[Pharmaboy]

If I ever want to waste money, I would certainly expend it in prostitutes and cocaine and then get a schiit heresy+modi.

I think it's a given that the prostitutes & cocaine won't sound like Schiit.

 

[Lolito]

Well, you never know. Back on topic, my ARES arrived today. Extremely fast shipping from Vinshine and Fedex. 35€ total in taxes, 13€ base fee, the rest are actual VAT taxes... Yesterday I payed 19€ for something else; same 14€ fee, 5€ the actual taxes... These people are earning money by doing nothing. The VAT is fine, but 13€ to X company for charging me 3€ in VAT it is ridiculous and crazy. Then of course, in South America that is where the real rip off is... Again, VAT taxes, money for the public, for me is fine... 13€ for charging money? a beer is 1.5-3€ and it is something, this is 13€ for nothing.

First impression was that all my red book files sounded like mp3 256Kbs, and that lack of resolution, with some kind of equalization that makes vocals and high piercing treeble go well behind of the whole sound scene. No surprise it doesnt tire the ear, seems like designed as for background music on an elevator or reception or office. That of course is for a non burned in Ares2, and then I am used to the Topping E30 sound, which is clean and clinical but probably edged and in general a bit tiring after a while, but very detailed and precise. The bass on the topping much more shy, short, less decay...

Anyhow, hard to put it into words, specially because the general impression can vary a lot, for example certain tracks that are very simple, just a vocals and 1 or 2 instruments, with the Ares2 is much more organic, musical, real, natural sounding for sure, already. I also noticed, when playing DSD or high res files, those files topping is not that bad, less piercing sound, and then ton of detail, so in those cases, the ares advantage is smaller maybe. Still early.

All in all, feels like the Ares2 will need to open up, initially sounded bad, now sounds much much better, still not spectacular, we will wait. But I can already feel that less tiring experience for long hours, at least with speakers, with headphones didnt try yet, the topping with headphones was already sublime sounding I have to say. I could use the topping with the Singxer SA1 for hours and hours.

 

[joseG86]

Sublime sounding is always improvable, you can always get better muahaha

 

[sajunky]

Burning takes time, but, It also takes a time to adjust our brain to the not simplified sound.

 

[Kromen]

Well, you never know. Back on topic, my ARES arrived today. Extremely fast shipping from Vinshine and Fedex. 35€ total in taxes, 13€ base fee, the rest are actual VAT taxes... Yesterday I payed 19€ for something else; same 14€ fee, 5€ the actual taxes... These people are earning money by doing nothing. The VAT is fine, but 13€ to X company for charging me 3€ in VAT it is ridiculous and crazy. Then of course, in South America that is where the real rip off is... Again, VAT taxes, money for the public, for me is fine... 13€ for charging money? a beer is 1.5-3€ and it is something, this is 13€ for nothing.

First impression was that all my red book files sounded like mp3 256Kbs, and that lack of resolution, with some kind of equalization that makes vocals and high piercing treeble go well behind of the whole sound scene. No surprise it doesnt tire the ear, seems like designed as for background music on an elevator or reception or office. That of course is for a non burned in Ares2, and then I am used to the Topping E30 sound, which is clean and clinical but probably edged and in general a bit tiring after a while, but very detailed and precise. The bass on the topping much more shy, short, less decay...

Anyhow, hard to put it into words, specially because the general impression can vary a lot, for example certain tracks that are very simple, just a vocals and 1 or 2 instruments, with the Ares2 is much more organic, musical, real, natural sounding for sure, already. I also noticed, when playing DSD or high res files, those files topping is not that bad, less piercing sound, and then ton of detail, so in those cases, the ares advantage is smaller maybe. Still early.

All in all, feels like the Ares2 will need to open up, initially sounded bad, now sounds much much better, still not spectacular, we will wait. But I can already feel that less tiring experience for long hours, at least with speakers, with headphones didnt try yet, the topping with headphones was already sublime sounding I have to say. I could use the topping with the Singxer SA1 for hours and hours.

In my system (gaming pc) I noted the ares ii definitely needs at least a iFi iPurifier3 for the usb otherwise it sounds as you noticed, a lack on definition and brighter. Also make sure you enable its over sampling mode, as the nos imho lacks some definition.

Now I wonder if should I have gone with bf2 since it’s usb implementation is supposed to be even better than eitr who also improves ares ii sound.

