Chord Mojo(1) DAC-amp ☆★►FAQ in 3rd post!◄★☆
Apr 1, 2021 at 6:56 PM Post #41,341 of 42,765
I wasn't aware the battery acts as a power purifier. Now I'm curious to know how the battery accomplishes this.
Anyway, as i already stated there is no audible difference with or without the battery.
Yeah, maybe my wording was a bit off, sorry about that, I'm not entirely sure if it acts exactly like a "power purifier" but, if you turn off completely your mojo, plug your headphones and then turn it on while using your headphones, you will hear a quick clicking noise in your headphones, that's where the battery comes in place (at least what I think) what's happening without the battery is that you are bypassing the power of the charging circuit directly to your Mojo so when you are starting your unit you are basically tasing the components (theoretically), this is mostly a guess though and there is no direct proof of damaging your unit that I know of.
 
Apr 1, 2021 at 7:01 PM Post #41,342 of 42,765
Yeah, maybe my wording was a bit off, sorry about that, I'm not entirely sure if it acts exactly like a "power purifier" but, if you turn off completely your mojo, plug your headphones and then turn it on while using your headphones, you will hear a quick clicking noise in your headphones, that's where the battery comes in place (at least what I think) what's happening without the battery is that you are bypassing the power of the charging circuit directly to your Mojo so when you are starting your unit you are basically tasing the components (theoretically), this is mostly a guess though and there is no direct proof of damaging your unit that I know of.

That's an interesting theory, however there is nothing to worry about in my case because the Mojo feeds an external amp and i power both units 'before' plugging my headphones.
 
Apr 1, 2021 at 7:03 PM Post #41,343 of 42,765
I guess i don't quite understand the super capacitor mod. I thought it replaces the battery, but then you mention you get 20hr of battery life and replace it with a 5V charger.
I thought the battery was out of the equation? I'm totally confused.

Edit: Wait, is the thing strapped to your Mojo an external battery charging the super cap? I read you strapped your iPhone, hence the confusion.
Exactly, what's strapped is a battery, and the battery life is the time the battery strapped lasts (approximately) while using the unit, I can either use a charger to use the unit or simply use the power bank, I prefer the power bank because it's a cleaner source of power rather than the household socket.

Actually, in your setup, it might be even a good idea to add the power bank... Though I'm not sure if the difference would be really that worth the price... or if you are already using some kind of power purifier before feeding the unit
 
Apr 1, 2021 at 7:09 PM Post #41,344 of 42,765
That's an interesting theory, however there is nothing to worry about in my case because the Mojo feeds an external amp and i power both units 'before' plugging my headphones.
Yeah, I don't think it's a big deal either, in the end, I think that when I started that "mod" it was my curiosity over the "real threat" all I thought was; "hey, better safe than sorry.", funny enough I'm not entirely sure if shoving potential firecracker inside my mojo was the best desition... haha
 
Apr 1, 2021 at 7:23 PM Post #41,345 of 42,765
Exactly, what's strapped is a battery, and the battery life is the time the battery strapped lasts (approximately) while using the unit, I can either use a charger to use the unit or simply use the power bank, I prefer the power bank because it's a cleaner source of power rather than the household socket.

Actually, in your setup, it might be even a good idea to add the power bank... Though I'm not sure if the difference would be really that worth the price... or if you are already using some kind of power purifier before feeding the unit

Ok, i understand your previous post now, thank you for the clarifications but still not sure what the benefit of the super cap is?

Edit: Try this; open your Mojo, disconnect the super cap, close the Mojo, connect your external battery bank and see if you notice a SQ difference.
 
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Apr 1, 2021 at 7:47 PM Post #41,346 of 42,765
Ok, i understand your previous post now, thank you for the clarifications but still not sure what the benefit of the super cap is?

Edit: Try this; open your Mojo, disconnect the super cap, close the Mojo, connect your external battery bank and see if you notice a SQ difference.
I'll do the test though, there shouldn't be any noticeable difference, I think that in the end, what's happening here is just that I'm adding kind of a surge protector let's say? I think that if there was a real advantage the team at Chord would've implemented it in one way or another. But let's check for the sake of curiosity!
 
