Dec 27, 2016 at 10:18 AM Post #6,376 of 26,949
  Strangely enough, I've been seriously re-thinking sources, and their relative importance, for my DAVE.
 
With a start point of my elderly Nagra CDC (very pricey integrated CD Player/pre-amp) -> Optical cable to DAVE.
If this is the reference point, then in approximate order of change over the year...
 
  1. Replaced CD player with Windows 10 laptop, Redbook FLAC on internal SSD, running off internal battery, app player=JRMC, all DSP off  -> TA Black Diamond USB cable -> DAVE
    1. This sounded different, but broadly equal to reference, the latter still overall slightly preferable in an analoguey kinda way
  2.   Same laptop but with JRMC replaced by HQ Player, all DSP off apart from Dither
    1. Now clearly better than reference, albeit still in same ballpark SQ. This was the point when I knew my trusty old CDC's days were numbered
  3. Insert microRendu with low cost iFi p/s, an old Linksys WiFi router with stock p/s, Monoprice Cat 6 ethernet, laptop connected wirelessly
    1. A step change improvement in SQ. Like upgrading a main component. This was the point of no return.
  4. Replace iFi p/s with MCRU linear p/s, all stock bar upgraded DC power cable to a (rather thin) 1ft silver cable. (MCRU is a UK two-box p/s Price around £240 + around £50 silver DC cable)
    1. Worthwhile further improvement
  5. Replace Monoprice ethernet cable with Supra CAT8
    1. Worthwhile further improvement and staggering VFM at £35 [1]
  6. Replace laptop wifi to router with my now spare Monoprice ethernet cable
    1. A backwards step. Yes, I was surprised too. So the WiFi stays for now [1]. Maybe a better ethernet cable would have turned the tables?
  7. Replace MCRU p/s with LPS-1 with stock DC power cable
    1. Worthwhile further improvement. Possibly a step change, but can't quantify this because the next few steps came in quick succession, so blurred the significance of the original change 
  8. Replace LPS-1's stock DC cable with a short 4 inch silver wire - cut from my now spare MCRU, I soldered the cut wire to a couple of Oyaide DC plugs
    1. Worthwhile further improvement - despite by dodgy soldering skills
  9. Replace the Router's stock p/s with my now spare MCRU
    1. Something interesting happened here that I couldn't quite quantify. Was this a step "improvement" or a step "difference"? Led me to quickly try:
  10. Raided my box of spares to dig out::an ancient Transparent near-entry-level power cord; AMR and HFT Supreme Fuses; HRS damping plate and footer. With a combined result of...
    1. Router with fully loaded MCRU was a step improvement. Chose the HFT over AMR fuse, and both were directional (in an AC circuit! Yes, really). [1] [2] [3]
 
The end result was: Laptop ->wifi -> router with fully loaded MCRU p/s -> Supra ethernet cable -> mR with LPS-1 p/s with silver DC cable -> TQ USB cable -> DAVE
 
Despite the insertion of several boxes/cables into the digital signal chain, this was so far ahead of my reference point, I wouldn't have believed it had anyone told me a year ago. As always, YMMV and these changes are probably objectively very small. None of them, apart from [2], directly changed the tonal signature of my system, although many of them indirectly influenced tonal perception by removing some hash and grain, and increasing focus. The conclusion for me is that just about everything upstream of DAVE can matter. This goes against some earlier posts where theoretically DAVE+mR should be largely immunne to upstream quality. But my usual quip applies here: I have no option but to trust my own ears.... becuase they're the only ones I've got.
 
Notes:
 
[1] These are all candidates for my "I didn't see that one coming" award for 2016. The winner though was the last change: fully loading the MCRU p/s for my router, as it simply gave me my most musically satisfying "I didn't see that one coming" moment of the year.
[2] The HRS damping plate on the MCRU (as well as on DAVE itself] slightly increased the bass, and seemed to add "weight" to the whole sound stage, both of which were very welcome for my Stax 009's. It seemed to affect other parts of the frequency response as well, but I couldn't immediately get a handle on what that was exactly. The HRS footer helped the MCRU, but didn't do anything to DAVE, so obviously YMMV for the hundredth time.
[3] Would I have heard such a difference in the last change if this instead been the first change to try? Do some of the later changes negate the values of the earlier ones? Dunno, as I don't have the patience to try all combinations. But I'm sure that issues in one part of the chain can mask the effect of other parts.
 
Next thing to try:
The SOtM something 200 rival to mR, which some early reports reckon is better than mR and costs less. 
And maybe the SOtM ehernet cable, as romaz liked above all others
And Roon once I get a better broadband connection to my house.
Not in a great rush for these, just going to enjoy what I currently have and rediscover my music collection all over again..

 
 
Without wishing to stray from DAVE, I will just mention that the following might be of interest to you (I have no personal opinion about it, I'm just relaying it to you):
 
www.head-fi.org/t/829639/usb-strikes-back-watch-out-aoip-usb-ethernet-chain-beats-all-at-least-for-me
 
Dec 27, 2016 at 10:57 AM Post #6,377 of 26,949
Dec 27, 2016 at 12:22 PM Post #6,378 of 26,949
  Strangely enough, I've been seriously re-thinking sources, and their relative importance, for my DAVE.
 
