Cayin N3 Hi-Res DAP with AKM4490 DAC, apt-X Bluetooth, and Line, USB & Coax Out for $150

[graemei101]

I might misunderstand you, but..
A direct connect (headphone out) is using the physical amp of the N3 or any DAP. The wireless system is simply transferring the audio data over protocol while BT headsets and in ear sets have a small DSP or the like within which can amplify that signal after it reaches the headgear. You cannot power the audio signal over wireless like you can with a direct connection to an amp stage (HO/LO etc).
To gain convenience (wireless) you must sacrifice a pinch of fidelity and a bit of power.

Thanks for your help.
I can only tell you of my experience. On the third generation Fiio X1, the same Bluetooth output level is comparable with the wired output level I get on my Cosmic Ears ciems. On the Sony A-35 the same Bluetooth output level is in excess of the same level wired output. However I have to crank up the level on the N3 by about 15 points to get a matched level on bluetooth, this can give me a problem when gong back to wired without setting the level back down.
It is not a big deal for me as I have other options for when running, but it does seem a bit strange to me.

 

[Francisk]

Thanks for your help.
I can only tell you of my experience. On the third generation Fiio X1, the same Bluetooth output level is comparable with the wired output level I get on my Cosmic Ears ciems. On the Sony A-35 the same Bluetooth output level is in excess of the same level wired output. However I have to crank up the level on the N3 by about 15 points to get a matched level on bluetooth, this can give me a problem when gong back to wired without setting the level back down.
It is not a big deal for me as I have other options for when running, but it does seem a bit strange to me.

Which gain setting are you on? L, M or H?

 

[graemei101]

Which gain setting are you on? L, M or H?

On M

 

[Francisk]

On M

M should have sufficient power. If not try H gain setting.

 

[gLer]

gLer, have you tried setting the output on your N3 to M (medium) or H (high)? It does make a difference.

Figured out the AAC issue: was ripping from iTunes at a much lower level than my Flac rips. A bit of AACGAIN and it's fixed. BTW I'm testing on M, vol level 70, using B&W P7 headphones. For almost every single source, AAC is lower volume than the comparable Flac file (now fixed with AACGAIN), but there's no denying Flac is so much more dynamic, impactful and clear, with better separation and soundstage - to my ears anyway. Whoever says AAC (even 256 True VBR) or MP3 (320) has the same dynamics and clarity of a Flac file from the same CD/DSD source (using good resolving headphones) is kidding themselves.

 

[Sulbh]

No comparison between the two but then again not really a fair comparison when looking at $150 vs $53 either. The N3 outclasses the C3 in about every possible way. Going from memory as my C3 experience ended sometime back, The C3 wouldn't work as a DAC from the computer or as a transport via USB or spdif as the N3 will. The C3 didnt display album art or have folder shuffle. The worst feature of the C3 for me was that it was prone to stutter and lockup periodically. That may sound like I'm trashing the C3 and I'm not, it was a good sounding basic little player. What it wasn't is the swiss army knife of DAPs that the N3 is, nor was the interface as good on the C3 as the N3 already is and with the new firmware coming out fairly frequently for the N3, I suspect it will continue to improve while the C3 is pretty steady state at this point.

If you want a very basic but very good sounding player the C3 is still an option if you are willing to put up with lack of album art and shuffle features. (Also it wont read from both internal storage and card at once, you have to flip between).
If you want the versatility to use one device as a transport, a portable DAP, or a USB DAC then the N3 is better suited and has at least as good a sound quality as the C3 with a better output stage as it will drive higher impedance headphones than the C3.

I am only interested in sound.How does it compare to n3 in terms of sound.I know c3 is a lot cheaper but it also launched at $150.

 

[Francisk]

Figured out the AAC issue: was ripping from iTunes at a much lower level than my Flac rips. A bit of AACGAIN and it's fixed. BTW I'm testing on M, vol level 70, using B&W P7 headphones. For almost every single source, AAC is lower volume than the comparable Flac file (now fixed with AACGAIN), but there's no denying Flac is so much more dynamic, impactful and clear, with better separation and soundstage - to my ears anyway. Whoever says AAC (even 256 True VBR) or MP3 (320) has the same dynamics and clarity of a Flac file from the same CD/DSD source (using good resolving headphones) is kidding themselves.

