[DaveRedRef-III]

Thanks for the detailed comments Rob. I do not have the technical knowledge to agree or refute your claim so I will just say that experience has taught me there is almost always more than one way of achieving something. Yours is not the only 'naturally musical' solution out there Rob. producers/engineers have acclaimed MQA as incredibly natural and musical. In the hours of interviews that Bob Stuart has devoted to the subject I have heard him talk (like you) about zero noise floor modulation but no mention of tap length. Perhaps he is holding that back perhaps not. I think it is healthy to have an open mind on the subject. Even Einstein didn't have all his theories proved correct. What really matters to me is enjoying musicality and Dave does that for me so certainly improved tap length has helped in that pursuit.

 

[JaZZ]

Thanks for the detailed comments Rob. I do not have the technical knowledge to agree or refute your claim so I will just say that experience has taught me there is almost always more than one way of achieving something. Yours is not the only 'naturally musical' solution out there Rob. producers/engineers have acclaimed MQA as incredibly natural and musical. In the hours of interviews that Bob Stuart has devoted to the subject I have heard him talk (like you) about zero noise floor modulation but no mention of tap length. Perhaps he is holding that back perhaps not. I think it is healthy to have an open mind on the subject. Even Einstein didn't have all his theories proved correct. What really matters to me is enjoying musicality and Dave does that for me so certainly improved tap length has helped in that pursuit.

 
As I see it, it's in fact the open mind which has enabled Rob to achieve such a high level of musicality and accuracy of digital music reproduction. Who would have thought that the human ears and brains are so sensitive! That explains a lot, e.g. also in terms of cable sound, which is swept aside by many not so open minds.
 
I for one fully trust Rob and his philosophy, of which I understand maybe 66% after all (of course not in detail). A perfect reconstruction of the original analogue signal is the crucial point, without a doubt, and that's what he cares for with unmatched diligence. Probably because no other manufacturer/developer has the same programming skills combined with ultra-fine hearing – add to this the famous openmindedness. I will buy DAVE blindly – not least influenced by your review –, and it will be by far the greatest expense of my hi-fi career.

 

[Kakki]

Rob, it is commonly said that the capacitors, resistors, and even solders have specific sound signature so that hifi product designers often do listening tests, swapping those analogue components to adjust the product sound.
 
Is this the case with you and your product as well?
 
Also, even for the surface-mount type of components, we have resistors / capacitors in wide range of price from few cents each to $10 each... what was your philosophy or approach when selecting analogue components for Dave? I'm a bit curious about that.

 

[Mython]

  Rob, it is commonly said that the capacitors, resistors, and even solders have specific sound signature so that hifi product designers often do listening tests, swapping those analogue components to adjust the product sound.
 
Is this the case with you and your product as well?
 
Also, even for the surface-mount type of components, we have resistors / capacitors in wide range of price from few cents each to $10 each... what was your philosophy or approach when selecting analogue components for Dave? I'm a bit curious about that.

 

  .... sometimes a balanced connection does sound better than single ended (SE) - in a pre-power context - but it depends upon the environment, and the pre and power and the interconnect. But the downside of balanced is that you are doubling the number of analogue components in the direct signal path, and this degrades transparency. In my experience every passive component is audible, every metal to metal interface (including solder joints - I once had a lot of fun listening to solder) has an impact - in case of metal/metal interfaces it degrades detail resolution and the perception of depth. So going balanced will have a cost in transparency.
 
In DAC design, going balanced is essential with silicon design; there is simply too much substrate noise and other effects not too. But with discrete DAC's you do not need to worry about this, so going SE on a discrete DAC is possible, and is how all my DAC's are done. But differential operation hides certain problems (notably reference circuit) that has serious SQ effects; so going SE means those problems are exposed, which forces one to solve the issue fundamentally. In short, to make SE work you have to solve many more problems, but the result of solving those problems solves SQ issues than differential operation hides when you do measurements.
 
In the case of Dave, I have gotten state of the art measured performance - distortion harmonics below -150 dB, zero measurable noise floor modulation - and there is no way you could do this with a differential architecture. So it is possible to have better measured performance with SE than differential, but it is a lot harder to do it - indeed, the only way of getting virtually zero distortion and noise floor modulation is SE.  
 
Rob 

 
 
(NB: bold emphasis added by me)

 

[musicday]

Hello Rob and John,
Thank you for your wonderful products, Hugo,Mojo and now the amazing Dave.
Where can we listen to the last around shows in London any time soon?

 

[Skampmeister]

Hello Rob and John,
Thank you for your wonderful products, Hugo,Mojo and now the amazing Dave.
Where can we listen to the last around shows in London any time soon?

Don't forget the 2Qute, the better of the three, IMO

 

[Music2move]

 
I don't think dCS/MSB/PS Audio truly hung their hat on DSD. dCS uses the Ring DAC which is probably closer to a multi-bit PCM DAC or even Rob's multi-element pulse array DAC than true DSD. MSB is a modified R2R ladder DAC so has nothing to do with DSD. PS Audio talks about DSD all the time but really, it is a DAC that upsamples everything probably to high-res PCM first and then to 10xDSD and then downsamples it to 2xDSD for the DAC. Everyone talks about DSD so every DAC feels like they have to have DSD support. But it's all a lie. Most DACs converts the DSD back into PCM before sending it to the DAC for playback. Even the so-called DSD DACs mostly converts the standard DSD signal into PCM, run it through a low-pass filter first and then re-convert the signal into 2xDSD before playback.
 
