[UntilThen]

 
Obviously I still lust to hear how the new Orpheus sounds, or  a full discrete Questyle setup, or a Blue Hawaii with e.g. a TotalDAC, or @Frederick Rea's Lampizator. But I wouldn't expect the HD600s to match their performance, same as I'd expect a TOTL set (e.g. your Beyers T1, the Focals, or the Senns HD800s) would. In that aspect, @DecentLevi's question makes sense: how much better s the Euphoria? What would it make sense to compare it with? Well, that's the real question: e.g. an HD600/650  thread here in Greece was lusting over the Quad PA-One, but only on the understanding that the price difference may not make it a sensible solution. Indeed, if I wanted an $1400 amp I'd expect to pair it with a similarly priced headphone.
 

Going to a meet or Can Jam where the good systems are on display can be a blessing and a curse. The last Can Con I went to had only about 15 people in a big room. There's ample time and quietness to have a good listen. I heard the Blue Hawaii with Yggy dac and Stax SR-007 and 009 headphones. Another system had Audio-Gd Reference series dac and amp driving a HD800S in balanced mode. Really great tone there but delicate. I don't even want to compare Elise with those amps. It's not a fair comparison. Elise and Euforia must be compared with amps in their price range and will probably perform better than amps that cost twice as much.

 

[hypnos1]

  I was thinking about that too. How do you determine that amp X is 50% better than amp Y? Surely that's a figure pluck up out of the air. It is all subjective. It's not something you can measure.
 
Our goal in Head-Fi is not to buy the most expensive amp, dac and headphone. If you have no temperance, you will soon lose your mind and your pennies. Rather your goal should be to buy what you can reasonably afford and yet sound like a million bucks. Don't lust after $6000 amp and $4000 headphones.  

 
Yo UT...as @Oskari, @angpsi and others say, to try and attribute percentage 'improvements' to items, especially in relation to price is too subjective a matter to have any real relevance/validity lol!
 
And of course we all know about that painful 'Law of Diminishing Returns', which boils down purely to what we're prepared/able to pay for something "a bit extra/different"...taking into account also our varying degrees of OCD/madness lol!!

. Fortunately, I myself do NOT feel any desire whatsoever to enter $2500 + amp terrirory...and my temporary insane lust after $4000 Focals has now (thankfully) totally subsided, with what I am now hearing from my own setup!

 

  Yeah I was saying that from what I've heard, the Euforia may potentially compete with summit-fi amps costing much more, so if one would theoretically gain only a small improvement from a greatly more expensive amp, the ball still lies on Euforia's side for bang-for-buck.

 
Yo DL...impossibly subjective topic of percentage 'improvements' aside (

), I honestly believe I personally would indeed have to spend a great deal more to gain anything I would regard as subjective 'improvement'...to my ears...But, of course, not yet having been able to compare with similarly priced amps, I can't be absolutely sure...as can't anyone else lol!
 
The only reason I initially asked Lukasz if he would consider a few upgrades on my behalf was because I felt that our latest 'alternative' tubes might just tweak a bit more performance out of the already excellent Elise...(obviously, components used must be chosen to a price point  - as with everything!). As it turns out, Henryk Feliks evidently foresaw that more major alterations might well deliver the sort of extra performance that would take the amp further up the ladder than just one rung LOL!!...and he was right!!

...
 
And so in answer to your earlier question, I feel my yearning for 'something better' has now been more than fulfilled by Henryk's efforts in creating the Euforia...and I can only hope with all my heart that @mordy's (and others'...[@MIKELAP's for one, I believe]!) occasional mantras - IT NEVER ENDS! ...or...IF GOOD IS GOOD, ISN'T BETTER BETTER?!!- will no longer rear their ugly heads!!

...(I do still live in hope, even though I've succumbed many times in the past few years lol!

)...CHEERS!...

 

[UntilThen]

After Euforia and around the middle of the year, I plan to get a new DAC. 
 
It truly never ends this hobby. Should have just gone on a holiday. 

 

[connieflyer]

Personally and let me reiterate personally I think that it is natural for people to want something more something better and find a way to arrive at that. I have been very happy with the Elise I was very happy with the 650 and the 700 and now the 800 would I go to $4,000 for a pair of headphones I might. If that is what drives me at the time and I can afford it why not. As far as percentages go it is something that cannot be Quantified against hearing it can only be Quantified in your own price domain. Childish Reflections on I'd like this girl 20% better than that girl because she was cheaper are stupid. Anything that is subjective cannot be Quantified as this reaches .8 on a list and that reaches point .5 on the same list just because of price and the difference in preceived enjoyment-price. Audio is entirely subjective. It's like asking anybody if they enjoyed a piece of music. No two people are going to feel it exactly the same so trying to put a percentage on a cost is ridiculous. Let's stick to things that can actually make sense. When I read CJ's reviews on the new amp knowing how he writes and how he talks help me determine that it was a genuine excitement for this new one. Never having heard one only having the Elise to judge anything by I had to go on his assessment. It's one that I have learned to trust. We like a lot of the same music so I think we hear similar things. It was enough to push me into the new amp. Now having sold the Elise There's No Going Back. Life is short, there are no do overs,enjoy it while you can.

