[chargedcapacitor]

So basically on a technical level, I am driving the Susvara sufficiently already, it's just how it's tuned that is resulting in not much bass?

Do you only listen to bass-light genres with the Susvara then complement them with another bassier headphone then?

There's no way to achieve bass or warmth without dabbling into EQ?

There is no way to achieve strong bass on the susvara, period. Using EQ can elevate the sub bass, but it will never hit hard. You can do a port mod to get slightly harder hitting bass kicks, but you will never get that hard hitting mid bass punch which can be found on other headphones. I believe it's due to the susvara just not having a strong enough magnetic field, due to too small of magnets spaced too far apart. If you look at the LCD line, they have larger magnets spaced closer together. But that's just a guess.

 

[Pashmeister]

Susvara bass is usually the first thing that sounds punchier and fuller the better the chain and amplification gets. It’s not easy to get there though, and is not for the faint of heart and wallet.

Though I own the 1266TC which has the boom boom bass, I use the Susvara 80% of the time even with bassy music. Anyone who says the Susvara can’t have a strong bass… take it with a grain of salt.

 

[801evan]

Susvara's bass isn't as strong as LCD, Focal, or 1266 bass, no matter how you amplify it.

Susvara has better bass than lcd4, even on a dac amp like ifi Diablo on low gain.

 

[801evan]

If you want to have strong bass without EQ you need a headphone with harman tunning for bass. That being said there are not many totl sets that will give you this, as audiophile gear usually has flat / reference bass tuning.

Stealth is very close to harman and the major difference between that and the Susvara is the Stealth has more midbass. Both has amazing sub-bass quantity and density with the Stealth having a bit more quantity. EQ has no ability to simulate the bass of a lower noise floor.

 

[prismstorm]

If you see it as a 'problem' then yeah you should go ahead and sell the Susvara to buy an Abyss 1266 TC. The Ferrum stack is perfectly capable of driving the TC too, so no harm done there imo. Why wait?

Because there's no dealer for Abyss in my area so it'll be a potential sight-unseen sound-unheard $5995 mistake. I'd rather get the Meze Elite to get some bass, much cheaper, comfortable and I've demoed it 3 times now with positive feedback.

Also don't beat yourself up, getting solid bass out of Susvara is a quest that pretty much every Susvara owner goes on ... it needs a lot of experimentation, investment, time, dedication, it can be done, but took me round 8 months to get to where I want to be with it. TC gives you bass in spades from almost any chain, you have to fight to get it to sound clean with good midrange though, but Oor will sort this out pretty much.

The thing is aside from spending another obscene amount on another amp, I think this is as far as I can go for this combo, I have met the drivability requirement of the headphones with a well-received combination with a proven synergy.

I have switched from the Black Dragon to the Silver Dragon and there was slight improvements in soundstage, instrument separation, and a little tightening in the low end. Nothing drastic though. I remember you really praise the Lavricables Grand Silver, but before I spend on a cable that is more than double the price of my Silver Cable, I want to make sure it's going to get me positive improvements first ...

 

[krude]

Because there's no dealer for Abyss in my area so it'll be a potential sight-unseen sound-unheard $5995 mistake. I'd rather get the Meze Elite to get some bass, much cheaper, comfortable and I've demoed it 3 times now with positive feedback.

The thing is aside from spending another obscene amount on another amp, I think this is as far as I can go for this combo, I have met the drivability requirement of the headphones with a well-received combination with a proven synergy.

I have switched from the Black Dragon to the Silver Dragon and there was slight improvements in soundstage, instrument separation, and a little tightening in the low end. Nothing drastic though. I remember you really praise the Lavricables Grand Silver, but before I spend on a cable that is more than double the price of my Silver Cable, I want to make sure it's going to get me positive improvements first ...

I forgot the Empyrean, that was a very nice, basy and impactful headphone. If Elite has the same character it is indeed another option and if you like the sound signature then sounds like a plan. Silver won't give you a bass lift, but it will improve the micro and macro dynamics making the whole spectrum sharper. I like my headphones sharp and my dac + amp detailed and smooth, but there's a hundred ways to skin the cat.

 

[chargedcapacitor]

Susvara bass is usually the first thing that sounds punchier and fuller the better the chain and amplification gets. It’s not easy to get there though, and is not for the faint of heart and wallet.

Though I own the 1266TC which has the boom boom bass, I use the Susvara 80% of the time even with bassy music. Anyone who says the Susvara can’t have a strong bass… take it with a grain of salt.

That statement is setting people up to be disappointed, if they are looking to the susvara as a headphone that can accurately reproduce percussion sounds as well as the LCD or focal line of headphones. Anyone upgrading from an LCD-x to a susvara would be quite disappointed in the bass punch.

On top of that, high fidelity $5000+ amps are not needed to faithfully reproduce and handle bass / kicks on the susvara. Any decent speaker amp will show the susvaras low end capability.

Keep in mind, this whole argument revolves around the statement not that the susvara has bad sub bass (it has great sub bass), but that it does not have the leading edge "punch" that accurately renders what a kick drum or similar sounds and feels like.

