Bowers & Wilkins PX7 noise-cancelling over ear headphones

[LDude]

While the px7 there are songs that sound incredible some others sound not that good.

Do you have a Carbon edition?

 

[RenoGu]

Do you have a Carbon edition?

No I have the regular ones.

 

[LDude]

May be that's why "there are songs that sound incredible some others sound not that good"?

 

[SirBarclay]

Is there another closed headphone with a similar sound signature. Thanks ~

 

[mainguy]

Is there another closed headphone with a similar sound signature. Thanks ~

Yup.

P9. If you want the PX7 on steroids, it does everything this does much, much better. Ofc you lose anc and wireless. Sound wise though its a gigantic step.

The P7 wireless is also kind of similar, B&W has a house sound, but to me the PX7 and P9 are closer.

Havent tried anything else really. Of the big boy headphones the Zerite is probably the closest, has a warmth and very fun sound reminiscent of the Px7 in some ways.

 

[stickertape]

I've really appreciated everyone in this thread taking their time to share their experiences with the PX7, so I thought I would return the favour for anyone else that stumbles across this thread.

Last weekend I received a new pair of PX7 Carbon Edition headphones. I've not tested these against the standard PX7's and I wasn't able to test in store due to being in very strict lockdown here due to COVID.

I've had the most experience with the Bose 700 and Momentum 3, so most of my observations will be compared to the experience with those headphones. I've been A/B testing with the M3 (I no longer have the Bose) over the last few days.

My observations so far. I might come back and tweak these over time.

Sound

• The M3 have the best listening experience across all genre's of music - but the PX7 aren't far off. Vocals are recessed a little, as many others have pointed out and I find this most noticable in acoustic tracks. Having said that, the PX7's still sound really fantastic - it's just that the M3's are better.
• PX7 have angled drivers - I picked this up because I suspect this actually makes a difference to how they sound when I turn my head or take a drink (open my mouth).
• They sound more than good enough to my, admittedly untrained, ears.
• The Bose sound really uninspiring - to the point where I just didn't enjoy most music through them. I just can't explain it - just very flat and no sense of "presence".

Fit, Comfort & Looks

• The PX7 wins. Earcups fit over my ears wonderfully. M3 cups are smaller, They either hit the top or bottom of my ear and I have to live with it. The Bose are probably second, mostly because of their light weight - but my ears tend to touch the inside of the cups.
• The M3 "feels" big and bulky, and it also looks that way on my head. The Bose look the most sleek, mostly because of their small size.
• The Bose have this strange sensation when walking that creates a large thud with every footstep - it's really uncomfortable. The M3's are best in this regard, probably because they have the worst seal around the ear due to the real leather earcups.
• I find the M3's play worst with my glasses
• The PX7 sit around your neck best as they can nearly fold down flat against your chest - M3 are the worst as they don't swivel at all. The Bose swivel the wrong way only!

Build

• They're all great really.
• Don't love the buttons on the M3, they're mushy and it's not that easy to tell which one is which (there's some very small bumps on the play/pause)
• Buttons on the PX7 are way better than the M3 - they click down properly and the rounded multifunction button was a refreshing surprise coming from the M3.
• Touch controls on the Bose are fine. Swipes forward and back can be hard due to limited swipe surface area. I'm not wedded to either touch/buttons, both work fine.
• As others have said, the material on the PX7's are a dust magnet - especially the black on the Carbons. I worry about keeping them clean down the track. Terrible material for cans really. Things also get caught in them - watch out if you have un-filed fingernails! They look fine, however.

Calls

• I could write pages on this, but in a nutshell: 1: Bose 700 2: PX7 3: M3. M3 is worst by a long way. All of them are terrible in their own way. There are significant limitations due to bluetooth so it's not all their fault.
• The PX7 and M3 don't have sidetone. The Bose 700 do, but it doesn't work in a Zoom or Teams call.
• If you're using ambient mode (you really need to if you want to hear yourself talk), then the PX7 disable ambient mode when joining a call. You can re-enable it when joining a call, but only with the app - holding down the NC button does nothing during a call. I've raised this with B&W and they are aware of this behaviour.
• People complain about the clarity of my voice on all three - less on the Bose, but the Bose drops out the most and can turn robotic randomly - so using any of these for calls is not recommended and I've given up on this being a key feature of bluetooth headphones. My little Jabra active 45e sport headphones blow them all out of the water.
• The M3's are basically unusable for calls in my experience.

Case

• Bose probably wins, mostly because it's a hard case and it's smaller. The PX7 case is really nice and provides excellent protection. I don't even know why they bothered including a case with the M3's - it's that bad. Plus it's obnoxiously huge.
• The case for the PX7 and Bose are similar - the main downsides are that the headphones both don't fold into the headband and in order to get them into the case, you have to reduce the headband size down to it's smallest. This means that you need to readjust them to your head every time you get them out of the case.

