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Discussion in 'High-end Audio Forum' started by magiccabbage, May 14, 2015.
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  1. ecwl
    The only times when I've heard DAVE sound bright or too analytical is when we are listening to really horrible recordings (and I mean they have to be really, really horrible) or when the speakers or headphones were bright to begin with (as in on objective measurements, you can see that their treble frequency response is often on the higher/louder end).

    And often, I've found that people get so attached to their favorite speakers or headphones that would normally sound bright with neutral electronics that they specifically chose equipments that tamp down that brightness that are not neutral.

    Obviously, I haven't listened to everyone's system so it's hard for me to comment on every scenario. But at least that's my general experience from listening to my DAVE, moving my DAVE around to various people's systems or Head-Fi meets and from my dealer's DAVE paired with various speakers of his.
    marhol and x RELIC x like this.
  2. JaZZ Contributor
    You can easily tame brightness in an imperfect system (via equalizer – mandatory anyway if you want to maximize sound quality with any real-world sound transducer), but you can't restore lost transparency. So I would choose the most transparent and resolving DAC by all means. That is, if you want a sound close to the original, not a romanticized version of it.
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2019
    pstickne, Christer and MacedonianHero like this.
  3. Deano1974
    Thanks for the info, can you please post pictures of what the Dave and HMS look like with the isolation products


  4. audio_1

    It is physically impossible for the MSB Select DAC to sound better than the Chord Dave and Mscaler / Blu2 on 44.1 kHz material imho. Providing that RF hygiene has been taken care of with Ferrites or Wave cables. The MSB select DAC doesn't upsample, so transient reconstruction and timing are compromised. At the Munich show this year, the MSB Select DAC sounded slow and ponderous with very little emotional involvement with the Music. The Select DAC is very smooth sounding, perhaps like analogue, but not live music. It was partnered with MSB's new power amps and Magico M6 loudspeakers. It may have been the amplifiers or cables, it definitely was not the Magico M6 loudspeakers. They sounded great in the Soulution and Total Dac rooms. This was my assessment at the show. I have since seen 2 posts on What's best forum, that agree with my assessment. When the Dave and Mscaler or Blu2 are setup correctly, the sound quality is unique and not possible with conventional dacs. The timing, dynamics and prat, that leads to a foot tapping listening experience and puts a smile on your face are incredible. I have heard the Dave sound like this in 3 setups, but never any MSB or other dacs. Unfortunately, not in my own system at the moment as I an waiting on new loudspeakers. If your system doesn't time, you will never hear this.
  5. dac64
    Sure! :wink:

    Last edited: Jul 11, 2019
    Christer and ZappaMan like this.
  6. Christer
    Nice Yoga pose. I know from long experience that the headstand is good for me.
    But I did not know it is good for my Qutest and HMS too.
    Do they need much time to learn this?
    I remember it took me more than a few attemps before I mastered it myself many years ago.
    Creative thinking.
    I'll remember this for the tropics this coming winter.Both could get very hot indeed last winter when temperatures reached 34-35C. With the hot heart chakra of HMS facing up, heat dissipation will surely work much better in the headstand pose.
    Cheers CC
  7. TheAttorney
    Here are some photos showing thick and thin damper plates on DAVE and HMS. The black finish is almost identical to DAVE's, as is the depth.
    The Black Ravioli footers are too subtle to photograph properly - I don't think anyone would ever guess that there were audiophile footers under this DAVE.
    These are about 2mm higher than stock.
    The Clearlights are quite a bit higher than that - there are 2 at the back of the HMS and 1 at the front approximately in the middle.

    DAVE 5.jpg DAVE 4.jpg DAVE 3.jpg DAVE 2.jpg DAVE 1.jpg
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2019
    Deano1974 and ZappaMan like this.
  8. BassicScience
    I understand fanboy enthusiasm, but stating that your setup is the only one capable of rendering music with compelling rhythmic drive is beyond silly.
    pstickne likes this.
  9. jlbrach
    is that a pair of susvara's being driven directly from the dave????
  10. audio_1
    I actually said that my system wasn't able to. Please reread my post.
    pstickne likes this.
  11. thomaskong78
    Dave has only 2 watts output.

    Susvara needs at least 20 watts for full dynamics.

    Thus you may try Dave on Susvara with only low volume.
  12. jlbrach
    Susvara most definitely does not require 50 watts but the Dave alone is not up to the task. I currently use the formula s powerman combo and it is outstanding
  13. thomaskong78
    Chord Dave and HMS is very good for the money although not better than MSB Select II as claimed by Fanboys here.

    The nice thing of Chord Dave and HMS is transparent and 3D soundstage which matches MSB Select II in soundstage.

    But if falls short of MSB Select II in dynamics and relaxed analog like texture.

    Impression after spending 30 hours on Stax 009S and KGSSHV Carbon made by loligagger.

    I am using Jays Audio CDT2 MK2 to connect to Lyngdorf 2170 for digital equalization and then to Mscaler and Dave.

    Sablon Panatella BNC digital cables between Mscaler and Dave and Zenwave D4 from transport to Lyngdorf and Silnote Morpheus II from Lyngdorf to Mscaler.

    From Dave to Carbon, I use Analysis Plus XLR cable.

    After 20 hours of use and I had Stax and Carbon compared with my 2 channel system Lansche 4.1(plasma tweeter) driven by Line Magnetic 508 SET (Amperex 6SL7, 1944 Sylvania vt231 Nos tubes, Psavne Acme 805 and 300B tubes).

    My 2 channel system go deeper to 20Hz with better dynamics and deeper soundstage.

    Also my 2 channel system presents slightly more transparency and details.

    Stax and Carbon sounds more intimate but with more realistic focus while the soundstage width are comparable.

    With no eq, Stax and Carbon sounds very dynamic and no weakness of bass except sub 30Hz bass of organ.

    It has a round texture with nuanced details neither hot or bright.

    It is very musical and enjoyable.

    I had done some experiment on equalization with Lyngdorf 2170.

    With gradual eq of 2db up at 7khz and 3 db at 15khz, Stax and Carbon sounds more open and transparent.

    I had paid 60K$ for my speaker and SET amplifier including the cost of tube rolling.

    Stax009S and Carbon costs me 6500$ used ( Stax009S were 4 months old and Carbon amp is less than one month old, they looks like new one 9-10 condition).

    I prefer my 2 channel system to Stax009S and Carbon on overall dynamics and more 3 D holographic soundstage.

    But Stax009S and Carbon sounds so musical and nuanced with decent dynamics that I can enjoy music with windows open during summer time not to disturb my neighbors.

    If I had got KGSSHV Carbon Ground Grid amplifier, there would be more room to tune the sound through tube rolling, but I am happy as is.

    I expect to spend 60/40 time between my 2 channel and headphone system.

    Thus after equalization using Lyngdorf 2170, Stax009S and KGSSHV Carbon headphone system perfectly fit my needs.

    Last edited: Jul 12, 2019
    Thenewguy007 likes this.
  14. iDesign
    How can you possibly interpret how other people perceive sound or understand their individual preferences enough to generalize that the MSB Select is better let alone suggest someone who prefers one or the other is a “fanboy?”
  15. thomaskong78
    If you had not auditioned MSB Select II yourself, you can not say anything.

    Although I like my Dave and Hms under 20k$, it is no match to MSB Select II.
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2019
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