[Fegefeuer]

  Panzerfan, the main difference between the E5 and G5 now is primarily the Bluetooth and "Portability" of the device.

The E5 is designed as a portable amp / dac first...so it has the battery included that will let you take it on the road and use it as a portable amp / dac with any smart device / phone, etc.
 
The G5 is designed as a portable sound card to be used VIA USB. So you don't have the Bluetooth capability or the internal battery.

I'll get a better breakdown of the two posted up here so it's a lot clearer where the differences are for everyone.

 
The main difference is also that you guys did terribly wrong with the G5 by not supporting SBX 5.1 via consoles (fed with Dolby Digital/AC3) while giving the G5 LO/optical out "Headphone Mode" support but not to your 399/499 Dollars products aka the X7/X7 LE.

 

[TenMoonsNorth]

For the E5 does the headphone input on the front support TRRS Headphone + Mic cables?
 

Spoiler: Quote: panzerfan

Originally Posted by panzerfan /img/forum/go_quote.gif

So the G5 is positioned to compete against the Astro Mixamp? One of the major complaints that have been levied against the Astro Mixamp is the fact that it cannot function wirelessly. Independent wireless operation of the E5 has been mentioned by a few console gamers as a significant benefit, even if it lacks virtual surround or Dolby Headphone right now.  
Sorry if this comes off as a blunt statement, but this is what comes to my mind.
Edit: Astro does have wireless A50 headset + ampdac, but the 5.4Ghz mixamp isn't sold as a standalone unit.

 
Neither the G5 or E5 can decode Dolby Digital. That means no virtual surround sound on consoles. Only the X7 can decode Dolby Digital.
 

Spoiler: Quote: Fegefeuer

Originally Posted by Fegefeuer /img/forum/go_quote.gif

The main difference is also that you guys did terribly wrong with the G5 by not supporting SBX 5.1 via consoles (fed with Dolby Digital/AC3) while giving the G5 LO/optical out "Headphone Mode" support but not to your 399/499 Dollars products aka the X7/X7 LE.

 
Agreed that the E5/G5 should have been able to decode Dolby Digital. I don't know what kind of hardware is needed to do that but it was a pretty big oversight and would have allowed the E5/G5 to compete with the Astro Mixamp. I get questions all the time from people wanting a DAC/Amp for their computer and their consoles.
 
At least the E5 can now do 7.1 Virtual Surround Sound on PC. Only took a year.
 
The E5 and G5 should however be able to appear as a 5.1 Speaker System in Windows Speaker configuration as some games do not output audio properly when it is set to 7.1. This is a fault in some game engines rather than the E5/G5 but there are many times where it is much safer to set the E5/G5 to 5.1 Speaker configuration rather than 7.1.
 
Many games are 5.1 maximum anyway and if the E5/G5 supported 5.1 Speaker configuration you could use WASAPI for 5.1 movies which at the moment you can't.
 

Spoiler: Quote: DigitalRonyn

Originally Posted by DigitalRonyn /img/forum/go_quote.gif

Ushi, noted on the EQ and I'll talk to the team on this one for you. The Android charging thing is waiting on a response from Google...we're making headway. Hoping we can get it resolved very soon.

 
I'd like a parametric equalizer. Few products offer a parametric equalizer but it is an absolute killer feature that a huge amount of audiophiles want.

 

[panzerfan]

  For the E5 does the headphone input on the front support TRRS Headphone + Mic cables?
 
 
Neither the G5 or E5 can decode Dolby Digital. That means no virtual surround sound on consoles. Only the X7 can decode Dolby Digital.
 
 
Agreed that the E5/G5 should have been able to decode Dolby Digital. I don't know what kind of hardware is needed to do that but it was a pretty big oversight and would have allowed the E5/G5 to compete with the Astro Mixamp. I get questions all the time from people wanting a DAC/Amp for their computer and their consoles.
 
At least the E5 can now do 7.1 Virtual Surround Sound on PC. Only took a year.
 
The E5 and G5 should however be able to appear as a 5.1 Speaker System in Windows Speaker configuration as some games do not output audio properly when it is set to 7.1. This is a fault in some game engines rather than the E5/G5 but there are many times where it is much safer to set the E5/G5 to 5.1 Speaker configuration rather than 7.1.
 
Many games are 5.1 maximum anyway and if the E5/G5 supported 5.1 Speaker configuration you could use WASAPI for 5.1 movies which at the moment you can't.
 
 
I'd like a parametric equalizer. Few products offer a parametric equalizer but it is an absolute killer feature that a huge amount of audiophiles want.