 

[krude]

That statement is setting people up to be disappointed, if they are looking to the susvara as a headphone that can accurately reproduce percussion sounds as well as the LCD or focal line of headphones. Anyone upgrading from an LCD-x to a susvara would be quite disappointed in the bass punch.

On top of that, high fidelity $5000+ amps are not needed to faithfully reproduce and handle bass / kicks on the susvara. Any decent speaker amp will show the susvaras low end capability.

Keep in mind, this whole argument revolves around the statement not that the susvara has bad sub bass (it has great sub bass), but that it does not have the leading edge "punch" that accurately renders what a kick drum or similar sounds and feels like.

I will respectfully disagree. On stock cable, yes, in my setup you'd be hard pressed to find anyone who would compain about impact, and I owned both LCD X and the Empyrean, both with great impact in their own right. In fact I would rate Susvara on similar level impact wise.

 

[OneEyedHito]

Got the Ferrum OOR + HYPSOS stack and the chain is Macbook Pro > AudioQuest Cinnamon USB Cable > Bifrost 2 Unison USB > XLR Interconnect > Ferrum OOR (powered by HYPSOS) > XLR out to Susvara

Although the sound is very transparent and clean, bass is still not that strong, and even on high gain mode (+dB) the volume knob is cranked to 3 o'clock position and Susvara is still not having enough power or sounding full or loud enough. HYPSOS display indicates output power to be around 15-17W and output current at 0.6-0.8A.

What gives? Is Susvara still being underpowered, I thought this combo is already one of the best (testified by many to work well) for driving it? Or time to switch to another headphone?

Using Hypsos and Oor the output should be 24V, check that figure first.

EDIT: I see in your cross posting to another thread that you gave more detail in a subsequent post and clarified that you are on the correct setting.

 

[iFi audio]

On top of that, high fidelity $5000+ amps are not needed to faithfully reproduce and handle bass / kicks on the susvara. Any decent speaker amp will show the susvaras low end capability.

Yes, hundreds of feedback pages in the Susvara thread show that there's some connection there for sure.

 

[jlbrach]

Am wondering a bit about the necessity of remote control for headphone usage or do you guys have 3m cables attached sitting in some distant armchair?
My cables are usually too short (and too expensive to be too long )

even if close it is a big convenience...I have my set up in my bedroom and the remote is a real nice thing to have

 

[jlbrach]

Yup. That's just how it is.

huh?...susvara bass is better than utopia...not even close

 

[jlbrach]

Not sure if it had to do with the dac which it was hooked up to, (and obviously take all this with a grain of salt because meet conditions etc.) but I was genuinely unimpressed by the OOR + Hypsos combo at Canjam. I listened to it with a couple different things: my Mini (Custom headphone made by a start-up), a Utopia, and a few other ETA's (The startup in question). Overall, it sounded very reminiscent of two much cheaper amps: the JDS Atom, and Magni Heresy. In short, it sounded like a cheap op-amp implementation. Now, I'm not sure if that's how the amp is actually designed, but the sound overall was, despite being pretty clear and for the most part timbrally correct, very dull and unengaging. Transients lacked edge and slam, microdynamics were almost completely absent, and the music sounded, though not "off", as if it really lacked (to use a term Ferrum likes) "Soul". This is probably attributable to the fact that the amp just didn't seem to dig very deep, and smeared over the finer gradations of music (what many refer to as "texture" or "plankton"). I think it tries to get away from some of the characteristic problems with SS by having what is definitely a warm tonal bent, but this just ends up masking over some detail in the treble, I think. It also sounds pretty "Slow": not in a "rounded transients" sort of way, but more in the sense that individual notes were not particularly visceral or immediate sounding.

Overall, I'd expect this amp to cost somewhere from 300-500, not $3000 with the Hypsos power supply. The iFi amps, by contrast, (even the cheaper ones, like the Diablo and Gryphon) had much more character and engagement. Maybe it does better with planars, which I did not try it with. Or maybe this unit was a dud, or maybe the dac it was hooked up to just wasn't great. Or maybe my ears just don't jive with it for whatever reason. Anyways, a big disappointment for me, as an SS on the level of, say, an ECP DSHA-3F at an accessible price which can be easily purchased would be a great thing. But to my ears, it didn't come anywhere close to the 3F. No solid state amp I've heard does.

I dont own it but given the reviews I have read and the raves something is wrong in your setup somewhere

 

[HiFiHawaii808]

huh?...susvara bass is better than utopia...not even close

maybe for texture and detail, but not for punch and slam.

 

[jlbrach]

Susvara bass is usually the first thing that sounds punchier and fuller the better the chain and amplification gets. It’s not easy to get there though, and is not for the faint of heart and wallet.

Though I own the 1266TC which has the boom boom bass, I use the Susvara 80% of the time even with bassy music. Anyone who says the Susvara can’t have a strong bass… take it with a grain of salt.

agree 100%...susvara has terrific bass...is it as impactful as the abyss?...no but nothing is...but it is accurate and deep and really good...like everything else depends on your chain which is why the susvara is such a controversial HP