side listening device, transportable use.
• Intended audience: hardcore hifi users; users who do iems and/or headphones.

He stated that the design goal of M17 is to fit desktop-class THX788 circuit into a dap. Meanwhile, they completely upgrade the UI/OS platform.

M17 has been much delayed due to the shortage of AKM4499. Fiio therefore decides to completely change to dual ESS9038 Pro in M17.




Ports of M17




Size comparison of M11 plus and M17.

design wise and look wise it is not to my taste, this brushed metal and volume wheel and the whole design looks cheap, as for sound well who knows could be a great player

 

[fuhransahis]

design wise and look wise it is not to my taste, this brushed metal and volume wheel and the whole design looks cheap, as for sound well who knows could be a great player

I really think Fiio goes for a deliberately cheap-looking brand to go with their pricing model and target audience.

Which they really shouldn't do from a strategic perspective as it often times comes off as too cheap and corny, but oh well!

 

[bluestorm1992]

design wise and look wise it is not to my taste, this brushed metal and volume wheel and the whole design looks cheap, as for sound well who knows could be a great player

Funny enough, the reason why M17 got leaked so earlier last year was because it made the final list to the IF World Design Award and therefore needed to be disclosed.

I guess different people have different opinions about this design.

https://ifworlddesignguide.com/entry/308699-fiio-m17

 

[fuhransahis]

Funny enough, the reason why M17 got leaked so earlier last year was because it made the final list to the IF World Design Award and therefore needed to be disclosed.

I guess different people have different opinions about this design.

https://ifworlddesignguide.com/entry/308699-fiio-m17

Interesting!

From the description though it seems more about having a robust product feature set in a compact package vs the design's look and feel.

Can't argue on the former

I don't think it's a bad design, just targeted for a rugged/gamer look vs more high end, sleek and premium.

 

[bluestorm1992]

Interesting!

From the description though it seems more about having a robust product feature set in a compact package vs the design's look and feel.

Can't argue on the former

I don't think it's a bad design, just targeted for a rugged/gamer look vs more high end, sleek and premium.

Indeed. I think design is a broad concept and the product features/usability are definitely part of it.

 

[Deezel177]

Question…

I have avoided custom IEM’s ever since an ear doctor / hearing aid specialist informed me that my ear canals were nearly identical to most universal hearing devices and or in ear monitors. This seemed credible since he told me this rather than taking my impressions, charging me nearly $100 per ear. Fast forward to a recent visit to Empire Ears where out of curiosity I asked Dean Vang to see for himself. Turns out the previous “specialist” was incorrect and Dean took my impressions on the spot and showed me.

So after receiving my first custom pair today, they fit flawlessly. I mean they seal better than universals and I’m not even getting driver flex. In addition I have had them in for hours without discomfort. I have often seen people needing multiple refits and other issues with customs. So my question is to those with current and prior issues… did you get impressions taken by who was crafting your customs or a third party? Has anyone had custom impressions taken by the company molding their customs and had issues?

Based on what I've observed, those horror stories of ill-fitting customs are of the vast minority, and - more importantly - they mostly come from the past. I think they held a lot more weight back when CIEM brands were just starting out and getting their methods down, and they've seemed to just reverberated or passed on to today. There's a reason these sorts of cautionary tales typically begin with "I've heard some stories," rather than "I've heard from a friend" or "I've experienced it myself."

I've had impressions taken by people of varying experience levels. I've had moulds made by specialists from the brands themselves, audiologists who've made full ear impressions (which is what's required for customs) and audiologists who've only taken partial ear impressions (commonly for hearing aids). For me, I think it's possible to get perfectly-made impressions from all of them. Being able to get it right isn't what separates them; it's whether or not they're able to tell when they've got it wrong. The brand specialist or the more experienced audiologist will be able to tell when a mould isn't perfect or usable, while the less-experienced audiologist won't.

That's when guidelines like the PDFs you can download from 64 Audio or EE's website, for example, really come in handy. They come with instructions of how deep the dam (the piece of foam preventing the silicone from hitting your eardrum) has to go, how much of the concha to capture, etc. And, they have images of viable impressions there as well. I'd also recommend studying those pictures (or your own moulds, wherever possible) yourselves, so you can help guide your audiologist if they aren't well-versed. That's what I had to do with my audiologist here in Jakarta. I had to reject a lot of her first attempts 'til I got the shape and coverage I wanted, but we eventually reached a stage where the moulds were as good as those taken by the pros. She got better and quicker the more we made as well, so the process is quite seamless now.

So, if you're someone who's green when it comes to customs, I'd always recommend sticking to at least an audiologist who's on the brand's referral list (usually on their website). But, if you know what a proper mould looks like, then I'd say it's very much possible to guide any competent audiologist into getting the perfect impression.

