[IEMusic]

i didn't know that budget drivers could bring such difference to the sound. i mean, i thought it was more about the tuning and how could the sound engineers are.

It never ceases to amaze me how much of an effect the timbre of different drivers can have on the perceived sound. For instance, the extreme 3.5 KHz peak on the Shuoer Tape, while often a bit annoying, is surprisingly tolerable for me. There are many exceptional IEMs, that if tuned that way, would be unlistenable for me.

I’m not meaning to disparage ”budget” BAs at all, but in general, the timbre of BAs are not as natural sounding as that of DDs. It just makes it that more difficult to produce really good sounding BAs for a rock-bottom price.

 

[Slater]

"Sony's are no Bologna"



Handy work goes to Slater and our late departed friend Hungry (R.I.P.)

Those blacks are something special; I’m so glad you can enjoy them. They’re the only pair like it I’ve ever made. The shell rework and driver retuning was labor intensive, but well worth it. Definitely a labor of love

I also have a nice IEC711 setup now, which I’ll be using to up my IEM tuning game another notch.

 

[IEManiac]

i didn't know that budget drivers could bring such difference to the sound. i mean, i thought it was more about the tuning and how could the sound engineers are.

'Tuning' is ultimately a physical process where physical changes are made to the driver and the enclosure. It's not fundamentally about moving frequency sliders up and down on a laptop.

 

[lgcubana]

The things that can alarm you to a dishonest review/reviewer to me is when

1. They do not say clearly if the product is self bought, review discounted or free.

2. They give a high score and say it has no cons. (or they omit)

3. High score without comparisons.

Really disgusts me when they do that and especially if all 3 are happening at the same time...

I don’t give the "pro" reviews anymore credence than the FR graphs; at best they’re a good starting point, in doing my own research, with the help of some forum members feedback.

Sometimes you have to have a degree in literary forensics, to find the negative space, in the glowing reviews. e.g.One of the more popular YouTube reviewers, in his over the top review of the Tin P1 (proclaiming them the be all, end all) he likened the P1 to having nine BAs, to handle everything above 2500hz. No real mention of the lack of the very low end

Then there are reviewers who flip flop, without updating their initial reviews. Case in point: a reviewer said of the Fiio FH5, "9:20, really outstanding ...". But then in a Fiio FH7 review he says of the FH5, "3:00, I did not like ..."

 

[lucasbatista2408]

I think it’s a combination of the FR of the treble along with the “budget” BA timbre that make them sound strident.

good thing that my zsx does not have this treble "problem" at least, its a really good iem, just wish there was a little bit less bass tho.

 

[lucasbatista2408]

'Tuning' is ultimately a physical process where physical changes are made to the driver and the enclosure. It's not fundamentally about moving frequency sliders up and down on a laptop.

i know, but i thought tuning the driver would make more of a difference. good to learn something new.

 

[Tonymac136]

i know, but i thought tuning the driver would make more of a difference. good to learn something new.

Tuning helps, for sure, but if the driver has bad timbre it's not likely to be tuned out. The KZ ZS10 was the IEM that really introduced me to ChiFi and amazed me at the time I bought it, but the timbre is so far off compared to more recent hybrids and even moreso compared to DDs.

 

[lucasbatista2408]

Tuning helps, for sure, but if the driver has bad timbre it's not likely to be tuned out. The KZ ZS10 was the IEM that really introduced me to ChiFi and amazed me at the time I bought it, but the timbre is so far off compared to more recent hybrids and even moreso compared to DDs.

oh i get it. thanks for the explanation.

 

[baskingshark]

Got the BLON, got the ZS10 Pro, got the BQEYZ KC2, got others up the price ladder. Anything to be gained in getting the KBEAR KB04?

KBEAR KB04 would make a good budget entry level set for newbies and those new to the CHIFI rabbithole, but seems you've higher end stuff, so probably not worth it to buy sidegrades/downgrades. It has above average soundstage, technicalities, but the upper mids/lower treble region is a bit harsh for me occasionally, though not as bad as some KZs and TRNs I've heard. Timbre slightly artificial and note weight a bit light. Would be a good daily beater set kind of IEM.