 

[AlanU]

One question, what price are your speakers? because my speakers with amp costs new 1100€, I bought them on offer for 660€. Speakers with amplification.
I bought now a 600€ R2R DAC, it is already an overcost. I understand with systems with a +5000€ speakers, with 1000-2000€ in amp+preamp, I understand all that hassle. but re-clocking the clock for the clock after the clock, usb to coax to XLR ro rca...


Too much. Schiit Bifrost 3 and be done with it, you heard it here first.

The reason why people purchase DACs is for the purpose of chasing a preferred SQ. You mentioned how your Toppings DAC is fatiguing over time. This is an indication that the DAC is overly excited for long sessions. I would suggest setting the Toppings DAC aside and just be less critical on your ARES ii as it is breaking in.

You cannot truly judge your new DAC in the preliminary stages of breaking in. Sound silly but not only does the hardware need to settle, your ears require time to adjust.

If a DAC does not fatigue your ears, this doesn't necessarily mean it is not highly detailed. There should be a point where you can get a sense of the music venue. This is where a lot of solid state audio gear can accentuate everything and provides you a sense of "fake" music reproduction. Approach your listening sessions as if you physically go out to a concert. Real world concerts DO NOT sound like a topping DAC you are accustomed too. The natural note decay, audible layers and texture is something that you get in a real venue. Hard to describe but holographic sound is more realistic than a wall of high detail from many cheap and cheerful DACS on the market.

When you say your Toppings lacks note decay. That is not surprising. If you listen to good quality tube gear you'll get additional even harmonics and a longer note decay. This is extremely difficult to obtain with solid state audio gear.

Until you invest in re-clocking gear, you'll eventually realize what you are missing. Even in higher end gear, people often pick their jaws off the ground after buying an audio grade ethernet switch or re-clocking DDC. People can also shock themselves when they purchase a well designed DAC.

My point is once you put emphasis on ultra low jitter, reclocked source. Your entire chain down stream will benefit. If you do not buy into such "cleanes" of source, you will still be happy with your gear. The only warning is do NOT borrow a re-clocking DDC as you will have a hard time giving it back.

My speakers retail is rather spendy just under 10 grand. I'll have to admit I was not fully satisfied until I did all of this re-clocking investment.

If you are using a $3 bulk cord provided by the DAC manufacturer.....please put some worthy Power cable to feed it.........Don't believe me, I urge your ears to closely listen!!! I'm currently using a Furutech DPS4.1 power cord on my 10yrs old tech Burson DA-160. This $1200 cord + DA-160 (fed with reclocked signal) will force you to scratch your head. I'm still floored how reclocking has made this burr brown 1793 chipset perform to a degree closer to much higher end dacs I've owned or borrowed.

 

[Lolito]

I believe you, I just do not have the money or a space for all this, to start with, that costs 3-4000€/m2, so go figure... Topping not really fatiguing, with headphones pretty much never, with speakers, yes, they have something there annoying to my ears. Like I have to eq down a bit the treble, or boost the bass with headphones. With speakers I leave flat eq, I can eq from speakers themselves, but still, the topping was piercing at times, and now by comparison, it is clearly noticeable. Certainly not all dacs sound the same. I could shut my mouth for two weeks, but rather explain the process of burn in for anybody else buying this dac. At the moment, you can play 24-96 or red book through the Ares, sounds the same really. Then in DSD or high res, topping works so much better, less annoying, in hi res the differences or advantages of one over the other are reduced... I like or at least liked high res because not just the detail but sounds better to me, less glare, more precision, more transient impact... Now, the Topping has zero bass in comparison with the ARES. Zero. With Ares the bass player is here in this room, loud. Boooooommmmm ;-D

The whole DDC, I believe you, you have the experience, not me. But we are going to have to find a poorman DDC option here. The chinese option. R2R DAC, with so many precision matched resistors, so big toroidal PSU, it costs money, understandable. But DDC, we have to find a cheap thing that converts USB into good coax, cheap from china, ok? it's just a bunch of chips, can be done cheap.

I bought custom power cables, professional for concerts and touring, 0.5m long, thick isolation. 5€ each. Not gonna pay for expensive power cable, I am sure it sounds better, but at that level, I rather save for a Porsche, or a 5000€ coffee making set, or a trip to... Sometimes too much is too much for not sick/rich people.

