[FiiO]

yesterday i did the updates of the BTR15 and the BTA30pro for both including the xmos updates again. This time the BTR15 not via OTA but both with the downloaded files connected to my pc. Listening 5 hours today and had only one reboot so far. dont know if its random tho

Dear friend,

Thanks for the kind feedback. We have report to the quality engineer for check. But we fail to reproduce the same problem currently. So it may still take us some time for locating the issue.

Best regards

 

[FiiO]

I updated on the newest firmware 4 days ago and to actual xmos 3 days ago. No reboots with the new versions, even no reboots with the older version of the firmware / xmos. The only problem is the gain level that needs to be set everytime after a boot. If I set it to "L", it doesn't save that setting. But it shows "L" in the status bar, but it's always set to high after a new start.

And think about the people wearing googles. The "L" and "H" in the status bar is not good readble. Maybe you can change the thickness of the characters to 2px?

Made only OTA updates.

Dear friend,

I failed to reproduce this issue. The gain option in the menu stay in L after restarting still.

Best regards

 

[OceanOfLight]

Dear friend,

I failed to reproduce this issue. The gain option in the menu stay in L after restarting still.

Best regards

Sorry if I intrude, but I got the same problem.

I think you misunderstood the issue.

The real problem is that to actually make the device enter Low Gain mode, after every reboots you have to go under the Gain menu, and now there are two possibilities:

1. if you were using High Gain mode, you only need to switch to Low Gain mode.

2. if you were already using Low Gain Mode in order to make the device effectively go in Low Gain, you need to switch from Low Gain to High Gain to Low Gain again (as I show in the attached video).

So, to be clear from the start, the real problem is that, if you shut off the device while in Low Gain, on reboot the device will operate automatically in High Gain without actually telling you that. (It will in fact show the "L" on the display and Low Gain in the submenu, but as I said, it will effectively operate in High Gain).

So, this is not a problem for people who use High Gain only, but it is a really big one for people who use Low Gain instead, cause with low impedance IEMs after every reboot (when I forgot to fix the problem with the abovementioned procedure) the volume will be so loud that it could potentially damages the IEMs (and me).

So, to reproduce the issue (for your engineers) let's go by steps:

- The BTR15 is turned off and not connected with USB to the pc.
- Attach an IEM and turn on the BTR15.
- Connect the BTR15 to pc via usb C.
- Go under the GAIN submenu and:
1. if you were using High Gain mode, switch to Low Gain mode.
2. If you were using Low Gain mode, switch from Low Gain to High Gain to Low Gain again.
(you can check that the change is effectively happening because you will hear a popping sound in the IEM when switching from one mode to another, if you are not hearing it, it's not really switching).
- Now the device is finally set to Low Gain.
- Listen to a song with at a volume you think is right.
- Reboot the device and wait for 5 seconds.
- Now the device will operate in High Gain again (despite showing the L on the screen), you can confirm this by listening the same song (at the same volume). Now the song will be way louder.

This clearly indicates that the device reset itself to High Gain (on its own) after every reboot. To have another confirmation of this, go now to the GAIN submenu and switch from Low Gain to High Gain. Now listen to the same song again. There will be no audible change in volume (it will still be as loud as before), because the device was already functioning in High Gain mode before you actually switched to it.

The heart of the matter is that the BTR15 will set itself on High Gain mode after every reboot. The only way to set the device to Low Gain is:
1. if you are using High Gain mode, switch to Low Gain mode.
2. If you are using Low Gain mode, switch from Low Gain to High Gain to Low Gain again.

This is the only way to set the device effectively to Low Gain, but as for now, this procedure needs to be repeated every time the BTR15 is rebooted.

I really think this problem affect every single BTR15 unit, but only the people that use the device in Low Gain mode are able to realize that.

Now, if you can't replicate the issue and fix it, I give up.

And I'm now realizing I ended up writing a manual on this simple issue. You should consider gifting me a KA17 for the efforts.

 

[XaFFi]

Sorry if I intrude, but I got the same problem.

I think you misunderstood the issue.

The real problem is that to actually make the device enter Low Gain mode, after every reboots you have to go under the Gain menu, and now there are two possibilities:

1. if you were using High Gain mode, you only need to switch to Low Gain mode.

2. if you were already using Low Gain Mode in order to make the device effectively go in Low Gain, you need to switch from Low Gain to High Gain to Low Gain again (as I show in the attached video).

So, to be clear from the start, the real problem is that, if you shut off the device while in Low Gain, on reboot the device will operate automatically in High Gain without actually telling you that. (It will in fact show the "L" on the display and Low Gain in the submenu, but as I said, it will effectively operate in High Gain).