Connectivity (including multipoint)

• Indeed nothing is perfect. The worst by a long way is the Bose 700 - I could write about the problems all day.
• PX7 is best, M3 is second. Probably no surprise - I think the chipset in the PX7 is just a newer generation of the same chipset in the M3.
• Multipoint has subtle differences in each headset. For my use cases, I find the PX7 to be the most reliable and sensible.

App

• The apps are all terrible. When you can actually connect to the headphones, they generally work OK. I find the PX7's to be most reliable when establishing a connection with the app. The Bose and the M3 are shocking - absolutely terrible.
• Wish the B&W app had an EQ like the others
• Managing connections to other devices via the B&W app is also good.

Battery and charging

• They all last long enough quite honestly - and I find them to be pretty close to their advertised battery life.
• The M3's are very particular about what USB-C charging cable you use - they don't work with most of mine which is a major downside for me
• The indicator light on my PX7's does nothing when charging - it doesn't turn on at all. Surely this isn't normal (reading the manual suggests its not) - do others have this issue?

 

[Radiorog]

May be that's why "there are songs that sound incredible some others sound not that good"?

As opposed to almost everything sounding sub par as is with the carbon edition. So disappointed with mine. So tempted to swap for the non carbons. Just no real oomf, and crap at low volumes, too thin.

 

[Radiorog]

I've really appreciated everyone in this thread taking their time to share their experiences with the PX7, so I thought I would return the favour for anyone else that stumbles across this thread.

Last weekend I received a new pair of PX7 Carbon Edition headphones. I've not tested these against the standard PX7's and I wasn't able to test in store due to being in very strict lockdown here due to COVID.

I've had the most experience with the Bose 700 and Momentum 3, so most of my observations will be compared to the experience with those headphones. I've been A/B testing with the M3 (I no longer have the Bose) over the last few days.

My observations so far. I might come back and tweak these over time.

Sound

• The M3 have the best listening experience across all genre's of music - but the PX7 aren't far off. Vocals are recessed a little, as many others have pointed out and I find this most noticable in acoustic tracks. Having said that, the PX7's still sound really fantastic - it's just that the M3's are better.
• PX7 have angled drivers - I picked this up because I suspect this actually makes a difference to how they sound when I turn my head or take a drink (open my mouth).
• They sound more than good enough to my, admittedly untrained, ears.
• The Bose sound really uninspiring - to the point where I just didn't enjoy most music through them. I just can't explain it - just very flat and no sense of "presence".

Fit, Comfort & Looks

• The PX7 wins. Earcups fit over my ears wonderfully. M3 cups are smaller, They either hit the top or bottom of my ear and I have to live with it. The Bose are probably second, mostly because of their light weight - but my ears tend to touch the inside of the cups.
• The M3 "feels" big and bulky, and it also looks that way on my head. The Bose look the most sleek, mostly because of their small size.
• The Bose have this strange sensation when walking that creates a large thud with every footstep - it's really uncomfortable. The M3's are best in this regard, probably because they have the worst seal around the ear due to the real leather earcups.
• I find the M3's play worst with my glasses
• The PX7 sit around your neck best as they can nearly fold down flat against your chest - M3 are the worst as they don't swivel at all. The Bose swivel the wrong way only!

Build

• They're all great really.
• Don't love the buttons on the M3, they're mushy and it's not that easy to tell which one is which (there's some very small bumps on the play/pause)
• Buttons on the PX7 are way better than the M3 - they click down properly and the rounded multifunction button was a refreshing surprise coming from the M3.
• Touch controls on the Bose are fine. Swipes forward and back can be hard due to limited swipe surface area. I'm not wedded to either touch/buttons, both work fine.
• As others have said, the material on the PX7's are a dust magnet - especially the black on the Carbons. I worry about keeping them clean down the track. Terrible material for cans really. Things also get caught in them - watch out if you have un-filed fingernails! They look fine, however.

Calls

• I could write pages on this, but in a nutshell: 1: Bose 700 2: PX7 3: M3. M3 is worst by a long way. All of them are terrible in their own way. There are significant limitations due to bluetooth so it's not all their fault.
• The PX7 and M3 don't have sidetone. The Bose 700 do, but it doesn't work in a Zoom or Teams call.
• If you're using ambient mode (you really need to if you want to hear yourself talk), then the PX7 disable ambient mode when joining a call. You can re-enable it when joining a call, but only with the app - holding down the NC button does nothing during a call. I've raised this with B&W and they are aware of this behaviour.
• People complain about the clarity of my voice on all three - less on the Bose, but the Bose drops out the most and can turn robotic randomly - so using any of these for calls is not recommended and I've given up on this being a key feature of bluetooth headphones. My little Jabra active 45e sport headphones blow them all out of the water.
• The M3's are basically unusable for calls in my experience.

