[hypnos1]

Agree H1

The Naim is a very nice gear. Auralic Aries would be interesting too, as it is a music streamer that can address Tidal and your network music storage..... and Roon. Maybe it time to try Roon.

When I connected the CD player to Yggy, I knew that getting a purer sound extends beyond the DAC. You have to address the source.....

However H1, after the Naim, try the Utopia and see the smile light up the northern skies.

As for me, this is where it ends. See my signature... plus a CD player. I shall now change my name from UntilThen to TheEnd.

Aaahh, my good friend...if the Utopias were half their price I might just consider them...if not, NO WAY I'm afraid.

I'm hoping my own journey will end with the Hugo 2!!...speaking of which, @pctazhp, your sympathy for my delayed delivery plight was most reassuring and welcoming, thanks. But what you could have said is that my dealer says Chord hope to have even the second batch shipped in the next few weeks!...but you didn't...and I thought you were omniscient lol!! . So I am now a much happier chappie...(I shall still take your sympathy, however!!! )...CHEERS!

 

[HPLobster]

I know its confusing and I'll probably mis-educate you more than I'll educate. But I'll try.

Let's start with the picture of the back of the Schiit Yaggrasil or "Yiggy" (the one UT has) I downloaded from the Schiit site:


It shows all of the possible data input methods I know of used by DACs - USB, Optical, Coax, BNC and AES/EBU

The main input method used by most DACs today is probably USB. Mike Moffat, who designed all of the Schiit DACs has said that USB is the least desirable input. However Yiggy uses Schiit's most advanced USB input (they refer to it as "Gen 3"), and UT reports getting excellent results running USB directly from his PC to Yiggy. The main problem with USB I've heard described is that apparently it was not originally designed for music and has "noise", whatever that means. I experience it as "grung". I saw someone else describe it as a "wooshing" sound.

Optical (Toslink), Coax and BNC all use the same data stream refered to as SPDI/F. Most people seem to believe that Optical is the poorest way to transmit SPDIF data and BNC the best.

Toslink looks like this:https://smile.amazon.com/Black-Squi...496883719&sr=8-2-spons&keywords=toslink&psc=1

Coax SPDIF looks like this: https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B00FMZX4DS/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o05_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 (this is what I currently use) - needs to be 75 ohms

BNC cable: is essentially TV antenna cable and looks like this: https://smile.amazon.com/Hosa-BNC-5...id=1496884024&sr=1-1&keywords=bnc+coax+75+ohm It also needs to be 75 ohms.

AES/EBU is essentially XLR balanced cable : https://eventhorizon-srv.com/ecommerce/os/catalog/mogami-3080-110ohm-digital-cable-8ft-p-5397.html. This is generally considered the best way to transmit a digital signal.

Different music servers may use any one or more of the above non-USB connections. But my source of music is Tidal HD, so I need to get the data signal from my PC to Bimby. Most PCs don't have any digial out other than USB, or possibly Optical. For me, I use the ASUS board which as I said has a by-pass function. Somehow it takes the digital feed from my PC's Wi-Fi connection, completely by-passes USB and feeds a SPDI/F signal to its coax output, and provides me a much better and cleaner signal than I get from USB.

Many people deal with USB problems by feeding the PC's USB signal to a Digital Domain Converter (DDC) which converts (and presumably cleans up) the USB signal to some form of SPDI/F data transport method allowing use of one or more of that method described above.

Hope this helps a little. Please don't be surprised if I have made some technical goofs.

Here are my thoughts on this topic:

I own the Chord Mojo basically since Day 1 so since it has USB-, Toslink- and Coax- inputs, you can trust me if I say that I did my research on this very thoroughly

MOST people by far (and yes, head-fiers are included ) definitely come to believe that there is absolutely no difference in quality between the three input-variations. That goes for "in practice" and "in theory". Since it´s about digital data, so basically 1´s and 0´s, there shouldn´t be any way it can be affected in its quality during transport. I know a guy working for Microsoft Germany who really knows his stuff, and asked him about digital cables. He confirmed to me that there is no possible way that there could be more than one single quality-criteria that has validity for all of those cables: Either it works or it doesn´t. There is nothing in between and certainly nothing "above" this quality.