So, this is not a problem for people who use High Gain only, but it is a really big one for people who use Low Gain instead, cause with low impedance IEMs after every reboot (when I forgot to fix the problem with the abovementioned procedure) the volume will be so loud that it could potentially damages the IEMs (and me).

So, to reproduce the issue (for your engineers) let's go by steps:

- The BTR15 is turned off and not connected with USB to the pc.
- Attach an IEM and turn on the BTR15.
- Connect the BTR15 to pc via usb C.
- Go under the GAIN submenu and:
1. if you were using High Gain mode, switch to Low Gain mode.
2. If you were using Low Gain mode, switch from Low Gain to High Gain to Low Gain again.
(you can check that the change is effectively happening because you will hear a popping sound in the IEM when switching from one mode to another).
- Now the device is finally set to Low Gain.
- Listen to a song with at a volume you think is right.
- Reboot the device and wait for 5 seconds.
- Now the device will operate in High Gain again (despite showing the L on the screen), you can confirm this by listening the same song (at the same volume). Now the song will be way louder.

This clearly indicates that the device reset itself to High Gain (on its own) after every reboot. To have another confirmation of this, go now to the GAIN submenu and switch from Low Gain to High Gain. Now listen to the same song again. There will be no audible change in volume (it will still be as loud as before), because the device was already functioning in High Gain mode before you actually switched to it.

The heart of the matter is that the BTR15 will set itself on High Gain mode after every reboot. The only way to set the device to Low Gain is:
1. if you are using High Gain mode, switch to Low Gain mode.
2. If you are using Low Gain mode, switch from Low Gain to High Gain to Low Gain again.

This is the only way to set the device effectively to Low Gain, but as for now, this procedure needs to be repeated every time the BTR15 is rebooted.

I really think this problem affect every single BTR15 unit, but only the people that use the device in Low Gain mode are able to realize that.

Now, if you can't replicate the issue and fix it, I give up.

And I'm now realizing I ended up writing a manual on this simple issue. You should consider gifting me a KA17 for the efforts.

That's right friend. It happens to everyone and it is a very serious bug. No one could have explained it better. Greetings!

 

[AudioBomb]

Nice to know that the BTR15 stand its ground against devices that cost 4-5 times its price!

By the way, have you tried setting the filter of the BTR15 on Fast instead of Hybrid? I found out that the difference is noticeable for my ears in many cases.

In my experience when the BTR15 set on Fast it loses a bit of soundstage and "airiness" and, overall, a bit of its "smoothness", in favor of added dynamics and resolution. The fact that this possibility is offered gives the device even more versatility in my opinion! (or maybe I just imagine things, in the audio world you could never know).

Hi,

Yes I did and the fast filter is the one that sounds more energetic, dynamic and vibrant to me. The difference is imediatelly noticeable.

Today I noticed that BTR15 is more energetic, lush, with a more wow effect in certain areas than Antelope Audio Zen GO, but that's normal on a Hi-Fi equipment. Studio gear has to sound as neutral as possible for music production. From a music listening point of view, BTR15 gives you more fun, is somewhat more aggresive and throws everythyng it has into your face (or ears). Which makes it not ideal as an audio interface on the go, as I thought initially. Antelope Audio just launched a mini DAC for music production on the go. His name: ZEO. Worth giving it a ty. It's powered with key components from their studio-tier audio interfaces, like their industry leading 64bit Acoustically Focused Clocking and 130db dynamic range DAC. Naturally this DAC won't sound as Hi-Fi, with lush colours as other DACs, but more studio-oriented sound. Expect superior sonic accuracy, timbre and detail, but things like huge soundstage width, big bass, shouldn't be part of it. Nevertheless they are inviting audiophiles to give it a go. Introductory price is120€

 

[duythanhny]

Dear Fiio,
I wish you could make "fix bitrate LDAC" feature in control app. I want specific 44.1khz 16bit 909kbps but every time reconnect LDAC setting revert to default.

 

[Chris Kaoss]

Beside all reported issues about the device, a big shout-out to @FiiO for contributing so heavily to help out and fix the issues.

It's not that common to have fast responses from the MoT.

Thanks a lot for all the advices helping people out.

 

[rlw6534]

Dear Fiio,
I wish you could make "fix bitrate LDAC" feature in control app. I want specific 44.1khz 16bit 909kbps but every time reconnect LDAC setting revert to default.

You may already know this but the "Bluetooth Codec Changer" app should be able to do this for you.

 

[AudioBomb]

This device is the world's 7th wonder

My Xelentos love Hi Gain for some reason and there's another improvement in sound, even more dynamic and revealing.