 

[pctazhp]

A good friend of mine used to own a high end stereo boutique. Every time he got something new in he would call and say I needed to come in and hear it. I would ask him how it was different than the last thing I HAD to hear. He would just say "it's more better". He sure had my number!!! Did I actually say he was a good friend???
 
I agree that Professor @hypnos1 is worthy of following. I'm getting close to pulling the trigger on Euforia. We'll see if my friendship with H1 survives )))))

 

[connieflyer]

If the friendship does not survive it is obvious it is your fault! Go ahead and take the plunge, what is the worst that can happen?  By the way I can be persuaded limit overflights to daytime only, providing you no longer sun bath in the nude!

 

[pctazhp]

  If the friendship does not survive it is obvious it is your fault! Go ahead and take the plunge, what is the worst that can happen?  By the way I can be persuaded limit overflights to daytime only, providing you no longer sun bath in the nude!

I'm in contact with FA. Such great people to deal with.
 
OMG. You poor soul !!!!  You actually saw that????

 

[connieflyer]

I did not actually see it, my sensors, indicated a video virus so quarantined the file.

 

[High-End-Addict]

The Euphoria seems better made and bigger than the Elise ,
But still only one input , now the box is larger they could have added a couple more inputs thus making it an interesting preamp.

 

[connieflyer]

Not having seen the actual unit, I would not say it was constructed better than the Elise, F-A's attention to detail if quite good, and I don't think it would be a higher standard than their other offerings.  However, I do agree about multiple inputs, it would have made it more versatile. optical, co-ax and USB would have made for more possibilities and made it easier for me to connect to more sources.  Limiting to just line level inputs in this price class does kind of limit it. With the increase in inputs, of course, increases cost, but I think it would have been an easier sell for those contemplating amps in this price category.  But it remains to be seen if the performance increase over the Elise does make it worth the price increase. From what CJ says, it should be, and that is what I had to base my decision on, plus the quality of the Elise gave me confidence that this is a good move.

 

[pctazhp]

  Not having seen the actual unit, I would not say it was constructed better than the Elise, F-A's attention to detail if quite good, and I don't think it would be a higher standard than their other offerings.  However, I do agree about multiple inputs, it would have made it more versatile. optical, co-ax and USB would have made for more possibilities and made it easier for me to connect to more sources.  Limiting to just line level inputs in this price class does kind of limit it. With the increase in inputs, of course, increases cost, but I think it would have been an easier sell for those contemplating amps in this price category.  But it remains to be seen if the performance increase over the Elise does make it worth the price increase. From what CJ says, it should be, and that is what I had to base my decision on, plus the quality of the Elise gave me confidence that this is a good move.

As I recall, H1 said the only difference was Euforia had slightly taller transformer cage for better ventilation, but I could be wrong. I guess we are still waiting to see picture of production Euforia.
 
I agree about FA's high standards.

 

[hypnos1]

  The Euphoria seems better made and bigger than the Elise ,
But still only one input , now the box is larger they could have added a couple more inputs thus making it an interesting preamp.

 
Hi H-E-A....externally, the quality is very Elise-like - ie. very good! The case size is the same, but with the front plate slightly larger and the finish a tad less matte than the very first Elises (and so not quite such a dust collector lol!). The transformer housing is larger than my prototype Elise, but am not sure if this is in fact also true for the later units. However, I believe F-A have also 'beefed up' the housing somewhat.
 
However, internally, there is indeed quite a jump in quality, along with certain design changes even though the general layout remains similar  :
 
Elise....
 

 
 
Euforia
 

 
 
 
And so, having the same case size, I suppose extra inputs and outputs wasn't really a viable option in F-A's eyes. And at least the one (extremely good!) pre-amp out is enough for most folks lol!...

 

[hypnos1]

  Not having seen the actual unit, I would not say it was constructed better than the Elise, F-A's attention to detail if quite good, and I don't think it would be a higher standard than their other offerings.  However, I do agree about multiple inputs, it would have made it more versatile. optical, co-ax and USB would have made for more possibilities and made it easier for me to connect to more sources.  Limiting to just line level inputs in this price class does kind of limit it. With the increase in inputs, of course, increases cost, but I think it would have been an easier sell for those contemplating amps in this price category.  But it remains to be seen if the performance increase over the Elise does make it worth the price increase. From what CJ says, it should be, and that is what I had to base my decision on, plus the quality of the Elise gave me confidence that this is a good move.

 
Hi cf...one or two more line inputs (like Espressivo) would indeed have been nice, but again, F-A wanted to retain the same case as Elise in order to keep the price to a competetive level

.
 
 The  Zana Deux S, for example, does indeed have 3 line inputs and 2 pre-amp outs, but is $2400 +...the Cavalli Liquid Glass just 2 line ins and 2 out, but is $3500!! So I suppose Euforia's price still remains pretty competetive on paper...it just remains to be seen how close it can come in the sound stakes lol!

...

 

[connieflyer]

Got it

 

[pctazhp]

From the internal views it seems we are talking about two different amps. Oh, I guess we are