Apr 2, 2021 at 1:51 AM Post #41,347 of 42,765
Alright... so maybe this is a bit fast, but I've been listening to some albums that I know I know without the supercapacitor and, right away... (controversy incoming) there is a noticeable difference between dynamics in the instruments, (sounds flat) the clarity is there but it feels like you just have moved from being fully wrapped in the music to listening from further away and instruments are not as "dynamic".

Now, this might be true given that using a constant energy source capped to a certain voltage and amps might reduce the dynamism of the signal but I'm possibly talking gibberish there so take that last comment with a grain of salt. I'm just a software developer who loves music and likes to thinker around man haha
 
Apr 2, 2021 at 5:41 AM Post #41,348 of 42,765
Alright... so maybe this is a bit fast, but I've been listening to some albums that I know I know without the supercapacitor and, right away... (controversy incoming) there is a noticeable difference between dynamics in the instruments, (sounds flat) the clarity is there but it feels like you just have moved from being fully wrapped in the music to listening from further away and instruments are not as "dynamic".

Now, this might be true given that using a constant energy source capped to a certain voltage and amps might reduce the dynamism of the signal but I'm possibly talking gibberish there so take that last comment with a grain of salt. I'm just a software developer who loves music and likes to thinker around man haha
Actually that was expected.
Once I said we are not clever enough to re-engineer this device.
I said that, because Mojo was designed from ground up, by an expert engineering team, so every section interacts with other parts perfectly.
It was designed as a mobile device (Mo in Mojo), on a budget! so things it does not need, it does not have.
A mobile device works on Batteries, so it does not require a traditional power supply section, so it does not have it! (Galvanic Isolation is another, it does not have it)
All it requires is a charging circuit for the batteries, no more no less.
The internal battery is rated at 7.4V , it needs around 8.2V to charge up, so the charger should be good for about 9 or 10V.
Six years ago, when it was launched, it was decided that it should use standard USB power for charging - but USB only provides 5V !
So inside the device there is a DC to DC voltage doubler, basically it upscales the available 5V to about 10V. It does this in a switch-mode fashion. Active circuitry, creates pulses of voltage at double the USB voltage ( you hear this fast switching as a fizz when it is charging). these pulses carry a lot of electrical noise, but when connected to a large capacitor or a battery, the noise gets absorbed by the battery or the capacitor, creating an average steady DC voltage, to charge the batteries.
The charging circuit has voltage & current controls with thermal monitoring. Charging LiPo's is a delicate balancing act.
The charging circuit inside Mojo fits the bill, it is horses for courses, no more no less.
Now if one disconnects the battery, and try to use the charging circuit as a powersupply, it will not do!
OK it evidently operates, but that noise gets everywhere, furthermore, a battery or a large capacitor has very low internal impedance, ability to provide big current when needed - a charging circuit is far from it.
In this case, the super capacitors (very large capacity capacitor but small in dimension), absorb the pulses and provide low impedance power for Mojo, but batteries are better!
If one could get an outboard battery pack of 7.4V, connect it directly to the battery terminals, that would do.
If such a battery should have fast charging, so much the better.

I remember in the old days, there were head amps for low output moving-coil cartridges, that ran on batteries as no powersupply was clean enough.
If one needs to use Mojo as a desktop all the time, the best scenario would be, removing the batteries, replacing them with super capacitors, use a very clean outboard 7.5V powersupply , connected inside Mojo directly to the super capacitors.
Avoiding the charging circuit should be goal, as even using external batteries connected to Mojo through the USB port (and the charging circuit) would still be a noisy operation.
 
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Apr 2, 2021 at 7:40 AM Post #41,349 of 42,765
That's exactly what i do when using the Mojo on the go (since removing the internal battery); i connect a portable battery bank which powers the device, therefore I'm not sure what the benefit of the super cap is.
Using USB power or external batteries connected to the charging port of Mojo, sends the power through the charging circuit - there is no other way, unless you connect your external battery directly to the battery terminals inside Mojo.
Any power connected to the charging USB port, activates the charging circuit, until Mojo decides the battery is fully charged - but since you have taken the internal battery out, it never happens.
You continue to power Mojo using the noisy charger circuit.
Super capacitors, go a long way to clean up the noise.
 