Case

• Bose probably wins, mostly because it's a hard case and it's smaller. The PX7 case is really nice and provides excellent protection. I don't even know why they bothered including a case with the M3's - it's that bad. Plus it's obnoxiously huge.
• The case for the PX7 and Bose are similar - the main downsides are that the headphones both don't fold into the headband and in order to get them into the case, you have to reduce the headband size down to it's smallest. This means that you need to readjust them to your head every time you get them out of the case.

Connectivity (including multipoint)

• Indeed nothing is perfect. The worst by a long way is the Bose 700 - I could write about the problems all day.
• PX7 is best, M3 is second. Probably no surprise - I think the chipset in the PX7 is just a newer generation of the same chipset in the M3.
• Multipoint has subtle differences in each headset. For my use cases, I find the PX7 to be the most reliable and sensible.

App

• The apps are all terrible. When you can actually connect to the headphones, they generally work OK. I find the PX7's to be most reliable when establishing a connection with the app. The Bose and the M3 are shocking - absolutely terrible.
• Wish the B&W app had an EQ like the others
• Managing connections to other devices via the B&W app is also good.

Battery and charging

• They all last long enough quite honestly - and I find them to be pretty close to their advertised battery life.
• The M3's are very particular about what USB-C charging cable you use - they don't work with most of mine which is a major downside for me
• The indicator light on my PX7's does nothing when charging - it doesn't turn on at all. Surely this isn't normal (reading the manual suggests its not) - do others have this issue?

Double check which version of the firmware you have. Muddied midrange sounds like 1.1 to me, as my carbons are anything but muddied in the vocals.

 

[stickertape]

Double check which version of the firmware you have. Muddied midrange sounds like 1.1 to me, as my carbons are anything but muddied in the vocals.

Hmm, maybe you're right. I just put on some Billy Joel and he sounds like he's right there in front of me! These are running firmware v 1.2 (came with it out of the box - it was the first thing I checked).

As opposed to almost everything sounding sub par as is with the carbon edition. So disappointed with mine. So tempted to swap for the non carbons. Just no real oomf, and crap at low volumes, too thin.

As I alluded to in my previous post, the fit on your head really does make a big difference to how they sound - presumably a combination of the seal and the unique angled drivers. Somewhat agree with your volume comment, raising above a threshold seems to make a significant difference to the signature.

They're still a far better package than any other bluetooth headphones I've used and overall I still really enjoy their sound, so I think I'll be keeping them.

I just hope given the age of these that B&W haven't given up on firmware updates and EQ functionality - I think there's still some tweaks that can be made (eg. the NC button function during a call). I worry that they might have already shifted their focus to whatever the next model will be given the lack of updates.

 

[Maukey]

So, quick question for the current owners of the Carbon Edition who've had experience with the OG Space Grey or Silver. I know there's been discussion about firmware 1.2 on the Carbon and them having a less exciting sound than the OGs and their 1.1 firmware.

Has anyone tried comparing the Carbon Edition's sound with ANC On in comparison to off? Asking because on the OGs, the sound was better with ANC off. With it on, the sound became more muffled and even bassier. I'm wondering if the Carbons with ANC on is similar in sound to the OGs with ANC off. Maybe I'm overthinking, but when I tried the Carbons I only tried them with ANC off because that was how I had previously listened to the Space Grey I had. I immediately sent them back because I didn't like the sound. Could it be possible that B&W adjusted the sound so that it sounds better with ANC on since that's how most people listen to ANC headphones? It may be false hope on my part but I'm hoping someone can answer.

 

[Sonic Defender]

Unless B&W is saying that the firmware update was intended to adjust the sound, it makes no sense to believe that it is. The idea that companies use firmware to fix sound without admitting it is essentially the stuff of conspiracy theories. It takes on person who believes in these things to update the firmware, "hear" a noticeable difference, post about it online and start the chain of suggestion and suddenly lots of people "hear" the difference.

This happens all the time, people claim to hear differences, you look at what the company states the firmware update addressed and see not a single mention of sound quality, and yet once somebody convinces themselves it is true, there is no dislodging them off that belief. I have even seen this happen when the company publicly states there are no sound fixes and yet people simple double down on their assumption and become convinced that the company is just trying to hide the need to fix the sound so they fail to disclose that was part of the firmware update.

I am not saying that a firmware update can't address known sound quality issues, but to assume that one does without the company who authored the firmware update disclosing it publicly is problematic.