With a start point of my elderly Nagra CDC (very pricey integrated CD Player/pre-amp) -> Optical cable to DAVE.
If this is the reference point, then in approximate chronological order of change over the year...
 
  1. Replaced CD player with Windows 10 laptop, Redbook FLAC on internal SSD, running off internal battery, app player=JRMC, all DSP off  -> TA Black Diamond USB cable -> DAVE
    1. This sounded different, but broadly equal to reference, the latter still overall slightly preferable in an analoguey kinda way
  2.   Same laptop but with JRMC replaced by HQ Player, all DSP off apart from Dither
    1. Now clearly better than reference, albeit still in same ballpark SQ. This was the point when I knew my trusty old CDC's days were numbered
  3. Insert microRendu with low cost iFi p/s, an old Linksys WiFi router with stock p/s, Monoprice Cat 6 ethernet, laptop connected wirelessly
    1. A step change improvement in SQ. Like upgrading a main component. This was the point of no return.
  4. Replace iFi p/s with MCRU linear p/s, all stock bar upgraded DC power cable to a (rather thin) 1ft silver cable. (MCRU is a UK two-box p/s Price around £240 + around £50 silver DC cable)
    1. Worthwhile further improvement
  5. Replace Monoprice ethernet cable with Supra CAT8
    1. Worthwhile further improvement and staggering VFM at £35 [1]
  6. Replace laptop wifi to router with my now spare Monoprice ethernet cable
    1. A backwards step. Yes, I was surprised too. So the WiFi stays for now [1]. Maybe a better ethernet cable would have turned the tables?
  7. Replace MCRU p/s with LPS-1 with stock DC power cable
    1. Worthwhile further improvement. Possibly a step change, but can't quantify this because the next few steps came in quick succession, so blurred the significance of the original change 
  8. Replace LPS-1's stock DC cable with a short 4 inch silver wire - cut from my now spare MCRU, I soldered the cut wire to a couple of Oyaide DC plugs
    1. Worthwhile further improvement - despite my dodgy soldering skills
  9. Replace the Router's stock p/s with my now spare MCRU
    1. Something interesting happened here that I couldn't quite quantify. Was this a step "improvement" or a step "difference"? Led me to quickly try:
  10. Raided my box of spares to dig out: an ancient Transparent near-entry-level power cord; AMR and HFT Supreme Fuses; HRS damping plate and footer. With a combined result of...
    1. Router with fully loaded MCRU was a step improvement. Chose the HFT over AMR fuse, and both were directional (in an AC circuit! Yes, really). [1] [2] [3]
 
The end result was: Laptop ->wifi -> router with fully loaded MCRU p/s -> Supra ethernet cable -> mR with LPS-1 p/s with silver DC cable -> TQ USB cable -> DAVE
 
Despite the insertion of several boxes/cables into the digital signal chain, this was so far ahead of my reference point, I wouldn't have believed it had anyone told me a year ago. As always, YMMV and these changes are probably objectively very small. None of them, apart from [2], directly changed the tonal signature of my system, although many of them indirectly influenced tonal perception by removing some hash and grain, and increasing focus. The conclusion for me is that just about everything upstream of DAVE can matter. This goes against some earlier posts where theoretically DAVE+mR should be largely immunne to upstream quality. But my usual quip applies here: I have no option but to trust my own ears.... becuase they're the only ones I've got.
 
Notes:
 
[1] These are all candidates for my "I didn't see that one coming" award for 2016. The winner though was the last change: fully loading the MCRU p/s for my router, as it simply gave me my most musically satisfying "I didn't see that one coming" moment of the year.
[2] The HRS damping plate on the MCRU (as well as on DAVE itself] slightly increased the bass, and seemed to add "weight" to the whole sound stage, both of which were very welcome for my Stax 009's. It seemed to affect other parts of the frequency response as well, but I couldn't immediately get a handle on what that was exactly. The HRS footer helped the MCRU, but didn't do anything to DAVE, so obviously YMMV for the hundredth time.
[3] Would I have heard such a difference in the last change if this instead been the first change to try? Do some of the later changes negate the values of the earlier ones? Dunno, as I don't have the patience to try all combinations. But I'm sure that issues in one part of the chain can mask the effect of other parts.
 
Next thing to try:
The SOtM something 200 rival to mR, which some early reports reckon is better than mR and costs less. 
And maybe the SOtM ehernet cable, as romaz liked above all others
And Roon once I get a better broadband connection to my house.
Not in a great rush for these, just going to enjoy what I currently have and rediscover my music collection all over again..


Interesting:
 
So if you toggle back and forth between Nagra CD on Tos input and USB you got a significant overall SQ refinement off about 5% or ?,
It is also down to that the USB input are the supreme input with the best SQ on DAVE, so it is one factor that does it a slight harder to compare the sources.
 