If only that was an option where I live... I don't think we even have 3D scans here, only 3D scans of actual impressions (if we're lucky). At this stage it's a bit too much of a gamble, but thankfully my ears are happy to accommodate most universals I've tried so far, only the ones with longer nozzles being an issue.

In most cases, the 3D scans a lot of people are talking about are 3D scans of actual impressions. I don't know anyone who's done the 3D-scanning, laser-gun procedure apart from a few select Ultimate Ears customers. I had my scans made by Piotr at Custom Art. I doubt he'll scan them if you're not ordering a CA custom, though.

Funny enough, the reason why M17 got leaked so earlier last year was because it made the final list to the IF World Design Award and therefore needed to be disclosed.

I guess different people have different opinions about this design.

https://ifworlddesignguide.com/entry/308699-fiio-m17

I wouldn't put a lot of faith into the IF World Design Guide if I were you. Steve over at Gamers Nexus looked into their awardee-selection procedure on an MSI case review some time ago, and let's say their practices are... questionable at best.

 

[CL14715]

Based on what I've observed, those horror stories of ill-fitting customs are of the vast minority, and - more importantly - they mostly come from the past. I think they held a lot more weight back when CIEM brands were just starting out and getting their methods down, and they've seemed to just reverberated or passed on to today. There's a reason these sorts of cautionary tales typically begin with "I've heard some stories," rather than "I've heard from a friend" or "I've experienced it myself."

I've had impressions taken by people of varying experience levels. I've had moulds made by specialists from the brands themselves, audiologists who've made full ear impressions (which is what's required for customs) and audiologists who've only taken partial ear impressions (commonly for hearing aids). For me, I think it's possible to get perfectly-made impressions from all of them. Being able to get it right isn't what separates them; it's whether or not they're able to tell when they've got it wrong. The brand specialist or the more experienced audiologist will be able to tell when a mould isn't perfect or usable, while the less-experienced audiologist won't.

That's when guidelines like the PDFs you can download from 64 Audio or EE's website, for example, really come in handy. They come with instructions of how deep the dam (the piece of foam preventing the silicone from hitting your eardrum) has to go, how much of the concha to capture, etc. And, they have images of viable impressions there as well. I'd also recommend studying those pictures (or your own moulds, wherever possible) yourselves, so you can help guide your audiologist if they aren't well-versed. That's what I had to do with my audiologist here in Jakarta. I had to reject a lot of her first attempts 'til I got the shape and coverage I wanted, but we eventually reached a stage where the moulds were as good as those taken by the pros. She got better and quicker the more we made as well, so the process is quite seamless now.

So, if you're someone who's green when it comes to customs, I'd always recommend sticking to at least an audiologist who's on the brand's referral list (usually on their website). But, if you know what a proper mould looks like, then I'd say it's very much possible to guide any competent audiologist into getting the perfect impression.


In most cases, the 3D scans a lot of people are talking about are 3D scans of actual impressions. I don't know anyone who's done the 3D-scanning, laser-gun procedure apart from a few select Ultimate Ears customers. I had my scans made by Piotr at Custom Art. I doubt he'll scan them if you're not ordering a CA custom, though.


I wouldn't put a lot of faith into the IF World Design Guide if I were you. Steve over at Gamers Nexus looked into their awardee-selection procedure on an MSI case review some time ago, and let's say their practices are... questionable at best.

Well then I guess Dean Vang got my fit perfect the first try. Glad that’s the mould they’ll be using from now on

 

[Deezel177]

Well then I guess Dean Vang got my fit perfect the first try. Glad that’s the mould they’ll be using from now on

Yeah, when it comes to the seasoned pros, once is usually all it takes. Outside of my aforementioned audiologist (who needed practice), I've very rarely had to repeat an impression ever, and even she can get it within the first try most of the time now. So, again, I really do think those horror stories are more relics of the past.

 

[Liberatus]

Any recs for best sound put if a gym-able IEM? In the lower $100 or so range? I haven't looked at the low end of the market in year so I'm not up to date on what that staple & standout pieces are currently

I've been using my Nios with custom tips so it gives them space from my ears but it just has felt a bit weird as i do more rugged/movement orientated workouts for to risk $1700 IEMs.

New Blon even worth it? A Metal shell would be nice to nice to not worry about breaking though.

 

[efftee]

Yeah, when it comes to the seasoned pros, once is usually all it takes. Outside of my aforementioned audiologist (who needed practice), I've very rarely had to repeat an impression ever, and even she can get it within the first try most of the time now. So, again, I really do think those horror stories are more relics of the past.

You must be the nicest customer she's had, I'd be pissed if I had to sit another 20 drooling mins for a 2nd attempt haha! I now keep (and use) the scans of the mold so I can avoid having to redo molds over and over, though some brands wouldn't accept scans, still insists on molds.