[Brooko]

I agree about Noise, Power & distortion - difference is negligible to notice, but (correct me if I'm wrong as it's from memory) Cross-talk however, if measured at 1K @ -73db will likely go above -50db by 15K, and the worst part is that it's uneven. Capacitance and inductance induced transfer will interfere and create multiple small scattered peaks that mask some auditory ques that otherwise help brain to re-constitute the sound stage. That theory is consistent with what I hear which is the only improvement I notice is in sound stage.
Also I believe that manufacturers are less likely to cut corners designing balanced circuits as they know that loud minority of discerning audiophiles will be using balanced. My Hiby R6 balanced output sounds a lot better than SE but only on resolving IEMs (Sony ier-M9, ibasso it04, FiiO FH7, Fearless S8Pro).
Subtle on Shure846 and Sony Z5. So part of it is of course hype and placebo effect but specifically on Xelento and FH7 with Hiby - difference is not subtle. On Ear-studio es100 it's considerably less noticeable for some reason.
BTW, sony has dsp effect to reduce cross talk, anyone has any experience with that?

I don’t think you understood the point on crosstalk. Above 50db you won’t notice it - you’ll notice degradation in perceived stage as crosstalk lowers below 40 dB. And even if you’re talking 50db ......... at 15kHz - all that is there is very faint harmonics, which majority of people can’t hear anyway. Nothing which will affect perception of stage.

What is the OI difference between SE and Bal on the R6? That may make a frequency change. If there is no freq change - what is your method for testing. How are you volume matching? Is it sighted?

I keep hearing people talk about non-subtle differences, and being associated with the fact the signal is balanced. Science tells us this can’t be the case.

 

[Colors]

My FH7s just arrived. Fresh from the box, with the stock medium balanced tips, after a brief listen - so sackfuls of salt, etc - I gotta say:

HUBBA HUBBA!!!

From packaging to cable to fit to sound, these could be the end-to-end IEMS to end things for me, at least until the next bout of upgradeitis bites.

I was worried about the treble being hot, based on comments here, but not at all - from top to bottom these things smoke. The bass is so defined and tactile, I love it! And the mids are exactly where they need to be, neither recessed for too upfront - and buttery smooth, with the treble shimmering seductively without a trace of sibilance I can detect so far.

Anyway, back to the important job at hand - more listening.....

Pretty much a perfect description. I just got the FH7 and this is how I feel.

Amazing comfort, separation and good isolation. Soundstage is pretty wide too. Only complaint is the layering is not as good as something like the Andromeda or EX1000, but for the price I paid, I’m not complaining. These will be my go to for commutes for awhile. EX1000 or MDR7550 for home listening because those IEMs are like magic-level realism. Also tons of accessories. Love the small nylon pouch and also the leather hard case. Tons of tips and additional filters. Ultra-supple cable. This is not Andromeda or Roxanne (I love these two IEMs) level in terms of SQ but it’s 75% there at half or less the price. But they’re 10000000x more comfortable so it evens it up.

Worth every penny. Good job FiiO.

 

[Owludio]

Corrected reply later. Sorry, late night editing glitch..

 

[Ichos]

@Brooko
Now this can go for ever and I don't want to talk off topic.
I don't have X7ii but I have X5iii and Q5.
Before I test I volume match by ear since I don't have the proper equipment.
Both devices sound a little more full from single ended and a little more lean but with better clarity and separation from the balanced out.
There are not night and day differences but they are still audible.
May it is placebo I don't know but that is what I am hearing and I am very experienced and attentive listener and I don't have to persuade myself for anything as I own the devices and I have all shorts of cables so I can utilize both outputs as I like.
For testing I have used Mee P1 , FH5 , HD58x.
The results are always the same.
FYI I prefer P1 from single ended out and the others from the balanced.

 

[Toom]

I'm always fascinated by the psychology of spending bags of money on cables and 'going balanced' to achieve what you can no doubt get for free with EQ tweaks. And at least with the latter you can eliminate placebo.

But hey, whatever gets you through the night.

 

[scarfacegt]

9

Es100 works great with the galaxy s9 plus. I have both and use them with a variety of headphones.

Does it sound better than the headphone jack?

 

[pstickne]

9


Does it sound better than the headphone jack?

I actually prefer the audio on iPhone 6 SE to the ES100, although that may be biased by my lack of appreciation.. take as you will.

The ES100 offers mobility and "lots of options to play with"; some can make the audio sound 'more good' and some 'less good'. I had to disable the crossfeed entirely as the ES100 implementation makes music sound flat me me. The ES100 looks really good on paper (and feels cheap in hand) and some may benefit more from the hardware EQ. However, the audio output was simply not impressive to me (read: "meh" and "non-engaging") and I noticed no difference between balanced and unbalanced (emphasis added).