Still, mainly amongst audiophiles, many have the conviction that OPTICAL cables are the superior ones, this goes especially for the stereo-sector. Sorry to contradict you on this pct, but simply that is what my experience and reading through probably thousands of posts has shown. The Coaxial/SPDIF-proponents still seem to be a little outnumbered, but they exist of course.

Naturally, when it comes to the Mojo, most users are utilizing the USB-Input, simply because it is the only input out of the three (and this also goes for every other DAC) that is capable of converting sample rates that are higher than 192 kHz and since the Chord Mojo is DSD-capable, you wouldn´t want to loose out on that. This is no important criteria when using a Schiit-DAC since Mike Moffat doesn´t think much of DSD and Hi-Res-Audio and Schiit-DACs do not support those in their original form. Malicious tongues say that it isn´t a coincidence that Moffat is one of very few audio-CEOs to bash USB and then DSD/Hi-Res also....
Many (this includes myself) think that the statement that USB is the "worst" input is based on the fact that it is the most "glitchy" one concerning users that utilize very old, cheap, crappy, total garbage motherboards, so the overall digital conversion is bad from the beginning and the re-clocking/-synchronizing has to fill in and do its job. If everybody would be using optical or coaxial inputs (and outputs for that matter), it would make Schiit´s job much easier, because devices that already have the comparatively rather uncommon ability to output via optical/coaxial can´t be that crappy so to speak. Questyle for example has implemented a rather poor clocking-chip in their recent DAC/Amps, resulting in many buyers actually returning their devices because of occasional "clicking" that occurs.

I personally own a Creative Sound Blaster Z soundcard with optical-out bypassing the motherboards USB-out, but I never have been keen on using this yet. If I do so in future, I´ll be happy to share my findings compared to USB with this group of course

Just my two cents....

 

[pctazhp]

@HPLobster I would not necessarily disagree with anything you say. My eyes glaze over whenever the discussion about digital turns truly technical in nature. I know for me I experienced a definite improvement when I got the ASUS board. But I never discount the potential of placebo effect, and certainly would not bet my life I could distinguish between my USB and coax connections in a true DBT. My PC is kind of a standard Dell 3 or 4 year old PC, so it may have a crappy motherboard. My USB cable is a relatively new premium, but not particularly expensive, cable. But I really don't know.what's going on.

My comment about optical comes primarily from what most of the audiophiles I knew thought, but that was 25 or 30 years ago.

I know Mike Moffat focuses on Redbook. For whatever reason, I've never had much interest in hi-res files since I sold my Marantz SACD player decades ago.

So one can place their reliance on their ears, reviews, HeadFi posts, numbers and measurements or whatever they want. Whatever works is my motto. Personally, I chose to put my reliance on the Sedona crystals that are hanging over my head when I listen and how many days old the vegetables are in my refrigerator.

 

[pctazhp]

Bottom line for me I guess at this point is that this is a Euforia amp thread. Even though I've been the biggest offender in taking it off topic to DACs, I want to get away from that. I'm sure it turns some people off, and there are plenty of DAC threads here on HeadFi for those who are interested.

Right now, I love my system. My favorite driver is Sylvania 6SN7-WTG. My favorite power tubes are GEC 6080 and GEC 6AS7G, but I have not listened to some of the other highly regarded power tubes I have in a while, especially since I got Euforia. I'm planning to upgrade to a Gumby and that I hope will be my endgame for a long time. So I doubt I'll have much new to contribute here, but always enjoy the good company

 

[HPLobster]

@HPLobster I would not necessarily disagree with anything you say. My eyes glaze over whenever the discussion about digital turns truly technical in nature. I know for me I experienced a definite improvement when I got the ASUS board. But I never discount the potential of placebo effect, and certainly would not bet my life I could distinguish between my USB and coax connections in a true DBT. My PC is kind of a standard Dell 3 or 4 year old PC, so it may have a crappy motherboard. My USB cable is a relatively new premium, but not particularly expensive, cable. But I really don't know.what's going on.

My comment about optical comes primarily from what most of the audiophiles I knew thought, but that was 25 or 30 years ago.

I know Mike Moffat focuses on Redbook. For whatever reason, I've never had much interest in hi-res files since I sold my Marantz SACD player decades ago.

So one can place their reliance on their ears, reviews, HeadFi posts, numbers and measurements or whatever they want. Whatever works is my motto. Personally, I chose to put my reliance on the Sedona crystals that are hanging over my head when I listen and how many days old the vegetables are in my refrigerator.