 

[Nimweth]

BL-05 arrived today. Ditched the cable and tips, used Faaeal Hibiscus cable and Spiral Dots (size M). Perfect fit, (unlike BL-03). At this early stage I have to say I prefer the new model. Of course the fit is crucial but the soundstage and tonality seem really on point (via Xduoo X20). Plenty of extension at both ends and no mid bass bloat. I will let the music burn for 100 hours lol. More later and review eventually.

 

[Podster]

I was recently wondering how to digest the reviews of certain individuals that don’t show overt biases, or have any of the red flags, but just post good to glowing reviews of pretty much everything. I’m not questioning their integrity, but rather what to make of any of their opinions, since they’re so homogeneous. Yes, a lot of products really are good to amazing, but not all of them.

Now, I will be the first to admit that I would likely make a terrible reviewer. I‘m not eloquent and creative enough to come up with good descriptors to finely differentiate the numerous IEMs that are currently on the market. For instance, you can criticize it all you want, but when I look over Crin’s ranking list, I realize that I would have no idea where to even start. I’d go crazy trying to categorize so many IEMs.

This post has made me want to put my $.02 into your thoughts as I too find it strange so many portable audio reviewers can break down so many different iem's/ciem's. Of course as my young friend Rikudou says at 64 I'm just old and have lost my ability to hear and discern the individual frequencies and tone/timber of all these offerings but really to the less negative findings by so many who review 99.9% of the population can even enjoy a $9.99 Best Buy Skull Candy because it does play your music back effectively but now enters the discerning ears of 20 year old's who have a lifetime of listening and immediately they can somehow determine a mediocre headphone from an outstanding one This is one I'm still trying to wrap my head around but then again without different opinions we would not even have this site/hobby but this is how most hobbies go. Big thing for me is how subjective this hobby is especially since we all hear things just a little differently, one finds an iem to be too bright or bass heavy while another listener finds that same iem's bass on par and treble satisfying or maybe slightly to or fro the other listeners findings so I see some reviews where one guy finds even a TOTL to sound weak and distant while another finds it spot on which only goes back to my statement we all here them differently then we can start talking other changes to any iem's SS with cables and tips and how each persons impression changes once again. I say they do sound different but it's really hard for anyone to accurately predict how and particular headphone will sound to another person. In the home audio world most really good reviewers have spent 2-3 times your (30 and under) lifetime already and now we have the portable world where for me at least reviewers at this point are a dime a dozen and most without even there first decade in practice so I don't take most of what many have to report but the trick is to garner from there reviews what others report they hear similarly of the same unit but always remember something that does not trip someone else's trigger may just light your fire The trick for me is realizing any given iem's strength to "ME" and enjoy it for what it provides because I can assure you nothing in any audio delivers it all but also be 100% sure there will be those who disagree and strongly at times but it could be why 99.9% of the population finds us a little on the cracked side anyway I enjoy music (have all my life 6 decades in) and I also don't take any of it too seriously or you'll spend more time not just enjoying all that music.

 

[PhonoPhi]

This post has made me want to put my $.02 into your thoughts as I too find it strange so many portable audio reviewers can break down so many different iem's/ciem's. Of course as my young friend Rikudou says at 64 I'm just old and have lost my ability to hear and discern the individual frequencies and tone/timber of all these offerings but really to the less negative findings by so many who review 99.9% of the population can even enjoy a $9.99 Best Buy Skull Candy because it does play your music back effectively but now enters the discerning ears of 20 year old's who have a lifetime of listening and immediately they can somehow determine a mediocre headphone from an outstanding one This is one I'm still trying to wrap my head around but then again without different opinions we would not even have this site/hobby but this is how most hobbies go. Big thing for me is how subjective this hobby is especially since we all hear things just a little differently, one finds an iem to be too bright or bass heavy while another listener finds that same iem's bass on par and treble satisfying or maybe slightly to or fro the other listeners findings so I see some reviews where one guy finds even a TOTL to sound weak and distant while another finds it spot on which only goes back to my statement we all here them differently then we can start talking other changes to any iem's SS with cables and tips and how each persons impression changes once again. I say they do sound different but it's really hard for anyone to accurately predict how and particular headphone will sound to another person. In the home audio world most really good reviewers have spent 2-3 times your (30 and under) lifetime already and now we have the portable world where for me at least reviewers at this point are a dime a dozen and most without even there first decade in practice so I don't take most of what many have to report but the trick is to garner from there reviews what others report they hear similarly of the same unit but always remember something that does not trip someone else's trigger may just light your fire The trick for me is realizing any given iem's strength to "ME" and enjoy it for what it provides because I can assure you nothing in any audio delivers it all but also be 100% sure there will be those who disagree and strongly at times but it could be why 99.9% of the population finds us a little on the cracked side anyway I enjoy music (have all my life 6 decades in) and I also don't take any of it too seriously or you'll spend more time not just enjoying all that music.