I’ve the new HiBy W5 on order, so I can compare to that in a few days (the W5 uses a ES9218P, the ES100 uses AK4375a). My other reference is a Valhalla 2 + blueMe BT DAC (AK4396), which is ‘delicious’ .. and not exactly something one carries around in a pocket

 

[Ichos]

@Toom You have misunderstood.
It's is not something that can be fixed with EQ.
It's different sound sig as designed from the manufacturer.
Single ended sounds different from balanced because it is essentially a different circuit working.
As for cables can be very cheap.
I have terminated the original HD58x cable with 2.5mm plug.
Very easy and cheap.

 

[Indiemaker]

Might there be a 4th July Independence Day sale/discount on FH7 on Amazon?

 

[Brooko]

Before I test I volume match by ear since I don't have the proper equipment.

Thanks - told me all I need (and anyone else who’s reading the thread) to know.

I suggest you always include that statement when making your suggestions about the effects of balanced - then we don’t have to go down a rabbit hole. I also have an X5iii and a Q1ii - there is no difference in either one of those when you volume match properly either.

 

[Brooko]

@Toom You have misunderstood.
It's is not something that can be fixed with EQ.
It's different sound sig as designed from the manufacturer.
Single ended sounds different from balanced because it is essentially a different circuit working.

No it isn’t - it’s the same Dac, there’s just two of them. Can we drop this?

 

[Ichos]

Yeah no problem I don't have to prove anything but it's not the same.
Can't be the same it is simple electronics.
The balanced out is full differential two dacs working for L- L+ R- R+ each phase being amplified.
For the single ended there is a conversion going on.
Now if it sounds different let everyone decide for himself.

 

[maira]

No it isn’t - it’s the same Dac, there’s just two of them. Can we drop this?

It depends, Broko. My Pono Player is Class A/B in SE Mode but Class A in BAL.

 

[Owludio]

@Brooko
I think numbers you refer to, supposed to be negative as I wrote (-50db) meaning minus 50 decibell of cross talk signal to useful signal being 0 (just like signal to noise).
Science is good when you have tools to apply it but sadly, most of graphers use very low resolution graphs under-appreciating amazing resolution of the human hearing. These graphs don't show a whole lot and no wonder that many audiophiles already learned the hard way that while we can use graphs for general reference, that's not enough to get the idea what sound is going to be. And on top of that it's highly subjective. (To me, difference between 4 core and 8 core SPC cable is not subtle and I hear burn in effects in different degree on all IEMs, even Shure and Sony M9 (This one surprised me the most as supposedly "stable Sony BAs")
To be fair, I need to note that until last year I did't even use balanced. In fact I enjoy FiiO BTR1K and BTR3 through 2.5F to 3.5M adapter just as much as balanced Ear-studio es100. But Hiby R6 Just has better balanced 2.5 than SE 3.5 out.
Sorry for being ambiguous, as I said difference is substantially less between BT outs but could it be due to lower resolution of BT? I don't know.
It's very interesting issue you raised, worthy of digging deeper.

 

[FactoryStock]

@Brooko
I think numbers you refer to, supposed to be negative as I wrote (-50db) meaning minus 50 decibell of cross talk signal to useful signal being 0 (just like signal to noise).
Science is good when you have tools to apply it but sadly, most of graphers use very low resolution graphs under-appreciating amazing resolution of the human hearing. These graphs don't show a whole lot and no wonder that many audiophiles already learned the hard way that while we can use graphs for general reference, that's not enough to get the idea what sound is going to be. And on top of that it's highly subjective. (To me, difference between 4 core and 8 core SPC cable is not subtle and I hear burn in effects in different degree on all IEMs, even Shure and Sony M9 (This one surprised me the most as supposedly "stable Sony BAs")
To be fair, I need to note that until last year I did't even use balanced. In fact I enjoy FiiO BTR1K and BTR3 through 2.5F to 3.5M adapter just as much as balanced Ear-studio es100. But Hiby R6 Just has better balanced 2.5 than SE 3.5 out.
Sorry for being ambiguous, as I said difference is substantially less between BT outs but could it be due to lower resolution of BT? I don't know.
It's very interesting issue you raised, worthy of digging deeper.

Unfortunately, that's the occupational hazard of being born as analogue life-froms. As long as these machines and graphs cannot even be relied upon to tell us the relative distance and angles of the instruments in our music, we humans have to do everything ourselves.