Bottom line for me I guess at this point is that this is a Euforia amp thread. Even though I've been the biggest offender in taking it off topic to DACs, I want to get away from that. I'm sure it turns some people off, and there are plenty of DAC threads here on HeadFi for those who are interested.

Right now, I love my system. My favorite driver is Sylvania 6SN7-WTG. My favorite power tubes are GEC 6080 and GEC 6AS7G, but I have not listened to some of the other highly regarded power tubes I have in a while, especially since I got Euforia. I'm planning to upgrade to a Gumby and that I hope will be my endgame for a long time. So I doubt I'll have much new to contribute here, but always enjoy the good company

ROFL I love your humour @pctazhp , I really do.....vegetables......

I apologize for taking the off-topic-road here. This thread (and the Elise-thread also for that matter) have clearly derailed some time ago in this regard, I´m not sure why or who is to blame... *cough* <ACHOOtillthen>, bless you!

Regarding your motherboard, a 3 or 4 year old one surely does not meet the criteria I meant, its technology probably should be almost on par with todays

Ultimately you are certainly right, whatever works and pleases is always the right approach. Always. Heated debates and bad blood in this respect are as useful as a hole in the head. I upgraded my system with cables although not believing in cable-upgrades and I may be a doctor, but my wife still convinces me to drink rose quartz energized water now and then, so after all I´m the last one to start throwing stones here
Regarding Hi-Res: Currently I am owning exactly 68 SACDs/DSD-albums, but I nevertheless enjoy listening to Tidal-Masters-files through Gumby>Elise more than to DSD-files through Mojo>Elise...


Alright then, since I do not own the Euforia, I´m going to wrap this post up doing a little tube-small talk:
My favourite power tubes are Mullard 6080 and my favourite drivers probably are Philips Miniwatt EL3N. But since @UntilThen revealed Lukasz´ statement about utilizing EL-tubes with their amps, the Sylvanias you mentioned are number one priority on my shopping list now...
I can hardly wait for @angpsi ´s impressions, since I´m pretty convinced that we share the same taste in sound-signature...

 

[connieflyer]

I will no longer de=rail this thread, I promise, well after this post then. An interesting "How it's made show" on vacuum tube construction.
and how about this for an audio amp? Love the tubes! http://www.kraudio.com/index.php?op...&id=26:kronzilla-sxi&catid=3&Itemid=6&lang=en
One last thing, about the indicator slot on the volume knob, did not want paint, so I took a nail file, just to the edge of the knob, at a 45 degree angle, and carefully filed off the paint, just on the edge of the knob. It is just enough to be able to locate it and makes it a little more noticable to the touch.

 

[UntilThen]

Who is this new member ACHOOtillthen?

 

[UntilThen]

Derail ? Never. This is UntilThen productions. Every story is worth telling including hamsters jokes.

 

[UntilThen]

Now I shall talk about my ultimate amp.

Ducks..... before the rocks are thrown at me.

 

[angpsi]

Bottom line for me I guess at this point is that this is a Euforia amp thread. Even though I've been the biggest offender in taking it off topic to DACs, I want to get away from that. I'm sure it turns some people off, and there are plenty of DAC threads here on HeadFi for those who are interested.

Right now, I love my system. My favorite driver is Sylvania 6SN7-WTG. My favorite power tubes are GEC 6080 and GEC 6AS7G, but I have not listened to some of the other highly regarded power tubes I have in a while, especially since I got Euforia. I'm planning to upgrade to a Gumby and that I hope will be my endgame for a long time. So I doubt I'll have much new to contribute here, but always enjoy the good company

(...) Alright then, since I do not own the Euforia, I´m going to wrap this post up doing a little tube-small talk:
My favourite power tubes are Mullard 6080 and my favourite drivers probably are Philips Miniwatt EL3N. But since @UntilThen revealed Lukasz´ statement about utilizing EL-tubes with their amps, the Sylvanias you mentioned are number one priority on my shopping list now...
I can hardly wait for @angpsi ´s impressions, since I´m pretty convinced that we share the same taste in sound-signature...

