[dallan]

Quote:

Originally Posted by majkel /img/forum/go_quote.gif Their personality is indeed very difficult to resolve.

I don't find it difficult myself, they are just neutral and reveal upstream component quality every time i have heard them, and I have heard them on a lot of setups, some good some bad. One of the few that I thought was a good set up that they didn't sound good on was the TTVJ 307a-sounded thin to me but otherwise they sound very revealing. I have worked on my own system since getting them though because it showed the holes in my set up more than my other HPs. For instance, I could get away with stuff with my DX1000s, which are great phones and I am actually listening to them more now that the newness has worn off the 800s. Still I I really want to hear something with all of my attention, the 800s do it. By the way, I am not a seller or manufacture by any means for the more paranoid fringe out here.

As far as the L3000s go, i do like those too and if i ever have a chance to pick up a pair they will probably be the last pair I ever get, I am covered at this point, those would just be icing.

 

[Uncle Erik]

Quote:

Originally Posted by majkel /img/forum/go_quote.gif Their personality is indeed very difficult to resolve.

Very true. Like Dallan said, the HD-800 is a picky little thing when it comes to upstream components. I've really be able to hear the difference between amps - and even tubes - with the HD-800. They're also fussy about the recordings you use. I've found SACD to go particularly well with them - hi-rez really shines. Vinyl, too, but you better have an especially clean record.

I know that makes them hard to get a handle on, but the upside is that you can tailor them to your tastes. Assuming massive transparency and the (alleged) lack of bass are to your liking.

Like most of the top headphones, you have to build a system around the HD-800. They're unforgiving, however, they give great components an opportunity to shine.

 

[IPodPJ]

...and you aren't doing justice to them unless you balanced them.

 

[majkel]

Uncle Erik agreed, the HD800 is transparent in terms of showing you every little bit of change in the signal chain, and they do it reliably but I wouldn't say they are just neutral. Their tonal balance is comfortable and the treble extension can make you scared as you hear the details, i.e. in electronic sampled music, as if they were happening somwhere around you. Many sounds seem to be realistic. For example I had impression of tearing the diaphragms of their transducers while these were just samples in the Basement Jaxx track. Generally I could say, they don't add obvious things, and they don't subtract any considerable amounts of the music delivered. However I think they have a bit shortened decay which makes the sounds don't fade away naturally like a bird flying away and disappearing in the sky. I'd expect more reverb and "wind" flowing from time to time across the soundstage. Their bass also doesn't produce the air blow and is a bit damped. Good sides are speed, tonal richness, overall neutral timbre, frequency response well extended on both ends, good comfort with a small issue of lots of training necessary to wear them properly in terms of correct reception. Maybe it's due to the hole in the diaphragm? And the last thing - they have a slight tendency to rumble in region of several hundred Hz. It is obvious on the Schumann piano concertos recording with Ronan O'Hora, where the piano was recorded from a close perspective to the string box. Lower notes flicker a bit which doesn't take place on my GS1000 and I didn't notice it as well on the PS1000. The latter have in the opposition to the HD800 very accurate decay... and terrific bass.

 

[nor_spoon]

Quote:

Originally Posted by IPodPJ /img/forum/go_quote.gif ...and you aren't doing justice to them unless you balanced them.

Yeah, right lol! And, you will also need the SAA Voice cable. That's what they tell you at their site

 

[Currawong]

The HD-800s are terrible headphones -- they simply demand the best of everything to sound good. They aren't the kind of headphones that you plug into whatever system you have and are amazed, as they just reveal anything that's less than perfect. Rather like an auditor really, they come in, tell you every tiny thing that's wrong and you end up hating them for it, unless the problems are minor, not major. Senneheiser's aim for perfection is as much their curse as their blessing. I think as people on Head-fi mostly listen to music for pleasure, they aren't really an ideal headphone for many of us in that respect.

 

[majkel]

I wouldn't rate the HD800 so dramatically. IMHO, it's easier to satisfy them than the Grado GS1000 or PS1000 which provide fatigue instead of bliss when you don't have the proper key to the door of their sonic palace.

 

[Blackmore]

Well, if you come from HD650, maybe they are, mean general. Not when you re-cable HD650 with USD 500 wire and get USD 2000 amp for them, which makes them total different headphone.

Quote:

Originally Posted by majkel /img/forum/go_quote.gif I wouldn't rate the HD800 so dramatically. IMHO, it's easier to satisfy them than the Grado GS1000 or PS1000 which provide fatigue instead of bliss when you don't have the proper key to the door of their sonic palace.

 

[Currawong]

I'm keen to try the PS1000s sometime, unfortunately I'm living in the wrong country to do that any other way than buying them.

 

[majkel]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blackmore /img/forum/go_quote.gif Well, if you come from HD650, maybe they are, mean general. Not when you re-cable HD650 with USD 500 wire and get USD 2000 amp for them, which makes them total different headphone.

So what would you do, invest the HD650 or just buy other headphones? I know people running the HD650 with Zu Mobius from the Woo 5... but I'll know the impressions against the HD800 from them as well, hopefully soon.