 

[Maukey]

Unless B&W is saying that the firmware update was intended to adjust the sound, it makes no sense to believe that it is. The idea that companies use firmware to fix sound without admitting it is essentially the stuff of conspiracy theories. It takes on person who believes in these things to update the firmware, "hear" a noticeable difference, post about it online and start the chain of suggestion and suddenly lots of people "hear" the difference.

This happens all the time, people claim to hear differences, you look at what the company states the firmware update addressed and see not a single mention of sound quality, and yet once somebody convinces themselves it is true, there is no dislodging them off that belief. I have even seen this happen when the company publicly states there are no sound fixes and yet people simple double down on their assumption and become convinced that the company is just trying to hide the need to fix the sound so they fail to disclose that was part of the firmware update.

I am not saying that a firmware update can't address known sound quality issues, but to assume that one does without the company who authored the firmware update disclosing it publicly is problematic.

Companies indeed adjust sound via firmware. Bose and Beats has done it multiple times. I do agree that I've never seen a company admit it, and my thought is why would they? Now, as for the PX7, I can't say whether they did or didn't 100% because I've never compared a headphone with 1.2 and 1.1 side by side. All I know is, I originally owned the Space Grey PX7 with 1.1, I loved the sound for it's dynamic, unique, almost stage monitor like tuning. Very exciting. I ended up selling it to try other headphones. A few months past and I grab the Carbon with 1.2, and I did not enjoy the sound. Now that could be because I had been listening to different headphones for months so my ear preference may have changed, but I just know I didn't get the same exciting, dynamic feeling that I had from the originals. It's very well possible that I didn't give it enough time for break in or my ears to adjust. Tempted to pick up the Carbons again for another test run.

 

[ryanmatic]

Wasn't there an interview or something a while back where a B&W engineer mentioned needing to change the DSP to account for the different materials used in the Carbons? Maybe I'm misremembering things. I've only heard the Space Gray PX7s, but to @Maukey's point, their sound is so uniquely dramatic that it strikes me as a headphone you could pretty easily distinguish even from memory (and most Carbon posts in this very thread say similar things about 1.2 having lost the punchiness of 1.1).

 

[mainguy]

I've really appreciated everyone in this thread taking their time to share their experiences with the PX7, so I thought I would return the favour for anyone else that stumbles across this thread.

Last weekend I received a new pair of PX7 Carbon Edition headphones. I've not tested these against the standard PX7's and I wasn't able to test in store due to being in very strict lockdown here due to COVID.

I've had the most experience with the Bose 700 and Momentum 3, so most of my observations will be compared to the experience with those headphones. I've been A/B testing with the M3 (I no longer have the Bose) over the last few days.

My observations so far. I might come back and tweak these over time.

Sound

• The M3 have the best listening experience across all genre's of music - but the PX7 aren't far off. Vocals are recessed a little, as many others have pointed out and I find this most noticable in acoustic tracks. Having said that, the PX7's still sound really fantastic - it's just that the M3's are better.
• PX7 have angled drivers - I picked this up because I suspect this actually makes a difference to how they sound when I turn my head or take a drink (open my mouth).
• They sound more than good enough to my, admittedly untrained, ears.
• The Bose sound really uninspiring - to the point where I just didn't enjoy most music through them. I just can't explain it - just very flat and no sense of "presence".

I too had the M3 & PX7, I agree, the M3 just about takes the cake. A bit more clarity in the mid range.
That said, I then tried the P7 wireless and thought it was a dramatic improvement on the px7, despite being an older model, and even better than the M3! The bass is a lot more controlled on P7w than the M3.

 

[Radiorog]

So, quick question for the current owners of the Carbon Edition who've had experience with the OG Space Grey or Silver. I know there's been discussion about firmware 1.2 on the Carbon and them having a less exciting sound than the OGs and their 1.1 firmware.

Has anyone tried comparing the Carbon Edition's sound with ANC On in comparison to off? Asking because on the OGs, the sound was better with ANC off. With it on, the sound became more muffled and even bassier. I'm wondering if the Carbons with ANC on is similar in sound to the OGs with ANC off. Maybe I'm overthinking, but when I tried the Carbons I only tried them with ANC off because that was how I had previously listened to the Space Grey I had. I immediately sent them back because I didn't like the sound. Could it be possible that B&W adjusted the sound so that it sounds better with ANC on since that's how most people listen to ANC headphones? It may be false hope on my part but I'm hoping someone can answer.

Hi,
I remember with the firmware 1.1 on the carbins there was a very slight change in sound with anc on. I noticed straight away when the cans were updated to 1.2 the sound changes even less with anc on. I cannot notice any change in sound now with anc on or off.