Apr 2, 2021 at 8:41 AM Post #41,350 of 42,765
Using USB power or external batteries connected to the charging port of Mojo, sends the power through the charging circuit - there is no other way, unless you connect your external battery directly to the battery terminals inside Mojo.
Any power connected to the charging USB port, activates the charging circuit, until Mojo decides the battery is fully charged - but since you have taken the internal battery out, it never happens.
You continue to power Mojo using the noisy charger circuit.
Super capacitors, go a long way to clean up the noise.
This is only an issue if using the Mojo while connected to an external power right? Not something that matters when powering the device via it's internal battery and regardless of input (usb, coax...)
 
Apr 2, 2021 at 9:51 AM Post #41,351 of 42,765
This is only an issue if using the Mojo while connected to an external power right? Not something that matters when powering the device via it's internal battery and regardless of input (usb, coax...)
Correct.
 
Apr 2, 2021 at 1:25 PM Post #41,352 of 42,765
Actually that was expected.
Once I said we are not clever enough to re-engineer this device.
I said that, because Mojo was designed from ground up, by an expert engineering team, so every section interacts with other parts perfectly.
It was designed as a mobile device (Mo in Mojo), on a budget! so things it does not need, it does not have.
A mobile device works on Batteries, so it does not require a traditional power supply section, so it does not have it! (Galvanic Isolation is another, it does not have it)
All it requires is a charging circuit for the batteries, no more no less.
The internal battery is rated at 7.4V , it needs around 8.2V to charge up, so the charger should be good for about 9 or 10V.
Six years ago, when it was launched, it was decided that it should use standard USB power for charging - but USB only provides 5V !
So inside the device there is a DC to DC voltage doubler, basically it upscales the available 5V to about 10V. It does this in a switch-mode fashion. Active circuitry, creates pulses of voltage at double the USB voltage ( you hear this fast switching as a fizz when it is charging). these pulses carry a lot of electrical noise, but when connected to a large capacitor or a battery, the noise gets absorbed by the battery or the capacitor, creating an average steady DC voltage, to charge the batteries.
The charging circuit has voltage & current controls with thermal monitoring. Charging LiPo's is a delicate balancing act.
The charging circuit inside Mojo fits the bill, it is horses for courses, no more no less.
Now if one disconnects the battery, and try to use the charging circuit as a powersupply, it will not do!
OK it evidently operates, but that noise gets everywhere, furthermore, a battery or a large capacitor has very low internal impedance, ability to provide big current when needed - a charging circuit is far from it.
In this case, the super capacitors (very large capacity capacitor but small in dimension), absorb the pulses and provide low impedance power for Mojo, but batteries are better!
If one could get an outboard battery pack of 7.4V, connect it directly to the battery terminals, that would do.
If such a battery should have fast charging, so much the better.

I remember in the old days, there were head amps for low output moving-coil cartridges, that ran on batteries as no powersupply was clean enough.
If one needs to use Mojo as a desktop all the time, the best scenario would be, removing the batteries, replacing them with super capacitors, use a very clean outboard 7.5V powersupply , connected inside Mojo directly to the super capacitors.
Avoiding the charging circuit should be goal, as even using external batteries connected to Mojo through the USB port (and the charging circuit) would still be a noisy operation.
Interesting, so maybe I should replace that supercapacitor, given that it is rated as (5.4V 5F) I've found one that is similarly rated as the battery (7.4V 6F -yay 2 extra seconds of battery life-) I might be putting in danger my unit... not by much but the capacitor will definitely fail.

I'm also totally in agreement with what you say about how we are not clever enough to re-engineer this device. In the end, what I'm doing is trial and error and most definitely I do not have the resources to actually understand the device (schematics and such) nor the expertise of Chord's team.

These are super interesting topics! good to see a community this invested!
 
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Apr 2, 2021 at 1:59 PM Post #41,353 of 42,765
What do you guys think about moving this discussion about modding the Mojo battery and power supply to a dedicated thread?
It's been about 40 posts in a row about this topic and it is becoming very hard to follow any non-modding related posts.
Happy modding!
 
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Apr 4, 2021 at 2:44 PM Post #41,354 of 42,765
how long have you had your mojo for? I’m wondering about the longevity before the battery needs replacing.
 
Apr 4, 2021 at 3:03 PM Post #41,355 of 42,765
3yrs. And I decided to convert it to a desktop DAC/Amp, very satisfied with my decision. However, the battery was still good (5+ hrs).
 

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