 

[Blackmore]

Would buy another headphones, or even better speakers, cos new they are like EUR 300+EUR 300 re-cable, hmmm, its almost a pretty nice pair of used monitors. For example I found one pair, used, celestion SL-700SE, asking price EUR 699 include original stands. All I can say, yes, they are old, 1994, I believe, but like many NOS tubes we use, old as well, but sound wise way better than many present production ones. And if I have to believe Stereophile review, must be very good one, even these days.
The best HD650 set up I have tried, to my liking, was HD650+RAL cable and Zana. Another one was with balanced cable, not sure which one, and Rudi RPX100, didn't like it at all.

Quote:

Originally Posted by majkel /img/forum/go_quote.gif So what would you do, invest the HD650 or just buy other headphones? I know people running the HD650 with Zu Mobius from the Woo 5... but I'll know the impressions against the HD800 from them as well, hopefully soon.

 

[sonq]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skylab /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yup - they are either absolutely perfect, a huge disappointment, or somewhere in between

When a phone sound disappointing, some of us may be too quick to place all blame on the phone.

Since we're not just listening to the phone itself but a whole chain of components from source onward, we may need to slow down and identify the source of problem before bashing the phone.

BTW, my brief experience of the HD800 through a Lehmann Black Box was disappointing.

 

[Uncle Erik]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Currawong /img/forum/go_quote.gif The HD-800s are terrible headphones -- they simply demand the best of everything to sound good. They aren't the kind of headphones that you plug into whatever system you have and are amazed, as they just reveal anything that's less than perfect. Rather like an auditor really, they come in, tell you every tiny thing that's wrong and you end up hating them for it, unless the problems are minor, not major. Senneheiser's aim for perfection is as much their curse as their blessing. I think as people on Head-fi mostly listen to music for pleasure, they aren't really an ideal headphone for many of us in that respect.

I don't disagree with your assessment, however, the HD-800 pays off if you do have good upstream components. If they're amped well and you have a great recording, you can fade into sonic bliss like few other headphones allow. $1,400 for the HD-800 is just the beginning. You have to spend a bit more than that to wring the best out of them. I think they're worth it.

 

[feifan]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Currawong /img/forum/go_quote.gif The HD-800s are terrible headphones -- they simply demand the best of everything to sound good. They aren't the kind of headphones that you plug into whatever system you have and are amazed, as they just reveal anything that's less than perfect. Rather like an auditor really, they come in, tell you every tiny thing that's wrong and you end up hating them for it, unless the problems are minor, not major. Senneheiser's aim for perfection is as much their curse as their blessing. I think as people on Head-fi mostly listen to music for pleasure, they aren't really an ideal headphone for many of us in that respect.

This has to be among the best comments made about the HD800. Says it all, in a nutshell.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sonq /img/forum/go_quote.gif When a phone sound disappointing, some of us may be too quick to place all blame on the phone. Since we're not just listening to the phone itself but a whole chain of components from source onward, we may need to slow down and identify the source of problem before bashing the phone.

x2. After reading threads discussing a specific piece of equipment, such as a headphone, I often end up wondering what, exactly, we're reviewing: The 'phone? Or the amp? The DAC? The interconnects? The quality of recordings? The power cord?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uncle Erik /img/forum/go_quote.gif I don't disagree with your assessment [see Currawong's quote above], however, the HD-800 pays off if you do have good upstream components. If they're amped well and you have a great recording, you can fade into sonic bliss like few other headphones allow. $1,400 for the HD-800 is just the beginning. You have to spend a bit more than that to wring the best out of them. I think they're worth it.

I like that word "wring" because it's better than "tweak" in describing how I burn out trying to get the best SQ out of my system. The fact is, even when you have the right parts sitting like ducks in a row, you still have to futz endlessly with countless tiny hardware or software adjustments and controls. Any one of these will make or break the setup for you. Sometimes I think it's blind luck that I actually find the best lineups that lead to audio nirvana. Sadly, all the other paths lead to dead-ends that make you feel frustrated. So close, yet so far.

 

[music_man]

i just found this thread while searching for something else.

it seems every one that buys whatever are the latest super cans proclaim them as the best they ever heard. indeed. they bought them and paid a lot to boot. they are going to think they are the best. for whatever reason. to those people they probably are the best. i don't doubt 'their' ears. to my ears, the best phones were made long ago. with names like r10,010,l3000,o2,hp2. i have been doing this long enough to not get sucked into the hype. when something better to me comes along then i will bite.

i think the hd800 is a step up from the hd6xx. well sort of in a different direction. to me it does not dethrone the aforementioned ones.

besides the qualia is a work of art and a lot more money than the hd800. it is like replacing a lamborghini with a lotus. they are both great super cars but the lotus is a step down.

in case you were wondering the qualia is not my favorite dynamic either. that place is taken by another sony product

to the op, i didn't see if you have the lavry gold. if you do i wouldn't trashcan that! on the otherhand i wouldn't use it as a headphone amp either. i'd use it as a dac.

oops, it was a grace....different league. now, the 010 with a lavry gold and an ear hp4 was what i was thinking! that should sound pretty good. in fact i can actually go try it. i don't think i ever hooked all that together before.

music_man