[originalsnuffy]

Andy,

Your thoughtful and helpful answers mean a lot to me and I suspect most other customers and users of this and other Cayin products. I want Cayin, the N5II, and you to succeed.

The only other time I saw a level of service this excellent was when Joe Bloggs was at FIIO. Your other support associate is very helpful also.

I feel good that most key "show stopping" issues will be fixed in this release or the next. Thanks again.

I do think the USB bus may be behind some of the issues I am seeing beyond the volume bug.

Before my machine became largely unresponsive and required a factory reset and a software file rebuild, I had been transferring files from one usb memory card bank to another in a fairly large volume. Perhaps that is a indication that some more arbitration of USB related bus activities is needed.

Perhaps Cayin might consider including a USB-A to USB microsd adaptor in the box, which is something that Shanling does. It would appear that large file transfers to or from the device can be problematic based on my experience. So the adaptor may be a workaround.

By the way, I think it is quite possible that the USB cable included with the device is not of particularly good quality. I have much better results when accessing the machine with other cables that I have.

 

[originalsnuffy]

....the post I replied to sounded like N5ii is a POS brick which doesn't work and needs an "urgent firmware update". To my surprise, I had a few people (potential buyers) ping me about it after reading this thread, asking how bad N5ii really is, and I was honestly surprised, thought maybe they are talking about AP200

Ummmm....the unit is not a POS by any means, However, it was in fact pretty much bricked until I reset the system, flushed my memory cards and reformatted the cards. A lot of people who encounter that kind of system behavior would simply box the unit up and return it instead of alerting the vendor to provide helpful feedback on items that should be addressed fairly quickly.

And as a user, I pretty much only use folder file access (just like you) and have almost no other software running in the machine most of the time.

I think by now you and most other head-fi people know that I tend to be fairly level headed about my toys and only post things such as this when matters are truly not good.

 

[pfurey89]

Having issues with my Cayin currently.

I'm on 2.1EN (I believe, the update around Christmas)

At first, the pause button on the side just stopped working with Spotify. The battery died while playing, and no sweat, charged it back up. Now it keeps booting into recovery mode. I did a factory reset and reinstalled the update, as well as a factory reset without reinstalling the update. I've flushed the cache both times. Neither have fixed my issue. I've tried everything and cannot get it back out of recovery mode. What gives?

 

[PinkyPowers]

Having issues with my Cayin currently.

I'm on 2.1EN (I believe, the update around Christmas)

At first, the pause button on the side just stopped working with Spotify. The battery died while playing, and no sweat, charged it back up. Now it keeps booting into recovery mode. I did a factory reset and reinstalled the update, as well as a factory reset without reinstalling the update. I've flushed the cache both times. Neither have fixed my issue. I've tried everything and cannot get it back out of recovery mode. What gives?

It's almost like one of the track buttons is stuck, forcing you into recovery mode. Does it look stuck down?

 

[pfurey89]

It doesn’t. Also, no issues using forward to back, if it was pressed down, I would imagine my music would go from pause to play non stop.

 

[BetterLate]

Andy,

Your thoughtful and helpful answers mean a lot to me and I suspect most other customers and users of this and other Cayin products. I want Cayin, the N5II, and you to succeed.

The only other time I saw a level of service this excellent was when Joe Bloggs was at FIIO. Your other support associate is very helpful also.

I feel good that most key "show stopping" issues will be fixed in this release or the next. Thanks again.

I do think the USB bus may be behind some of the issues I am seeing beyond the volume bug.

Before my machine became largely unresponsive and required a factory reset and a software file rebuild, I had been transferring files from one usb memory card bank to another in a fairly large volume. Perhaps that is a indication that some more arbitration of USB related bus activities is needed.

Perhaps Cayin might consider including a USB-A to USB microsd adaptor in the box, which is something that Shanling does. It would appear that large file transfers to or from the device can be problematic based on my experience. So the adaptor may be a workaround.

By the way, I think it is quite possible that the USB cable included with the device is not of particularly good quality. I have much better results when accessing the machine with other cables that I have.

I love my N3, but I and many others had problems with the supplied cable. The problem went away with a $4 Anker cable, so Cayin has some history with cable problems

 

[Andykong]

If only every test engineer of Cayin were at least as dedicated as you are. Then a structural bug like USB-AUDIO would have never occured as it would have been easily detected during the functional test or UAT phase.
You are always positive and helpful. I still think the problems may be solved soon if you follow these problems so closely.. Thank you

I was among the decision makers to push the green light button knowing that the USA Audio is not perfect. We underestimated the amount of work required to fix this bug. We expected to rectify the issue on our first firmware update, Unfortunately the fix we planned didn't work, and now we have to go to low level coding to resolve the problem, and that's why we have delayed the solution once again. We have been working on this non-stop, but haven't achieve a satisfactory solution so far.

Real life product development and manufacturing business is hardly a 100% black and white process, there are gray area that we have to take risk, and when things didn't work out the way we planned, we have to take the hit. Fortunately the Cayin team is one of the best team I have worked with in my career, and we had a culture to stand behind our product till the very last minutes, without that kind of commitment, on one can stand in the front line facing the crowd like what we are doing.