Exactly!
I just got to this wisdom recently, appreciating the strength of your IEMs is the best way to enjoy this hobby (while still a more common alternative is to "go up" bitching about the shortcomings of $1000+ IEMs in a never-ending elusive quest for the "total".

 

[voja]

This post has made me want to put my $.02 into your thoughts as I too find it strange so many portable audio reviewers can break down so many different iem's/ciem's. Of course as my young friend Rikudou says at 64 I'm just old and have lost my ability to hear and discern the individual frequencies and tone/timber of all these offerings but really to the less negative findings by so many who review 99.9% of the population can even enjoy a $9.99 Best Buy Skull Candy because it does play your music back effectively but now enters the discerning ears of 20 year old's who have a lifetime of listening and immediately they can somehow determine a mediocre headphone from an outstanding one This is one I'm still trying to wrap my head around but then again without different opinions we would not even have this site/hobby but this is how most hobbies go. Big thing for me is how subjective this hobby is especially since we all hear things just a little differently, one finds an iem to be too bright or bass heavy while another listener finds that same iem's bass on par and treble satisfying or maybe slightly to or fro the other listeners findings so I see some reviews where one guy finds even a TOTL to sound weak and distant while another finds it spot on which only goes back to my statement we all here them differently then we can start talking other changes to any iem's SS with cables and tips and how each persons impression changes once again. I say they do sound different but it's really hard for anyone to accurately predict how and particular headphone will sound to another person. In the home audio world most really good reviewers have spent 2-3 times your (30 and under) lifetime already and now we have the portable world where for me at least reviewers at this point are a dime a dozen and most without even there first decade in practice so I don't take most of what many have to report but the trick is to garner from there reviews what others report they hear similarly of the same unit but always remember something that does not trip someone else's trigger may just light your fire The trick for me is realizing any given iem's strength to "ME" and enjoy it for what it provides because I can assure you nothing in any audio delivers it all but also be 100% sure there will be those who disagree and strongly at times but it could be why 99.9% of the population finds us a little on the cracked side anyway I enjoy music (have all my life 6 decades in) and I also don't take any of it too seriously or you'll spend more time not just enjoying all that music.

And also to @IEMusic:
In my eyes it's far simpler and more obvious than just saying every product is good. Many reviewers such as portafi and another one (which I won't name since he is on head-fi) just say good things about every product... well because they just want more free stuff. It's as simple as that.

Of course opinions differ, I myself found my own opinion contrasting and going against other people's opinions several times. This occured to me three times already.. and I was not afraid to say it.

What is not as simple, is that at these prices (budget), and mass-production, there are a whole lot of faulty units.. and you would never even know. This being said, while one unit is bright and has driver flex, the other one doesn't. This makes it impossible to actually give rational reviews, because you don't know if you got a bad unit or not.. But I cannot see how some reviewers cannot find a bad thing. Actually you know what it is, they (reviewers) are smart actually. They do what they think is right and will impress the manufacturer: they state ONLY the good, because who asked them about the bad?! They just say the good stuff, and sugar-coat this and that... and well somehow they make their way up the manufacturers ass so far up that they start receiving stuff what they want: the expensive stuff. AKA the good stuff. After that, they do feel like they are doing something, because why else did they sugar-coat everything before it?

This has become more of a business than a hobby, however I still did find many of us here on Head-Fi to be unbiased and to give rational reviews.

