[FooFighter]

if you want to know the actual numbers, just from my memory, it might be wrong but wont be too far off

Mytek 888: 6W into 16 ohms
Benchmark HPA4: 6W into 16 ohms
GSX mk2: 6W into 32 ohm
Liquid Gold: 9 or 10W into 50 ohm
iFi pro iCan: 14W into 16 ohms
Ragnarok: 12 or 15(?)W into 50ohm
Flux FA-10: 16W into 32 ohms,
Flux VOLOT should have even more power but IDK
Dark Star(undisclosed, but I am pretty sure it is more than the 8W OOR)
Custom Dynahi/CFA3: can have more power than everything above depending on your build

note that the GSX, Dynahi & CFA are pure Class A power
Flux claims class A but I am not certain, it doesn't get as warm as any other Class A I know of. therefore I doubt given its power.
Ragnarok and Liquid Gold is partially Class A, change to Class AB on high power.
All others pretty sure does not run Class A.
it is just for your information, I am not going to debate if Class A power is superior or anything. I am not knowledgeable enough to discuss about this anyway. But "Class A" seems to be a thing some people care about.

Thx for that!
Looking at the specs pretty much all the amps but last few are having less juice than OOR?

 

[whitefang]

Thx for that!
Looking at the specs pretty much all the amps but last few are having less juice than OOR?

technically yes, but 6W is already some stupid amount of power that your headphone will never ever need. (except SR1a)
I understand some might want even more power for the "effortlessness" or whatever but it is already way beyond what one should worry.
Using 6W to drive HE6 is like having Arnold Schwarzenegger to lift a 10lb Dumbbell.

if you really just care about power than the FLUX it is.
It can drive the HE6 without clipping even when connected to the iFi IEM match+ with highest attenuation(-24db), then smokes comes out from the IEM match+ because the resistor blown up, and the amp still runs fine.

Yep I tried it myself.

Not sure if it is actually Class A but it certainly has the power they claimed.

Also unsure about the math but I think +24db is more than 100 times the power.

 

[FooFighter]

For me I think it's not relevant if I continue using sources with enough juice as long as there are no SQ relevant aspects vs OOR which I yet have and actually wanted to keep because of it's versatility for driving low impedance gear as well as Susvara plus having a really desktop friendly footprint

 

[whitefang]

For me I think it's not relevant if I continue using sources with enough juice as long as there are no SQ relevant aspects vs OOR which I yet have and actually wanted to keep because of it's versatility for driving low impedance gear as well as Susvara plus having a really desktop friendly footprint

Then consider the Benchmark dac3.
Probably no one would doubt the performance of the Benchmark DAC.
And it has some crazy loud output, maxed at 20Vrms IIRC(+27.5db).
If the OOR can take it, plus its 10db gain it will have all the headroom you need for the Susvara.

 

[FooFighter]

Then consider the Benchmark dac3.
Probably no one would doubt the performance of the Benchmark DAC.
And it has some crazy loud output, maxed at 20Vrms IIRC(+27.5db).
If the OOR can take it, plus its 10db gain it will have all the headroom you need for the Susvara.

Thx, will check it out.
Actually I am waiting for the new Ferrum DAC/Streamer but will consider doing some side by side comparison as I can get Benchmark devices from local Thomann vendor which has generous return policies.
In comparison to the tiny Oor even the more compact Benchmark devices are looking a bit clumsy
Edit: DAC3 is quite compact, I had investigated the HPA-series before...
It seems to be limited regarding decoding specs though, 24/192 PCM is its maximum...

 

[GoldenSound]

This^

A lot of people seems to still confused with this.
Remember some portable amp back then with some non sense gain just to give an illusion of "powerfulness"
gets the hd800 pretty loud even before 9o 'clock position, then it clips before even hitting 12 o'clock. Leaving more than half the pot useless.

Yep and it's unfortunately seeming to become something of a common practice to make amps look more powerful than they are. Just making them really high gain so that it FEELS like they've got tons of headroom. Couple amps I've had in recently would literally power anything

So it is the opposite of the problem, not enough gain to actually utilize the power it is capable to output.
Just saw the official data that the high gain has 16db for balanced and only 10db for single ended.
Certainly not enough to provide the headroom for very demanding planars.

How loud are you listening? If its not got enough gain you should definitely consider lowering your volume. Those are super dangerous levels

 

[OneEyedHito]

I no longer have a TT2, but looking at the manual, it puts out 2.5V "on all outputs". Does that mean 5V with dual XLR?



If it's 2.5V and not 5V it would be close to the Qutest, which I have set at 3V. With the Qutest and a relatively 'quiet' song (some songs are recorded much louder than others), I was also at 2-3 o' clock in high gain, with the Susvara. With more energetic songs it would be 11-12 o' clock though. I don't listen very loud, probably 75 dB. I also expected to have more room left on the volume dial, in that situation.

With the Dave though, which puts out 6V through the balanced XLR connections, most songs were plenty loud for me in medium gain, ~12 o' clock. If the TT2 indeed puts out 5V, you likely either listen much louder, or to more subdued music, e.g. classical. Or there is something wrong with the OOR.

Mat do you still have the Oor in house? Are you using the Hyposis with it? If so on it still being in-house try all three levels on the gain switch and see if you hear 3 different levels. When I first got mine I didn’t need to go over 11-12 o’clock w/Susvara in high gain but something happened to mine and the gain switch only had 2 discernible levels after and I had to go to 3 or 4 o’clock also for around 80-85db. I could even turn it up 100% which not the case when the gain switch worked correctly. My unit went back for repair/replacement so I won’t have it back for a week or so.

