Hello Head-Fi!
When the original HD 800 was launched in 2009, it ushered in both a sound and design that was unlike anything we had done before. We’re seeking input from owners of the
open 800 family (past
and present models) in the form of a quick survey. Because the questions span a few different response types (ranked choice, check boxes, multiple choice) you'll need to click the link below to take it, however It is anonymous, quick, and does not require registration of any kind. Lastly, the questions range from acoustics to ergonomics.
The survey will close on April 3rd. If you have any questions about the survey,
@ericpalonen will be here to answer them.
Thank you for your time and feedback.
>>The Survey<<
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Hello! I am a longtime HD800 user and I... well, I have a lot of things to say.
I've filled out the survey, but also have feedback that I
pray makes it to your development team, because despite Sennheiser being my absolute favorite headphone company (with a very large gap between Sennheiser and the next brand), the last few headphones you have released have been profoundly disappointing for me and my friends (all massive Sennheiser fans), and I think you should be told in no uncertain terms why, and be more wary of which feedback you take.
You asked a few questions relating to a possible HD800 successor in a Sennheiser Explorers survey, and I want to share my answers here in the hopes of getting across again why you should do these things.
Which aspects should we keep in a potential successor model of the HD 800S?
Do not put any tape, foam, or additional damping in the front volume.
Do not put any tape, foam, or additional damping in the front volume. The only additional non-structural thing dampening the front volume should be the front dust cover, the helmholtz resonator, and the ear itself.
TL;DR Do not change the "minimal acoustic impedance" design of the front volume. If you do, you have ruined HD 800(S).
Do not change the driver. If you're going to change the
orientation of the driver, the only change you should make is bringing it closer to the ear (or in a more "frontal" angle of incidence).
Do not change the pads, unless you find a way to make them thinner to bring the driver closer to the ear.
What could be removed about the HD 800S?
If I remember correctly there were a few extra grille designs you suggested as a possible addition to the newest successor. (Picture added below). They not only look stupid in my opinion, but the additional added weight, as well as added acoustic impedance to the rear of the driver, are a waste of everyone's time but most importantly, yours. They also serve (to my knowledge, of course I'm happy to be corrected with evidence eg. frequency response measurements) no acoustic improvement.
None of this is a good thing. No audiophile will suddenly want an HD 800S successor because there's a new grill, if an aesthetic draw is what you're aiming for. It's already one of the most unique looking headphones in the world: you don't need more flash,
what you need is a better sounding, more comfortable headphone.
Also,
a shorter cable would be nice.
What could be added to the successors to improve over HD 800S?
Audiophiles like suspension straps. HD 800S would be the most comfortable headphone on the planet if it had one (preferably with a *wide* front-to-back surface area), instead of it's (IMO) much too thin headband padding.
Additionally, depending on design, a suspension strap could/would increase caliper pressure, which could have benefits to sonics as well, because if you end up reducing driver distance to the ear, you will likely bring up the ~2kHz midrange (which is HD800's biggest flaw). Think about what *no* driver distance does to Grados and the Koss on-ears
Doing these things while keeping, if possible, the overall acoustic impedance of the front volume as similar as possible to the original should be the *only* sonic goal.
HD 800S, 14 years after the original HD 800, is still competing with the flagships that cost 3-4x as much because it's design goal of low acoustic impedance and incredible comfort on the sides of the head (both of which contribute significantly to the almost universal claims of "soundstage") ended up being a
very smart goal for an over-ear headphone to have, so smart that no other flagship has captured this quality unique to the 800 lineup in that time.
Cautions:
• Don't overly harp on bass extension as a goal, it always
always comes with compromises.
• Don't change the driver for a lower resonance frequency like with 660S2. See above.
• Don't harp on making it warmer as a goal; it is already too warm in the midrange which actually highlights the treble because there aren't enough upper-mids to balance out the overall signature.
Summation of changes:
Work within the parameters that make HD 800S special:
Keep the system as low acoustic Z as possible
Keep (or slightly alter for more frontal incidence) driver orientation
Keep roominess of the inner cup
These three things are IMO what makes HD 800(S) the best flagship headphone, and what has kept it relevant in 2023 despite every brand out there trying their damndest (and failing) to beat it.
What you *can* do, is improve ergonomics!
Introduce a suspension strap, which will both (if done right) slightly increase caliper pressure, as well as possibly improve tuning due to reduced driver distance and additional seal integrity.
Tough Love:
I'm sorry to say it, but HD8XX was a disaster, sonically. It was also a massive error of communication on Sennheiser's part, as instead of fixing
the actual problem with HD 800S (the 2kHz recession), you made its biggest problem worse and called it a bass boost (which it wasn't, by the way). This is what you get when you trust the wrong people and overly focus on the wrong things.
So I ask you: Please
please PLEASE do not make the same mistake as you did with HD8XX and trust dilettante audio reviewers about how to go forward with your flagship headphone successor.
If you want to talk to a reviewer, talk to Crinacle. Talk to Resolve from Headphones.com. Talk to me and my other reviewers at Den-Fi who are (and I don't put this lightly) notorious as being some of the most ardent Sennheiser fanboys/fangirls out there.
If you want to talk to consumers,
PLEASE be careful which you put stock in. Be wary of consumers whose desires would change this design into something fundamentally different (and worse).
In conclusion:
If you want audiophiles to be excited about HD 800S: improve either ergonomics or price, while either keeping the sound 100% the same, or slightly improving it
only in the ways I've mentioned.
That's what worked for the most successful headphone release of Sennheiser's modern era (HD6XX) and it's the only thing that would make me and the hundreds of Sennheiser fans I know (who are disappointed in your modern direction) actually hopeful and excited. Thank you.