Glad you've solved your volume problem.

 

[BroncoVA]

Hi everyone i have had a N3 for a few days now (your enthusiasm made me buy it, and it's really great!)
My first surprise was that it fell very short of being able to drive decently my Sennheiser hd600 (it has some decent amount of details without an extra amp when on H gain, but obviously an amp gives it a decisive kick).
The bluetooth works very well, the Hiby app is nice too (update went on like a breeze).
I have no major complaint, maybe if it could be possible to change the font size and the info scrolling speed (without glasses some little characters can be very hard to decipher, and on some long info tracks the screen dims out before it has scrolled maybe in a future update?)
If Cayin opened it up to Rockbox team the N3 could become a little DAP that may be remembered like the great Sansa Clip+ is (even if it's already a great DAP i'd really be curious to see what the possibility to switch to a rockboxed version could achieve)

 

[BetterLate]

Sorry for the inconvenient caused, I'll report this to our team on Monday and request to test the USB DAC feature of N3 under v2.0 firmware. Can you tell me more detail on your setup? Window version? Playback software is Foobar2000?

If you can, is it possible to take reload v1.2 firmware and test the USB DAC feature again?

I think I may have caused this. When I deleted update file from root to dap I deleted another file. What would the other file be and how do I restore it?

 

[riffrafff]

Hi everyone i have had a N3 for a few days now (your enthusiasm made me buy it, and it's really great!)
My first surprise was that it fell very short of being able to drive decently my Sennheiser hd600 (it has some decent amount of details without an extra amp when on H gain, but obviously an amp gives it a decisive kick).
The bluetooth works very well, the Hiby app is nice too (update went on like a breeze).
I have no major complaint, maybe if it could be possible to change the font size and the info scrolling speed (without glasses some little characters can be very hard to decipher, and on some long info tracks the screen dims out before it has scrolled maybe in a future update?)
If Cayin opened it up to Rockbox team the N3 could become a little DAP that may be remembered like the great Sansa Clip+ is (even if it's already a great DAP i'd really be curious to see what the possibility to switch to a rockboxed version could achieve)

Yeah, Rockbox on this excellent little DAP would be superb!

 

[DBaldock9]

I wonder how Cayin could support RockBox for the N3, while HiBy is their partner for the Music Player software?
Seems like it would have to be an independent, customer led project.

 

[BroncoVA]

Cayin could keep Hiby as the official partner and let Rockbox use their own open software as a bonus for those who want to use their hardware in a different way
Or it could be an un-official support, like when you accept without endorsing (that would mean a certain confidentiality for both parts)
It would be a win-win as all of their customer would not "rockbox" their N3, but in the audio community that would give a great fame and a great incentive to give it a try (and those kind of audio-geek customers hesitating between a sub 200$ DAP without Rockbox option and a Cayin N3 with a possible dual boot would definitely choose Cayin)

 

[BetterLate]

Sorry for the inconvenient caused, I'll report this to our team on Monday and request to test the USB DAC feature of N3 under v2.0 firmware. Can you tell me more detail on your setup? Window version? Playback software is Foobar2000?

If you can, is it possible to take reload v1.2 firmware and test the USB DAC feature again?

Uninstalled and re-installed USB driver multiple times and now working, both to recognize drive and to use as DAC. WOW Spotify on laptop thru N3 sounding AWESOME! I'm sure this problem is caused by something I did.

 

[gLer]

Uninstalled and re-installed USB driver multiple times and now working, both to recognize drive and to use as DAC. WOW Spotify on laptop thru N3 sounding AWESOME! I'm sure this problem is caused by something I did.

Out of interest, how does Spotify over BT compare to Spotify wired from your laptop sound-wise? Which headphones are you using?

 

[groucho69]

Uninstalled and re-installed USB driver multiple times and now working, both to recognize drive and to use as DAC. WOW Spotify on laptop thru N3 sounding AWESOME! I'm sure this problem is caused by something I did.