 
Come to think of it, the audio processor SB-Axx1 is said to be a rebadged Core3D, and the older Recon3D which uses that chip had THX TruStudio Pro and THX Surround.

 

[TenMoonsNorth]

So the G5 has Line In and Microphone In as two separate recording devices but the E5 only has Line In/Microphone In share the same ADC?
 
4-pole Headphone-out with Mic: 1 x 3.5mm jack
 
I'm getting the impression that the E5 doesn't support 4 pole headphone out.
 
Bad decision from Creative for Line/Mic In to be the same jack as Optical In. The G5 must have two ADC for Line In on the back and Mic in on the front.
 
The E5 is really in need of a redesign. The E5 and G5 shouldn't be separate products that have these weird differences like the microphone input on the front but instead the E5 should have the capabilities of the G5 but expanded upon. For the new E5 put a mic/headphone combo jack on the left side and supply a cable like this. That way you can keep the dual headphone out gimmick but also have microphone input on the front of the E5.
 
That way a PS3/TV can use optical input, your phone can be connected via bluetooth and your computer can be connected via USB but you can still connect your own microphone via the front.
 
I'm guessing that the Line Out/Optical Out use the same chip which is why only one can be used at once. If they use different chips then they should have separate jacks.
 
It's kind of frustrating but as egotistical as it is to say I'd have pointed this stuff out before you'd started going into production.

 

[ClieOS]

On the other hand I'll like my next E5 to strip clean of any gaming related features and just be (*elevate to) a great portable DAC/amp for music while letting G5 be the game related DAC/amp as it is. Because right now all I see is identity crisis and half-baked performance. Different stroke for different folks I guess.

 

[TenMoonsNorth]

  On the other hand I'll like my next E5 to strip clean of any gaming related features and just be (*elevate to) a great portable DAC/amp for music while letting G5 be the game related DAC/amp as it is. Because right now all I see is identity crisis and half-baked performance. Different stroke for different folks I guess.

 
I have no idea why you even have an E5 in the first place then. There are loads of basic portable DAC/Amps with a battery.
 
The basic DAC/Amp market is extremely competitive with Fiio releasing great products at lower price points and Schiit having exceptional standards of DAC/Amp engineering that lock down the <$200 market. The majority of recommendations for a first DAC/Amp are Fiio, Schiit or the ODAC/O2.
 
However, Creative actually brings something unique and can do things that neither Fiio or Schiit can. Those features are the SBX Pro Studio with Virtual Surround Sound, the microphone input, bluetooth support and the hardware mixer. Nobody has a hardware mixer at this price point and it's a feature that a lot of people care about. Being able to connect your phone via bluetooth and have that audio mixed with your computer and game console is a big selling feature to a lot of people. The virtual surround sound is a big selling feature to gamers. The /r/Headphones daily purchase advice sticky constantly has people asking for their first DAC/Amp to go with their first pair of audiophile headphones for gaming. This is a market that Creative can nail that neither Schiit or Fiio can but there still needs to be changes to the E5 and G5.
 
The lack of microphone input on the front is an issue for the E5, the volume control being linked to Windows is universally disliked, the low gain is too high and the lack of Dolby Digital decoding. Anything else usually comes down to minor complaints about build materials, switch feel and lowering the output impedance more.
 
With those things fixed the E5 and G5 would be godly. It's just frustrating that it requires this many product iterations.

 

[jincuteguy]

So are they updating the E5 to have 7.1 SBX like the G5? CAuse I know right  now the E5 can only do stereo for Surround sound, cause we can't set the speaker config to 5.1.

 

[jincuteguy]

  Hey there folks,

Wanted to note that in a few days we'll be posting a firmware update with a couple highly requested features rolled in.
 
1. We'll be adding 7.1 virtual surround support (similar to our G5 unit). This means the device will appear as a 7.1 device to your operating system and will utilize all channels for virtualization versus just the current stereo channels. You can switch between stereo or surround in the UI.
 
2. We're adding virtual surround for headphones over the line / optical output.
 
We're looking to have this out prior to Xmas..so keep an eye on the website.

 
Are you guys adding #2 (Virtual surround for Headphone over the line / optical output) for the X7 as well?????

 

[TenMoonsNorth]

  So are they updating the E5 to have 7.1 SBX like the G5? CAuse I know right  now the E5 can only do stereo for Surround sound, cause we can't set the speaker config to 5.1.

 
It will be a firmware/software update. It hasn't been released yet.