Dec 27, 2016 at 12:30 PM Post #6,379 of 26,949
The Nagra CD does not have any USB socket unfortunately - they made a design decsion 6+ years ago that USB was not the way to go for them.. Toslink is the best of the digital outputs available (from a comparison last year with Yggy DAC).
 
Dec 27, 2016 at 12:56 PM Post #6,380 of 26,949
  The Nagra CD does not have any USB socket unfortunately - they made a design decsion 6+ years ago that USB was not the way to go for them.. Toslink is the best of the digital outputs available (from a comparison last year with Yggy DAC).

 
Am I reading this wrong or...
 
It seems you prefer the LPS-1 to the Sonor Signature Series Power Supply - is that correct? 
 
Dec 27, 2016 at 1:02 PM Post #6,381 of 26,949
I don't think I mentioned the Sonor Signature p/s anywhere in my review. I haven't tried that.
The only power supplies I tried were iFi 9v, MCRU and LPS-1.
The LPS-1 itself came with the Meanwell feeder power supply.
 
Dec 27, 2016 at 1:07 PM Post #6,382 of 26,949
  I don't think I mentioned the Sonor Signature p/s anywhere in my review. I haven't tried that.
The only power supplies I tried were iFi 9v, MCRU and LPS-1.
The LPS-1 itself came with the Meanwell feeder power supply.

 
I'm sorry - I was thinking the "MCRU linear p/s" was the Sonor one.  What is it then?  Google seems to think it is this.
 
Dec 27, 2016 at 1:32 PM Post #6,384 of 26,949
  I'm sorry - I was thinking the "MCRU linear p/s" was the Sonor one.  What is it then?  Google seems to think it is this.

Yes that's part of a very wide range of the same basic two-box design. They do a 7v one specifically for the mR, but if you have a voltmeter you can infinitely adjust the voltage with an internal trim pot (this is not advertised as a feature). My one ranged from 3.5v to 11v. My router is rated at 12v, but I took a chance that the voltage would probably be dropped inside the router - and it doesn't seem to mind beeing driven by 11v. 
 
Dec 27, 2016 at 1:34 PM Post #6,385 of 26,949
  Yes that's part of a very wide range of the same basic two-box design. They do a 7v one specifically for the mR, but if you have a voltmeter you can infinitely adjust the voltage with an internal trim pot (this is not advertised as a feature). My one ranged from 3.5v to 11v. My router is rated at 12v, but I took a chance that the voltage would probably be dropped inside the router - and it doesn't seem to mind beeing driven by 11v. 

 
That makes sense: thank you. 
 
Any plans to try the Sonor LPSU?
 
Dec 27, 2016 at 2:33 PM Post #6,386 of 26,949
  i am thinking about trying these on DAVE, Audioengine A2+
 

 
 
you think they gonna sound nice? wanted to try a cheap available option before i go with Focal Solo6 BE + Sub6 setup :P 

I bought a pair of these for my wife's desktop set up...running them directly from her laptop's audio out...so I can't comment on how they would sound with DAVE. I will say, though, that they sound pretty rolled off on the top end. the good news is if you get them from directly from Audioengine, you get 30 days to return them if you don't like them. As for Focal, I have CMS 50s for my desktop rig and I like them a lot...I don't have a sub and don't feel that I'm missing anything without it.
 
Dec 27, 2016 at 3:08 PM Post #6,387 of 26,949
  I bought a pair of these for my wife's desktop set up...running them directly from her laptop's audio out...so I can't comment on how they would sound with DAVE. I will say, though, that they sound pretty rolled off on the top end. the good news is if you get them from directly from Audioengine, you get 30 days to return them if you don't like them. As for Focal, I have CMS 50s for my desktop rig and I like them a lot...I don't have a sub and don't feel that I'm missing anything without it.

hmm CM50 seems like a better pair to start with :D Thanks for the info ^^ i will check around to get them for a good deal. 
 
Dec 27, 2016 at 4:39 PM Post #6,388 of 26,949
  Would like to know what all Dave owners are using as a source into Dave?
 
Mostly laptops or other sources like mobile phones, Mac, microrendu, other streamers?
 
Personally I am using Windows 7 -- > J river (with Chord Asio Driver) --> USB (with the cable that came with Dave) -- Dave

I am using my AK120 as the source
 
Dec 27, 2016 at 5:36 PM Post #6,389 of 26,949
  Would like to know what all Dave owners are using as a source into Dave?
 
Mostly laptops or other sources like mobile phones, Mac, microrendu, other streamers?
 
Personally I am using Windows 7 -- > J river (with Chord Asio Driver) --> USB (with the cable that came with Dave) -- Dave

 
I'm using an Aurender N10, and super-happy with the combo of the DAVE and that unit.
 
The advantage of the Aurender is that it has several outputs that match up with the DAVE -- USB, BNC, Toslink & AES/EBU.
 
And at this point, I have all four hooked up...and still not certain which one I prefer the most. Kinda sometimes depends on the music.
 
But all four Aurender-outputs/DAVE-inputs please me.
 
Dave, who is also using the Aurender's RCA coax output to a DAVE BNC input using an adapter
 

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