I think Rob Watts' main point is that he believe DSD as a recording format actually encodes less information than PCM because of timing/transient issues and because of limited ability for dithering of ultra low-level noise.
 
But I think his problem with using a PDM/PWM/DSD DAC to playback the music is completely different. Yes, at standard DSD of 2.8MHz, Watts probably thinks that DSD will have timing issues. But I suspect he would agree that issue can be resolved if the playback is done at 2xDSD or 10xDSD. He said he did not choose an ultra-high-frequency 1-bit DSD/PWM DAC design and opted for the multi-element pulse array DAC design because he finds a pure PWM/DSD DAC would cause jitter to be modulation-dependent, adding more jitter and noise, particularly more noise-floor modulation in the end. And obviously, he believes all these factors determine the quality of ultra-high-end DACs. I guess I will have to wait for my Chord DAVE to find out for myself. But I'm currently very happy with my Chord QBD76HDSD so I'd like to think Rob Watts knows what he is talking about.

Hi , would like to hear DAVE when available, having owned QBD76 ( non HD version), and befor that, Chord DAC64.  IMO, I felt that balanced XLR digital dual connections from Chord Blu CD transport, and balanced analogue  outputs sound lovely, more space and grace. Again, based on my exposure, this DAC ( DAVE ) from Chord promises much excitement.
 
After stints listening to PCM DACs ( Calyx Femto owner now, and compared it to Gryphon Kalliope over several hours at dealer ), the dual ESS 9018 DACs were dynamic and portrayed lots of energy, contrast and leading edge definition.   dCS Vivaldi ( full 4-box set, cannot remember what connections used ) directly driving D'Agostino momentum monoblocks to Wilson Alexias,  then best of all to Kharma Exquisite Reference 1a speakers, let me better appreciate their clarity, depth and " front-row " immediacy.  Now happiest with DSD DACs  from Nagra HD DAC and EMM Labs XDS1v2  to flesh out the musical images within 4-6 rows from performances near as live at the concert recital venue , at least as I can recall from my sitting positions at the venues, with a natural musicality, space and depth , and portrayal of small shifts of timbre, emphasis and musical flow.
 
Just my opinion and prior experiences.  Thx for the journey,  M2m

 

[smial1966]

musicday,
 
Why not just contact your nearest authorised Chord dealer, as they should be receiving stock of DAVE imminently.  
 
Quote:

Hello Rob and John,
Thank you for your wonderful products, Hugo,Mojo and now the amazing Dave.
Where can we listen to the last around shows in London any time soon?

 

[DaveRedRef-III]

I am stearing clear of comments on sound until Dave is past 170 hours burn in btw (94 hours so far) however I witnessed something when we were decorating the Christmas tree last night. 4 of us present. 2 adults and two teenagers. I was playing Gladys Knight followed by Marvin Gaye 'best of' compilations. All parties present suddenly wanted to stand or dance and sing along where they either knew or guessed the lyrics. The teenagers were unfamiliar with most of the music but you could see their engagement and animation. None of those present bar me have the least bit of interest in hifi but their appreciation of good music was evident. A good sign I think.

 

[smial1966]

Your lovely anecdote sounds very promising and gives me great hope/expectation that DAVE will sound utterly spectacular. 
 
Seasons greetings and a very Merry Christmas. 

 
Quote:

I am stearing clear of comments on sound until Dave is past 170 hours burn in btw (94 hours so far) however I witnessed something when we were decorating the Christmas tree last night. 4 of us present. 2 adults and two teenagers. I was playing Gladys Knight followed by Marvin Gaye 'best of' compilations. All parties present suddenly wanted to stand or dance and sing along where they either knew or guessed the lyrics. The teenagers were unfamiliar with most of the music but you could see their engagement and animation. None of those present bar me have the least bit of interest in hifi but their appreciation of good music was evident. A good sign I think.

 

[bmichels]

I am stearing clear of comments on sound until Dave is past 170 hours burn in btw (94 hours so far) however I witnessed something when we were decorating the Christmas tree last night. 4 of us present. 2 adults and two teenagers. I was playing Gladys Knight followed by Marvin Gaye 'best of' compilations. All parties present suddenly wanted to stand or dance and sing along where they either knew or guessed the lyrics. The teenagers were unfamiliar with most of the music but you could see their engagement and animation. None of those present bar me have the least bit of interest in hifi but their appreciation of good music was evident. A good sign I think.

 
very good sign indeed.
 
So now we need a battle between the 3 pretenders for "Best DAC with a Headphone Out" :  NAGRA HD DAC, TotalDAC D1-Dual (or Mono) &  DAVE.  Who will win ? 

 

[lovethatsound]

very good sign indeed.

So now we need a battle between the 3 pretenders for "Best DAC with a Headphone Out" :  NAGRA HD DAC, TotalDAC D1-Dual (or Mono) &  DAVE.  Who will win ? 

Who will win?that's easy bmichels,the ONE you like the MOST.merry xmas 2 you.

 

[bmichels]

Who will win?that's easy bmichels,the ONE you like the MOST.merry xmas 2 you.

 

[Mavwong]

Man, not so good news for me, I was told by my dealer in Singapore I won't be getting the Dave by end of year. Will in Jan though.

 

[mjdutton]

Love the Mojo and after selling my Hugo need a replacement for the HiFi.  Is there a user manual for the DAVE yet?