In regards to the Hyposis power supply it outputs 24v to the Oor on standard setting as directed by the software.

I say all of this because for the first two weeks I had mine there was no way I was turning it up 100% and then all of as sudden one day I could and the pot settings are similar to yours so it’s worth checking that your gain switch is working on all 3 levels. Mine only worked in 0db and -6db after something happened, meaning that the volume at +12db and 0db were the same and -6db was lower. The power would come back intermittently also which was a non starter when the volume at 3-4 o’clock.

 

[Gavin C4]

My dCS DAC allows me to adjust the DAC's output voltage from 0.2 to 6v. Definitely adaptive to every situation. I think the OOR can accept XLR input voltage of 6v and it should sound fine without clipping.

 

[FooFighter]

Can you test playing DSD with 6V as my earlier quoted post is saying that will work only with PCM?
Other question: why not always using 6V (your Screenshot is still showing that 2V is selected) as this should provide superior headroom and prevents OOR from running in some "more likely difficult" amping running at around 75% or more throttle

 

[FooFighter]

@GoldenOne
I appreciate and like your statements about the relativity of volume wheel positions and the conclusions for the outcoming signal.
What I am though interested in is in which amping range will OOR perform at its best?
Has this been measured and can that be translated to the volume wheel position or does it also depend on the input voltage though OOR is amping that input signal relatively no matter how much Volts it has?
The point I want to clarify is: what is the recommended volume range without distortions or any measurable SQ degradations?
Is Headroom measurable besides looking at a volume wheel or knowing that the signal could be raised even higher?
So final question: in how far does it make sense to invest into preamping beyond 3 or 4V?
My example use case is always Susvara as one of the most demanding cans

 

[Gavin C4]

Can you test playing DSD with 6V as my earlier quoted post is saying that will work only with PCM?
Other question: why not always using 6V (your Screenshot is still showing that 2V is selected) as this should provide superior headroom and prevents OOR from running in some "more likely difficult" amping running at around 75% or more throttle

No problem at all setting to 6v on the DAC when playing DSD files. DSD files are usually lower volumed compared to other modern FLAC files, as shown on the timeline on Roon. I usually use 2v as a preset because I might plugin my IEM into the OOR from time to time.

 

[FooFighter]

Thx!
how is your impression now with Oor vs 2V using your most difficult headphone?
Where's the volume wheel in comparison?

 

[MatW]

Mat do you still have the Oor in house? Are you using the Hyposis with it? If so on it still being in-house try all three levels on the gain switch and see if you hear 3 different levels. When I first got mine I didn’t need to go over 11-12 o’clock w/Susvara in high gain but something happened to mine and the gain switch only had 2 discernible levels after and I had to go to 3 or 4 o’clock also for around 80-85db. I could even turn it up 100% which not the case when the gain switch worked correctly. My unit went back for repair/replacement so I won’t have it back for a week or so.

In regards to the Hyposis power supply it outputs 24v to the Oor on standard setting as directed by the software.

I say all of this because for the first two weeks I had mine there was no way I was turning it up 100% and then all of as sudden one day I could and the pot settings are similar to yours so it’s worth checking that your gain switch is working on all 3 levels. Mine only worked in 0db and -6db after something happened, meaning that the volume at +12db and 0db were the same and -6db was lower. The power would come back intermittently also which was a non starter when the volume at 3-4 o’clock.

Yes, the gain switch works fine on the OOR. Switches failing, both the gain switch and RCA/XLR source switch, is a known issue on the first batch.

I have not played with the voltage on the Hypsos, as I don't know by how much this can be adjusted safely, and I am not sure about the benefits.

 

[FooFighter]

I think the safe adjustment areas are preprogrammed into the Hypsos for the selectable devices.
I've read in some review that setting the highest value (which is 30V) for OOR may result in a life spam < 10 years.
I ve played around a bit and in all honesty not heard any change.
I think some reviewers claimed to hear nuances of differences for very specific recordings and song positions.

Playing around with mid and high gain and adjusting volume to the same level is leading to much more recognizable differences

 

[whitefang]

Yep and it's unfortunately seeming to become something of a common practice to make amps look more powerful than they are. Just making them really high gain so that it FEELS like they've got tons of headroom. Couple amps I've had in recently would literally power anything
How loud are you listening? If its not got enough gain you should definitely consider lowering your volume. Those are super dangerous levels

it is great for you to be concerned with listening level, I wish more people do that.

I did not measure the volume I listen to but I know I am a fairly low volume listener.
I want to protect my hearing as much as possible because I still want to enjoy head-fi when I am 90.
I need to wear custom earplugs on concert or party and a lot of time I still feel volume uncomfortable even with earplugs on so now I just avoid them.

I don't own the OOR but 10db gain is most likely enough for myself with low volume recordings even with the HE6, but I have experienced how loud people listen to on a lot of head-fi meets/canjam etc. And I am pretty certain it might not be enough for some people.

And there could be various reasons one would need more headroom. To just name a few..
-Source has low output
-Source sound bad with high output (some daps for sure have this problem)
-some modified headphone might be even less sensitive than stock HE-6.
-volume matching work that require lowering volume from the source
-Using in-line equalizer/attenuator which would lower the volume even more
-Listen to something that is not music..(or music not mastered/equalized to have the same volume as normal commercial ones.)

etc. etc.

For me it is not the "intended use" of headphone amp but I do want the gain. because Iam lazy and I sometimes use my HE6 as speakers and I listen to it from 5 meters away.