Hi guys! Before I bring in the juice, I'd like to say that I don't consider all the talk about DACs etc as derailing the thread at all—in fact, I consider it quite the opposite! Technically speaking, both the Elise thread and the Euforia thread are about developing general impressions regarding the use of two beautiful pieces of amps, including their peripherals. Quoting @pctazhp on page 1 of the Elise thread,

I’m trying this new Elise thread as an experiment to see if there are those interested in a basic Elise thread. Of course, I can’t dictate the rules for this or any thread and would not presume to try. But I am suggesting the following guidelines for those who might be interested in this type of thread:

• This is intended as a thread for those who are primarily interested in the 1-tube-per-socket (with or without single-tube adapters) approach to the Elise – for both current owners of the magnificent Feliks Audio Elise and those who are considering a purchase.
• Discussion of different tube combinations we have tried or are considering is encouraged, but discussion of external power and multi-tube adapters is discouraged.
• Discussion of compatible DACs, headphones or other related gear is encouraged.
• Photos of our setups are highly encouraged, as are examples of music we enjoy with our Elises.
• Helpful information for those who are thinking about buying an Elise is highly encouraged
• A true sense of community, mutual respect and courtesy is the goal.

At the same time, it was @hypnos1 who was the first one to admit that upgrading the audio chain was a far more significant improvement over any sort of tube rolling (and actually, it was he who started all the DAC frenzy after attending the Milton Keynes head-Fi meet)!

Personally I have always felt, as @UntilThen has already mentioned, that the question at hand is about synergy. Not all DACs may work wonders with the sound signature of FA, but could potentially be a beautiful thing with other amps. On the other hand, one great addition in an audio chain containing our beloved Feliks Audio amps may bring benefits worthy enough to share with our comrades in the pursuit of audio bliss! Therefore I find all discussion about such issues as extremely pertinent to enjoying either the Elise or the Euforia.

Having made my position clear, the wgt are indeed "the moon, the stars, and the sun"! Refined and neutral, yet very gutsy and rendering everything with authority; these tubes can actually move air on my HD600! This is the first time I can admit a clear edge over the Psvane, and actually see what all the fuss about NOS tubes is about! This is also the first time I witnessed the HD600 scale to the point that I feel there may be need to upgrade them! (Plus, omg the head clamp! But that's a different story...)

@HPLobster if you're online as I post this don't even wait for my impressions, just go out and get them before they go away!

Disclaimer: these are of course early impressions but if they sound so good out of the box, I honestly wouldn't expect them to deteriorate over the days to come! Just to add some context, these days I've been marvelling on how wonderful my new pair of Etymotic HF3 sound on the Meridian Explorer2—true details galore... This even made me question the quality of the sound I was receiving out of the Elise / HD600 setup; obviously very good, but I had indeed found some details missing, or rather being somewhat set less pronounced in a dark background (e.g. in my beloved Paul's Boutique by Beastie Boys). Well, thank God for the WGTs, the details are back in a wide and airy soundscape, rendered with such punchy bass that I caught myself crazy tapping my foot as I listened (wasn't this UT's mark of excellence?). These tubes can also obviously do great jazz—e.g. JVC's "Boss Tenor" by Gene Ammons—but as I write these lines, Solti's Beethoven 9th (DECCA, 1987) is blowing my mind with detail, volume, and decay!

I will move the rest of this report plus pics over to the Elise thread. After all, as the newer generation of Elise owners, we do have to keep the flame burning!

 

[angpsi]

Oh, and another thing: won these on an auction! Guess it was fate that brought us together... Only mine will come with camembert and Merlot (or Pinot noir)!

 

[angpsi]

Finally, reading after your DAC research I came up with this exotic contraption! Not that I have $5000 to burn, but just FYI, and in the spirit of thoughtfully derailing the thread...

Looks like the golden bars in second row are the real thing (i.e. MSB ladder DACs)! The following image is taken from the DAC's HeadMania review.

 

[UntilThen]

Oh, and another thing: won these on an auction! Guess it was fate that brought us together... Only mine will come with camembert and Merlot (or Pinot noir)!

Congrats on the gec 6080. I don't toe tap like Mordy does. I do this when listening to the gec. It's been in Euforia for 4 days straight.

 

[angpsi]

FYI, same guy who sold me these is also selling one (1) Bendix 6080wb open cross column plate. Used to own a Bottlehead Crack, now selling off his tubes inventory after migrating to other ventures.

 

[UntilThen]

Here's some eye candy for you. My setup has too much clarity now. There is such a thing as too much clarity.

I need to dull it a little. So I pop in the stock Tung Sol from Elise.

Bingo ! Sounds great on my system.