[ThanatosVI]

Mitch's target is +/-0dB from 15Hz to 6kHz (based on the graphs he shows) i.e. a flat line.

With or without any compensation curve?
If he uses binaural headphones on his own head without compensation it's only flat for him.
A

 

[alxw0w]

With or without any compensation curve?
If he uses binaural headphones on his own head without compensation it's only flat for him.
A

Exactly.
Harman also is "flat" as it tries to mimic flat measuring speakers. But flat measuring speakers are flat in anechoic chamber but in room it has slope response so....
That's why I'm very interested in trying Mitch filters for expanse.

Ps. Already placed an order for trial. Will report later how it sounds.

 

[VandyMan]

With or without any compensation curve?
If he uses binaural headphones on his own head without compensation it's only flat for him.
A

His goal is to take a measurement and adjust the EQ until it measures flat using the mics in HIS ears. He discusses it on his site. Yes, since it is based on his own ears, it may not sound flat to you. The compensation itself would not be flat (meaning none at all). He makes no mention of compensation, but he does use a calibration for the mics.

Edit: Sorry about all the edits, took me a few tries to get this to make some sense.

 

[gammi]

For what it's worth, the Harman curve isn't flat for many people's ears either. In fact they weren't even trying to make it flat, the goal was what subjectively sounded the best to the most people.

Best thing to do is try it and see if you like it.

 

[alxw0w]

For what it's worth, the Harman curve isn't flat for many people's ears either. In fact they weren't even trying to make it flat, the goal was what subjectively sounded the best to the most people.

Best thing to do is try it and see if you like it.

One more time what is flat?
People don't understand what flat means.

 

[jlbrach]

all of his filters are good but for the Raal sr1a and the Ca-1a they are essential

 

[gammi]

One more time what is flat?
People don't understand what flat means.

There is perceptually flat, as in after interacting with your ears/skull each frequency is the same volume. Harman is not this. No FR curve is this for everyone.
There is also flat in the sense that what comes out of the drivers before interacting with anything is the same volume at each frequency.

Context determines which "flat" someone is referring to. Since I said flat "for many people's ears", context shows I'm talking about perceptually flat.

 

[VandyMan]

One more time what is flat?
People don't understand what flat means.

There is perceptually flat, as in after interacting with your ears/skull each frequency is the same volume. Harman is not this. No FR curve is this for everyone.
There is also flat in the sense that what comes out of the drivers before interacting with anything is the same volume at each frequency.

Context determines which "flat" someone is referring to. Since I said flat "for many people's ears", context shows I'm talking about perceptually flat.

The context here is Mitch's filters. The link is available a few posts above. We are not talking about perceptually flat. He EQs to literally flat frequency response. Please checkout his website and his discussion of how/why he measures and EQs.

 

[VandyMan]

https://accuratesound.ca/headphone-calibration/

He does mention psychoacoustic filtering, but it is not clear how it is used.

 

[DarginMahkum]

"Looking at the measured frequency response, the bass is -2 dB down at 20 Hz, with a -3 dB dip between 200 and 300 Hz, another -2 dB dip in the 800 Hz to 2 kHz range and a +2 dB peak in the 3 kHz to 4 kHz range and narrow +2 dB peak at 5.5 kHz. The “W” frequency response gives the headphone an “upper midrange forward” tonal response that masks the true neutral capability of these headphones."

Relative to what? What does "true neutral capability" mean? Apparently he has his own definition of neutral and claims a "W" frequency response, but again behind a lot of word salad, there's no explicit definition of the "neutral" base.

There's no "flat" measurement without a reference. Measurements only have a meaning together with the measurement rig, which is why the measurements done by Jude are different from regular Harman rigs. And again, we don't see his reference.

He might for sure be a person of knowledge, but in the end he is there to earn money. He will for sure not earn money from me with that claim of -3dB dip for 200-300 Hz range.

 

[Tachyon88]

I'm sensing a new extremely high priced audiophile market in the EQ space now. I'm willing to bet if I paid more for an EQ profile it would sound even better ! Perhaps matching EQ profiles that go specifically with silver or copper.

 

[gammi]

The context here is Mitch's filters. The link is available a few posts above. We are not talking about perceptually flat. He EQs to literally flat frequency response. Please checkout his website and his discussion of how/why he measures and EQs.

I wasn't talking about Mitch's filter in my comment. I was talking about how not everyone's ear's perceive Harman as flat. So yes, I was talking about perceptually flat.
"For what it's worth, the Harman curve isn't flat for many people's ears either."

I am the one who sent my Expanse to him so he could make this filter, and the one who posted the link, I'm well aware of his website

 

[alxw0w]

So I'm listening to the filter by Mitch and I have to admit I like what I'm hearing.
Mid bass hump is reduced to the point that bass reminds more that one from Stealth and vocals/mids seems to be less pushed forward and smoother.
The difference is not huge but is definitely easily noticeable and to my ears i prefer Expanse with Mitch filter.
I still need couple of days to decide if I really want to spend 200 bucks for it, but as for now I like that a lot.
To my ears Expanse is more linear sounding with it so why not.

ps. Expanse sounds now more "easy going" in comparison without filter the sound seems to be forced/pushed aggressive if that makes any sense.

 

[gammi]

So I'm listening to the filter by Mitch and I have to admit I like what I'm hearing.
Mid bass hump is reduced to the point that bass reminds more that one from Stealth and vocals/mids seems to be less pushed forward and smoother.
The difference is not huge but is definitely easily noticeable and to my ears i prefer Expanse with Mitch filter.
I still need couple of days to decide if I really want to spend 200 bucks for it, but as for now I like that a lot.
To my ears Expanse is more linear sounding with it so why not.

ps. Expanse sounds now more "easy going" in comparison without filter the sound seems to be forced/pushed aggressive if that makes any sense.

Thanks for giving it a try and sharing your feedback. My Expanse is currently on its way back from Mitch so I can't try it out until the 15th.

I'm sensing a new extremely high priced audiophile market in the EQ space now. I'm willing to bet if I paid more for an EQ profile it would sound even better ! Perhaps matching EQ profiles that go specifically with silver or copper.

Fwiw it cost him over $500 just in shipping and customs fees to ship my headphones (I did send multiple) to him and back and also he spent a couple weeks with them fine tuning the filters. Additionally the filters have 65,536 points of correction so it's not quite like an EQ with 5 frequencies adjusted and some Q value spreading the adjustment out.

Personally I think $200 to have my $4000 headphone adjusted by a sound engineer with decades of experience isn't a bad value but that's a judgement call for everyone to make personally.

 

[ThanatosVI]

My Expanse is currently on its way back from Mitch so I can't try it out until the 15th.

Mine is also sheduled to return on the 15th.
Then I can finally do some direct comparison to the Corina