This starts to sound very, very close to my Zen GO in terms of fidelity. How is this possible, I don't even wanna know. lol.

 

[OceanOfLight]

This device is the 7th world's wonder

My Xelentos love Hi Gain for some reason and there's another improvement in sound, even more dynamic and revealing.

For curiosity, are you currently using the BTR15 in Hybrid or Fast?

After testing both of them, lately I'm leaning more toward Hybrid, the music feels more organic, it also helps very bright sounding IEMs to not trespass in the harshness territory. Nothing final however, Fast have also many benefits over Hybrid, and I would say it's potentially better technicalities-wise.

Do you think one is objectively better than the other, or would you say they are on the same level but with different strengths?

 

[AudioBomb]

For curiosity, are you currently using the BTR15 in Hybrid or Fast?

After testing both of them, lately I'm leaning more toward Hybrid, the music feels more organic, it also helps very bright sounding IEMs to not trespass in the harshness territory. Nothing final however, Fast have also many benefits over Hybrid, and I would say it's potentially better technicalities-wise.

Do you think one is objectively better than the other, or would you say they are on the same level but with different strengths?

This might depend of the IEM you're using. I'm using Beyerdynamic Xelento and I hear better contrasts, or lush colours with the fHybrid filter. In my case I don't see any advantage in using Fast. Hybrid Filter combines creative filtering with pristine audio quality and workflow enhancements, making it a vital effect for modern music producers. It's also a question of personal preference. One likes smooth, the other guy prefers sharp, etc. That's why sound is subjective and can be modified by listeners with filters, EQ, virtualizers, bass boosters, etc. I'm totally against EQ of any specie. When an equipment sounds really good it doesn't need it. These filters are a different thing. They deal with tone or texture, basically modifiyng the frequency response of an audio signal, they don't modify the sound in a negative way (agree or not) like EQ does. You're just trying to compensate something that doesn't work for you, because the headphone is not really good. And the result is an artificial sound. If it is good and you are still using EQ, sooner or later you will disable it. I encourage everyone I talk with to get used to the sound with no EQ. When you go back to EQ you hate it. This has been my experience for over 30 years.

 

[sofastreamer]

Nice to know that the BTR15 stand its ground against devices that cost 4-5 times its price!

By the way, have you tried setting the filter of the BTR15 on Fast instead of Hybrid? I found out that the difference is noticeable for my ears in many cases.

In my experience when the BTR15 set on Fast it loses a bit of soundstage and "airiness" and, overall, a bit of its "smoothness", in favor of added dynamics and resolution. The fact that this possibility is offered gives the device even more versatility in my opinion! (or maybe I just imagine things, in the audio world you could never know).

interesting, thank you for your impressions! i have the opposite. to my ears, with hybrid it looses depth specially in the center of the soundstage, everything moves closer and just two blobs on the sides were slightly expanded, while on fast, the soundstage is more consistent and further in the front of you. its subtle tho.

 

[sofastreamer]

Dear friend,

Thanks for the kind feedback. We have report to the quality engineer for check. But we fail to reproduce the same problem currently. So it may still take us some time for locating the issue.

Best regards

Hi Fiio, thanks for the feedback! So me and the others that suffer from permanent reboots might have gotten some defective units. will try to exchange mine by the seller.

 

[AudioBomb]

interesting, thank you for your impressions! i have the opposite. to my ears, with hybrid it losses depth specially in the center of the soundstage, everything moves closer and just two blobs on the sides were slightly expanded, while on fast, the soundstage is more consistent and further in the front of you. its subtle tho.

That's why it's also headphone dependent. Xelento has huge soundstage width and depth, a little loss of depth wouldn't be noticeable, I think. Even though I don't think these filters deal with soundstage perception. But if you notice it it's because it is causing that effect on your equipment. Here it's not perceptible. It's more about sharper or smoother, just to simplify. But it's interesting to know that.

 

[OceanOfLight]

That's why it's also headphone dependent. Xelento has huge soundstage width and depth, a little loss of depth wouldn't be noticeable, I think. Even though I don't think these filters deal with soundstage perception. But if you notice it it's because it is causing that effect on your equipment. Here it's not perceptible. It's more about sharper or smoother, just to simplify. But it's interesting to know that.

If I had to add something to my previous statement, I would say Hybrid give me the impression of a more analogue type of sound, while Fast seems more leaning to Hi-Fi.

Regarding the soundstage: maybe the fact that Hybrid Filter is smoother, and this resulting in the "outlines" of music to be a touch vaguer and less defined, can contribuite to giving me the impression that the soundstage is somehow wider?