What is okay is to say that something isn't good or that you don't like it, but at least back it up.. this isn't about writing poems or what-not.. it's about judging sound performance and actually backing it up. How can you say stuff about sound with words... without actually giving any reference what you are talking about. It has come to just throwing terms left and right, without even explaining what they mean, or giving reference tracks. Yes, sometimes we are short on time, or just lose patience with a product because of its bad performance.. but hey, that happens, but to keep doing that over and over.. and over. Again. Might pass with the average audiences, but I think many of us here are well aware of it.

 

[RikudouGoku]

And also to @IEMusic:
In my eyes it's far simpler and more obvious than just saying every product is good. Many reviewers such as portafi and another one (which I won't name since he is on head-fi) just say good things about every product... well because they just want more free stuff. It's as simple as that.

Of course opinions differ, I myself found my own opinion contrasting and going against other people's opinions several times. This occured to me three times already.. and I was not afraid to say it.

What is not as simple, is that at these prices (budget), and mass-production, there are a whole lot of faulty units.. and you would never even know. This being said, while one unit is bright and has driver flex, the other one doesn't. This makes it impossible to actually give rational reviews, because you don't know if you got a bad unit or not.. But I cannot see how some reviewers cannot find a bad thing. Actually you know what it is, they (reviewers) are smart actually. They do what they think is right and will impress the manufacturer: they state ONLY the good, because who asked them about the bad?! They just say the good stuff, and sugar-coat this and that... and well somehow they make their way up the manufacturers ass so far up that they start receiving stuff what they want: the expensive stuff. AKA the good stuff. After that, they do feel like they are doing something, because why else did they sugar-coat everything before it?

This has become more of a business than a hobby, however I still did find many of us here on Head-Fi to be unbiased and to give rational reviews.

What is okay is to say that something isn't good or that you don't like it, but at least back it up.. this isn't about writing poems or what-not.. it's about judging sound performance and actually backing it up. How can you say stuff about sound with words... without actually giving any reference what you are talking about. It has come to just throwing terms left and right, without even explaining what they mean, or giving reference tracks. Yes, sometimes we are short on time, or just lose patience with a product because of its bad performance.. but hey, that happens, but to keep doing that over and over.. and over. Again. Might pass with the average audiences, but I think many of us here are well aware of it.

Sounds very accurate what you are saying.

Although I personally believe no one can be entirely free of bias. Whether it is bias from as you say, only stating the good things to get on the manufacturers good side. Or simply buying it yourself and it sounds crap, but you want to justify your purchase (otherwise it would have been a waste of cash) so you overestimate it.

Edit: This is the kind of bias I was trying to describe.
" Choice-supportive bias or post-purchase rationalization is the tendency to retroactively ascribe positive attributes to an option one has selected and/or to demote the forgone options.[1] It is part of cognitive science, and is a distinct cognitive bias that occurs once a decision is made. For example, if a person chooses option A instead of option B, they are likely to ignore or downplay the faults of option A while amplifying or subscribing new negative faults to option B. Conversely, they are also likely to notice and amplify the advantages of option A and not notice or de-emphasize those of option B. "

source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Choice-supportive_bias

 

[IEMusic]

What is not as simple, is that at these prices (budget), and mass-production, there are a whole lot of faulty units.. and you would never even know. This being said, while one unit is bright and has driver flex, the other one doesn't. This makes it impossible to actually give rational reviews, because you don't know if you got a bad unit or not..

This has become more of a business than a hobby, however I still did find many of us here on Head-Fi to be unbiased and to give rational reviews.

What is okay is to say that something isn't good or that you don't like it, but at least back it up..

Very important points. For this reason, I really appreciate head-fi, where I can get a good idea of how something should sound based on a consensus opinion. That helps in eliminating the few outliers that may have received a defective unit. While a consensus is not the end all, what a group of members who paid their own money for an item says, carries a lot more weight than a bunch of glowing reviews from professional reviewers that have inherent conflicts of interest (though certainly not all reviewers are equal).

I have to admit, I’m guilty of not backing up statements with specific music passages, b/c it does take a lot more effort to do so. That indeed is the best way to describe how a product sounds, that someone else can understand.

Other than finding patterns in what multiple members report, finding 1-2 reviewers or members to follow, that have one’s same interests in music and sound signature, is key.