 

[PopZeus]

Just my 2 cents when it comes to buggy firmware, QA, etc.:

This is a niche market, with a lot of smaller players making gear that appeals to a dedicated but limited fanbase. Most "normal" people want bluetooth IEMs on-the-go, and a soundbar or Sonos at home. Space-saving, wireless convenience. The bigger guys who have audiophile divisions have a lot more resources to put hardware and software products together successfully. For instance, I would expect a Sony DAP to be relatively bug-free on release, but smaller companies like Cayin or even Shanling, not as much. Just a matter of limited resources. Then again, even my Onkyo and Sony HT receivers have all had weird quirks. What I appreciate is that these companies aren't sitting on their hands post-launch. They all seem to listen to their users and crank out updates at a regular clip.

When I first got into DAPs, I went back and read the beginnings of threads for gear and the pattern seemed to be a slower launch as retailers started getting supply, with some bugs (both trivial and gamekilling) and then many firmware updates post-launch. I feel like it happens to almost everyone who gets into the DAP game. I seem to remember people complaining that recent firmware updates were responsible for changing the sound of their DX90s and people were reverting their DAPs to previous versions. My Shanling M5 had a really sucky shutdown bug when I first got it. I was pissed and groused about it, but then Shanling went and fixed it in a firmware update and all was good again in the world. Now, I'm just a bit more patient assuming that the process will play itself out. This is apparently the curse of being an early adopter! Heh.

 

[pfurey89]

Any help @Andykong with my above issue? Seems hardware related.

 

[CayinSupport]

Having issues with my Cayin currently.

I'm on 2.1EN (I believe, the update around Christmas)

At first, the pause button on the side just stopped working with Spotify. The battery died while playing, and no sweat, charged it back up. Now it keeps booting into recovery mode. I did a factory reset and reinstalled the update, as well as a factory reset without reinstalling the update. I've flushed the cache both times. Neither have fixed my issue. I've tried everything and cannot get it back out of recovery mode. What gives?

It seems not the firmware issue. My suggestion is that you could kindly contact your retailer to perform a test. Thanks advance for your cooperation!

 

[Dobrescu George]

Just my 2 cents when it comes to buggy firmware, QA, etc.:

This is a niche market, with a lot of smaller players making gear that appeals to a dedicated but limited fanbase. Most "normal" people want bluetooth IEMs on-the-go, and a soundbar or Sonos at home. Space-saving, wireless convenience. The bigger guys who have audiophile divisions have a lot more resources to put hardware and software products together successfully. For instance, I would expect a Sony DAP to be relatively bug-free on release, but smaller companies like Cayin or even Shanling, not as much. Just a matter of limited resources. Then again, even my Onkyo and Sony HT receivers have all had weird quirks. What I appreciate is that these companies aren't sitting on their hands post-launch. They all seem to listen to their users and crank out updates at a regular clip.

When I first got into DAPs, I went back and read the beginnings of threads for gear and the pattern seemed to be a slower launch as retailers started getting supply, with some bugs (both trivial and gamekilling) and then many firmware updates post-launch. I feel like it happens to almost everyone who gets into the DAP game. I seem to remember people complaining that recent firmware updates were responsible for changing the sound of their DX90s and people were reverting their DAPs to previous versions. My Shanling M5 had a really sucky shutdown bug when I first got it. I was pissed and groused about it, but then Shanling went and fixed it in a firmware update and all was good again in the world. Now, I'm just a bit more patient assuming that the process will play itself out. This is apparently the curse of being an early adopter! Heh.

Or, as I'd like to put it:

---This Might be an interesting rant---

Have you ever owned a laptop and had need for it to do a specific job?

Freaking laptops, even high-end ones have so broken firmwares that all my company's files are on external HDDs!

LAPTOPS, and they can't get them right. From Acer to Clevo, I had a ton of issues with laptops, nevermind Windows and driver integration when Windows 10 first appeared.

I had my laptop shut down without explanation, only to figure that the company creating it didn't make a proper BIOS for it and that Clevo laptops have GTX 1080 and 8700K CPUs but they need a special BIOS made by a friendly man named Prema to work.

------

It happens in every industry, software can be tricky, especially at low level coding. Now, Cayin have just released their N5ii, and if I'm not mistaken it is one of the first Android DAPs, so they hav good time to fix it.

[Even HIDIZS are new players with their AP200, let's imagine that after a few more months it'll be perfect, same for subsequent releases.]

I think that Cayin will surely prevail with the next firmware update(s) as I've seen them do cool stuff before with their products.

 

[timk74]

CayinSupport,
Is there a chance to fix the screen flickering bug (already described here) in the next firmware upgrades? Or is it a hardware design problem and it's better to immediately return the device to the seller (i understand that there is probably a hardware problem, but the device is purchased online, in another country (China) and the prospect of waiting for a replacement for months is very frustrating)?

 

[CayinSupport]

CayinSupport,
Is there a chance to fix the screen flickering bug (already described here) in the next firmware upgrades? Or is it a hardware design problem and it's better to immediately return the device to the seller (i understand that there is probably a hardware problem, but the device is purchased online, in another country (China) and the prospect of waiting for a replacement for months is very frustrating)?

This is a known bug. We will try our best to test and fix it in subsequent firmware. Sorry for the inconvenience caused!

 

[CayinSupport]

We have already released v3.0CN in Chinese official website. But please don't install it in your N5ii because it doesn't have Googplay.We still test our V3.1EN firmware to make sure everything is ok before we release it. And we have scheduled a firmware release this Friday. Please stay tuned!

 

[originalsnuffy]

I look forward to the new firmware.

I am not sure if anybody has mentioned this, but the unit also suffers from what I think of as a house bug from the firmware vendor.

The first half second or so of the first song song played is cut off when using folder mode. I have the same issue with the Shanling M2S, so I think it is a Hiby bug.