 

[Lolito]

The reason why people purchase DACs is for the purpose of chasing a preferred SQ. You mentioned how your Toppings DAC is fatiguing over time. This is an indication that the DAC is overly excited for long sessions. I would suggest setting the Toppings DAC aside and just be less critical on your ARES ii as it is breaking in.

You cannot truly judge your new DAC in the preliminary stages of breaking in. Sound silly but not only does the hardware need to settle, your ears require time to adjust.

If a DAC does not fatigue your ears, this doesn't necessarily mean it is not highly detailed. There should be a point where you can get a sense of the music venue. This is where a lot of solid state audio gear can accentuate everything and provides you a sense of "fake" music reproduction. Approach your listening sessions as if you physically go out to a concert. Real world concerts DO NOT sound like a topping DAC you are accustomed too. The natural note decay, audible layers and texture is something that you get in a real venue. Hard to describe but holographic sound is more realistic than a wall of high detail from many cheap and cheerful DACS on the market.

When you say your Toppings lacks note decay. That is not surprising. If you listen to good quality tube gear you'll get additional even harmonics and a longer note decay. This is extremely difficult to obtain with solid state audio gear.

Until you invest in re-clocking gear, you'll eventually realize what you are missing. Even in higher end gear, people often pick their jaws off the ground after buying an audio grade ethernet switch or re-clocking DDC. People can also shock themselves when they purchase a well designed DAC.

My point is once you put emphasis on ultra low jitter, reclocked source. Your entire chain down stream will benefit. If you do not buy into such "cleanes" of source, you will still be happy with your gear. The only warning is do NOT borrow a re-clocking DDC as you will have a hard time giving it back.

My speakers retail is rather spendy just under 10 grand. I'll have to admit I was not fully satisfied until I did all of this re-clocking investment.

If you are using a $3 bulk cord provided by the DAC manufacturer.....please put some worthy Power cable to feed it.........Don't believe me, I urge your ears to closely listen!!! I'm currently using a Furutech DPS4.1 power cord on my 10yrs old tech Burson DA-160. This $1200 cord + DA-160 (fed with reclocked signal) will force you to scratch your head. I'm still floored how reclocking has made this burr brown 1793 chipset perform to a degree closer to much higher end dacs I've owned or borrowed.

what amp are you using with those speakers? any system photo?

 

[TheRealDz]

I believe you, I just do not have the money or a space for all this, to start with, that costs 3-4000€/m2, so go figure... Topping not really fatiguing, with headphones pretty much never, with speakers, yes, they have something there annoying to my ears. Like I have to eq down a bit the treble, or boost the bass with headphones. With speakers I leave flat eq, I can eq from speakers themselves, but still, the topping was piercing at times, and now by comparison, it is clearly noticeable. Certainly not all dacs sound the same. I could shut my mouth for two weeks, but rather explain the process of burn in for anybody else buying this dac. At the moment, you can play 24-96 or red book through the Ares, sounds the same really. Then in DSD or high res, topping works so much better, less annoying, in hi res the differences or advantages of one over the other are reduced... I like or at least liked high res because not just the detail but sounds better to me, less glare, more precision, more transient impact... Now, the Topping has zero bass in comparison with the ARES. Zero. With Ares the bass player is here in this room, loud. Boooooommmmm ;-D

The whole DDC, I believe you, you have the experience, not me. But we are going to have to find a poorman DDC option here. The chinese option. R2R DAC, with so many precision matched resistors, so big toroidal PSU, it costs money, understandable. But DDC, we have to find a cheap thing that converts USB into good coax, cheap from china, ok? it's just a bunch of chips, can be done cheap.

I bought custom power cables, professional for concerts and touring, 0.5m long, thick isolation. 5€ each. Not gonna pay for expensive power cable, I am sure it sounds better, but at that level, I rather save for a Porsche, or a 5000€ coffee making set, or a trip to... Sometimes too much is too much for not sick/rich people.

The $200 Singxer F-1 is your poor man's DDC, perfect for the Ares. You are paying only for coax output, which is all your Ares can handle anyway.

I can't fully convey how much better the Ares sounds with it; it takes everything the Ares does well, and bumps it up 2 notches (11 notches? )

Keep in mind my F-1 is not even fully burned in yet, let alone it is still powered by my crappy Microsoft Surface usb out until my Breeze linear power supply gets here.

But that said, Amazon will deliver my powered USB 2.0 hub today - I am eager to hear what improvements it may make...