 

[panzerfan]

   
 
However, Creative actually brings something unique and can do things that neither Fiio or Schiit can. Those features are the SBX Pro Studio with Virtual Surround Sound, the microphone input, bluetooth support and the hardware mixer. Nobody has a hardware mixer at this price point and it's a feature that a lot of people care about. Being able to connect your phone via bluetooth and have that audio mixed with your computer and game console is a big selling feature to a lot of people. The virtual surround sound is a big selling feature to gamers. The /r/Headphones daily purchase advice sticky constantly has people asking for their first DAC/Amp to go with their first pair of audiophile headphones for gaming. This is a market that Creative can nail that neither Schiit or Fiio can but there still needs to be changes to the E5 and G5.
 
The lack of microphone input on the front is an issue for the E5, the volume control being linked to Windows is universally disliked, the low gain is too high and the lack of Dolby Digital decoding. Anything else usually comes down to minor complaints about build materials, switch feel and lowering the output impedance more.
 
With those things fixed the E5 and G5 would be godly. It's just frustrating that it requires this many product iterations.

 
We are forced to lose the optical in when we are using the external microphone with E5, which is a bit of a shame. The Mixamp is not limited in this sense. The fact that a haphazard adapter is needed to split out the 4-poles is a hassle. I use the E5 this way, and given USB in for console usage is not workable, this need to use that headset adapter is a major oversight for the E5 as a gaming amp/dac. 

 

[TenMoonsNorth]

Spoiler: Quote: panzerfan

Originally Posted by panzerfan /img/forum/go_quote.gif

We are forced to lose the optical in when we are using the external microphone with E5, which is a bit of a shame. The Mixamp is not limited in this sense. The fact that a haphazard adapter is needed to split out the 4-poles is a hassle. I use the E5 this way, and given USB in for console usage is not workable, this need to use that headset adapter is a major oversight for the E5 as a gaming amp/dac. 

 
Losing Optical input for a Microphone input was a bad decision on the E5. The smart decision from Creative would have been to put a headphone/mic combo jack on the front and supply that cable I linked to earlier. Then they can keep their dual headphone out and we get Optical and Microphone input. Multi jacks like the Optical/Line In and Optical/Line out should really be avoided unless the chips are mutually exclusive which I think they likely are.

 

[panzerfan]

   
Losing Optical input for a Microphone input was a bad decision on the E5. The smart decision from Creative would have been to put a headphone/mic combo jack on the front and supply that cable I linked to earlier. Then they can keep their dual headphone out and we get Optical and Microphone input.

 
Only one of the jacks up front being a combo jack would do. 
 
Come to think of it, has anyone ever considered if E5 can be made to support balanced output? We have two stereo out up front and all, and if that's available, then E5 will have a feature that simply goes unmatched (as I can think of nothing that has a 3.5mm balanced output)

 

[TenMoonsNorth]

Spoiler: Quote: panzerfan

Originally Posted by panzerfan /img/forum/go_quote.gif

 
Only one of the jacks up front being a combo jack would do. 
 
Come to think of it, has anyone ever considered if E5 can be made to support balanced output? We have two stereo out up front and all, and if that's available, then E5 will have a feature that simply goes unmatched (as I can think of nothing that has a 3.5mm balanced output)

 
I don't think it's balanced. I think it's just two headphones out being powered by the same chip in the same way that you can get headphone splitter cables.

 

[panzerfan]

   
I don't think it's balanced. I think it's just two headphones out being powered by the same chip in the same way that you can get headphone splitter cables.

 
Yeah, I know. I tried it. It's a bit of a shame too, because the chip is definitely capable of separating out and feeding different audio signal to to the two jacks. This thing has the muscle for it. 
 
E5 is on the cusp of greatness here. If E5 can handle two independent simultaneous audio stream outputs  (Xbox steam from left output and phone from the right), and to be able to configure the two outputs to balanced mode on a dime, then the E5 will have no equal whatsoever.  

 

[TenMoonsNorth]

Spoiler: Quote: panzerfan

Originally Posted by panzerfan /img/forum/go_quote.gif

Yeah, I know. It's a bit of a shame too, because the chip is definitely capable of separating out and feeding different audio signal to to the two jacks. This thing has the muscle for it.   
E5 is on the cusp of greatness here. If E5 can handle two simultaneous audio stream outputs (Xbox steam from left output and phone from the right), and to be able to configure the two outputs to balanced mode on a dime, then the E5 will have no equal to it whatsoever.  

 
I'm just assuming I don't know but I've never cared for dual headphone outs unless each has their separate volume control. I think it's a feature that general consumers want which is why it was included. I don't mind if it's included but I'm annoyed that Creative never thought of putting a Headphone/Mic combo jack on the front.