 

[Lolito]

In my system (gaming pc) I noted the ares ii definitely needs at least a iFi iPurifier3 for the usb otherwise it sounds as you noticed, a lack on definition and brighter. Also make sure you enable its over sampling mode, as the nos imho lacks some definition.

Now I wonder if should I have gone with bf2 since it’s usb implementation is supposed to be even better than eitr who also improves ares ii sound.

thanks for the tip, I´m waiting for the burn in. Also, I want to test oversampling in Audirvana, versus OS on the dac, or in both... we'll see. So far happy with this dac, can be played very loud, much louder before it's too much.

 

[Lolito]

The $200 Singxer F-1 is your poor man's DDC, perfect for the Ares. You are paying only for coax output, which is all your Ares can handle anyway.

I can't fully convey how much better the Ares sounds with it; it takes everything the Ares does well, and bumps it up 2 notches (11 notches? )

Keep in mind my F-1 is not even fully burned in yet, let alone it is still powered by my crappy Microsoft Surface usb out until my Breeze linear power supply gets here.

But that said, Amazon will deliver my powered USB 2.0 hub today - I am eager to hear what improvements it may make...

what usb 2.0 did you ordered? link? what kinda psu has? is it audiophile approved or should it be replaced by another fancy PSU? 200$ for a usb cleaner not cheap. Here with the case 250€ shipped with case, 300$ for a usb cleaner not cheap man. My headphones are 200$, LOL

 

[AlanU]

what amp are you using with those speakers? any system photo?

No photo to share.

For my solid state system I've kept it simple with a Parasound A21+ with a matching Parasound P6 Pre-amp. Tube setup I use a locally made Space tech labs SA-700 (200 watt @ 8 ohms) KT150 hybrid tube amp with STL tube pre-amp and STL 24 bit Tube dac.

Time is on our side to slowly develop and accumulate gear that makes your ears happy.

You must also remember that having different DACS simply sound different. The key word is "different".

For example I've borrowed my friends R2R Aqua La Scala DAC which is a spendy $10,000 unit. ABX blind fold test I had my daughter (Pianist) seat herself in front of my system. I used my Burson DA-160, STL tube dac (using EL34 tubes and external super rectifier power supply) and the Aqua dac. Female vocals she immediately said the STL tube dac was spooky real and the artist was singing in our living room. Burson came in 2nd place (not a close second). Following that ....3rd place was the $10,000 La scala dac.

Trio music the La Scala came first, very close 2nd was the STL tube dac and close 3rd was the Burson. All provided excellent imaging but the La Scala had minimally larger wrap around sound stage over my STL tube dac.

Piano and strings my STL tube dac came in a extremely strong performer at #1. The Burson actually came in 2nd as it has a more relaxed analog tail with more realism in note decay. La Scala came in 3rd.

I just recently blew the dust off my old Grant Fidelity B283-mk2 tube buffer with a pair of 1960 Vintage Sylvania 6sn7. Using litz Wire world RCA interconnects I paired it with the Burson DAC. I would say it's the most ghetto fun tweak that actually improved the high hat and imaging of instruments.

Getting back to my solid state system. No word of a lie....... I am thrilled in how the "freebie" internal ESS Sabre32 Reference DAC - ES9018k2M DAC performs in my Parasound p6. It's almost unrealistic to believe that the digital glare or any evidence of fatigue is present while I feed it with a Aural Symphonics Platinum (silver wire) coax cable from my pair of cascaded Mutec Re-clocking DDC setup. If I feed my "freebie" onboard ESS sabre with USB from my Music server or laptop/Topping D10s (used as usb to spdif DDC converter) you would NOT LIKE this fatiguing thin sounding DAC. I could say it's extremely difficult to listen to the Parasound p6 solid state ESS SABRE DAC without the re-clocking DDC setup. This simple solid state system (using p6 pre-amp) to my ears drastically out performed my Mytek liberty/Brooklyn + as far as non stop musical and dynamic flow of analog sound.

I will also mix and match. During the summer I will run my solid state more often than my tube gear. However I sometimes use my tube dac with solid state pre-amp and amp.

Sounds like the Singxer F-1 is a nice option to test out for DDC. This slow investment in audio gear is painful and expensive. I will just say that 1 mutec would be endgame for most. It will be a beneficial improvements across the board as you cry once and pay for such a device. I will say that there is absolutely no comparison using a standard DDC to a Re-clocking type. My friend has a Aqua Formula DAC and he feeds it two cascaded Mutecs. Note the 20 grand dac has a very sophisticated re-clocking setup internally ........he continues to feed it his "endgame" source cleanes. Even at that top caliber gear it's difficult "not" to use the re-clocking DDC setup. It truly gets even better!!!!!!!!!!!

Oddly some say that there is NO NEED for such a DDC setup to feed a $$$$ flagship DAC......Many high end owners will beg to differ. This is why I try to make awareness to modest system owners to "cry hard" once and vastly improve the sound as they clean up their front end source. It's almost instant "endgame" cleanes.

 

[AlanU]

The $200 Singxer F-1 is your poor man's DDC, perfect for the Ares. You are paying only for coax output, which is all your Ares can handle anyway.

I can't fully convey how much better the Ares sounds with it; it takes everything the Ares does well, and bumps it up 2 notches (11 notches? )

Keep in mind my F-1 is not even fully burned in yet, let alone it is still powered by my crappy Microsoft Surface usb out until my Breeze linear power supply gets here.

But that said, Amazon will deliver my powered USB 2.0 hub today - I am eager to hear what improvements it may make...

Allow the DDC to break in. The sound should become more relaxed and music will flow even more freely. As he re-locking occurs you may start to hear more of the "venue" and the micro details starts to reveal itself. How? the noise floor can drop and lets those details come out freely to your ears.

 

[joseG86]

what usb 2.0 did you ordered? link? what kinda psu has? is it audiophile approved or should it be replaced by another fancy PSU? 200$ for a usb cleaner not cheap. Here with the case 250€ shipped with case, 300$ for a usb cleaner not cheap man. My headphones are 200$, LOL

I found the problem and the fix for all your "troubles with sound"

My headphones are 200$, LOL

 

[TheRealDz]

I believe you, I just do not have the money or a space for all this, to start with, that costs 3-4000€/m2, so go figure... Topping not really fatiguing, with headphones pretty much never, with speakers, yes, they have something there annoying to my ears. Like I have to eq down a bit the treble, or boost the bass with headphones. With speakers I leave flat eq, I can eq from speakers themselves, but still, the topping was piercing at times, and now by comparison, it is clearly noticeable. Certainly not all dacs sound the same. I could shut my mouth for two weeks, but rather explain the process of burn in for anybody else buying this dac. At the moment, you can play 24-96 or red book through the Ares, sounds the same really. Then in DSD or high res, topping works so much better, less annoying, in hi res the differences or advantages of one over the other are reduced... I like or at least liked high res because not just the detail but sounds better to me, less glare, more precision, more transient impact... Now, the Topping has zero bass in comparison with the ARES. Zero. With Ares the bass player is here in this room, loud. Boooooommmmm ;-D

The whole DDC, I believe you, you have the experience, not me. But we are going to have to find a poorman DDC option here. The chinese option. R2R DAC, with so many precision matched resistors, so big toroidal PSU, it costs money, understandable. But DDC, we have to find a cheap thing that converts USB into good coax, cheap from china, ok? it's just a bunch of chips, can be done cheap.

I bought custom power cables, professional for concerts and touring, 0.5m long, thick isolation. 5€ each. Not gonna pay for expensive power cable, I am sure it sounds better, but at that level, I rather save for a Porsche, or a 5000€ coffee making set, or a trip to... Sometimes too much is too much for not sick/rich people.

The $200 Singxer F-1 is your poor man's DDC, perfect for the Ares. You are paying only for coax output, which is all your Ares can handle anyway.

I can't fully convey how much better the Ares sounds with it; it takes everything the Ares does well, and bumps it up 2 notches (11 notches? )

Keep in mind my F-1 is not even fully burned in yet, let alone it is still powered by my crappy Microsoft Surface usb out until my Breeze linear power supply gets here.

But that said, Amazon will deliver my powered USB 2.0 hub today - I am eager to hear what improvements it may make.

what usb 2.0 did you ordered? link? what kinda psu has? is it audiophile approved or should it be replaced by another fancy PSU? 200$ for a usb cleaner not cheap. Here with the case 250€ shipped with case, 300$ for a usb cleaner not cheap man. My headphones are 200$, LOL

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07W3M16C1/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_glt_fabc_Y9BTWWFE24MFSGWBVW0A

I don't know how audio approved it is, but I put the effort to find a USB 2.0 device.

My hope is that when my psu arrives, I will power my devices with the psu and injector cables instead of the hub. But the hub will allow me to connect multiple USB sources to my F-1.