Bowers & Wilkins P7 Wireless - Impressions Thread
Apr 10, 2017 at 5:21 PM Post #1,216 of 1,955
Oh boy run for cover!
biggrin.gif
Your profession is one of the most hated because of the loudness war, even though it's not the ME's fault, it's the "clients" .

 
No kidding - a recording/mastering engineer is what produced what may be my favorite worst-sounding album of all time, Californication by Red Hot Chili Peppers. Such a great, great album just completely destroyed by horrific mastering. :frowning2:
 
What I would give to hear it mastered properly.
 
Apr 10, 2017 at 6:37 PM Post #1,217 of 1,955
   
No kidding - a recording/mastering engineer is what produced what may be my favorite worst-sounding album of all time, Californication by Red Hot Chili Peppers. Such a great, great album just completely destroyed by horrific mastering. :frowning2:
 
What I would give to hear it mastered properly.

I have a version where it was supposedly remstered from the sessions and I believe it is better, but I haven't heard it in years. I'll see if I can find it for you, send me a PM.
 
Apr 10, 2017 at 10:21 PM Post #1,218 of 1,955
 
Apr 11, 2017 at 1:25 AM Post #1,219 of 1,955
The p7w are certainly no hype, for wireless headphones they're pretty incredible, and even wired they hold their own.

If you read the comments in the 'Huge Comparison of [almost] all the Best Bluetooth Headphones' you'll find the p7w are considered one of the very best wireless cans around at the moment and this is after being compared directly to many other high end headphones by many users! Maybe they don't compare to some of the best high end open back wired cans but to the vast majority they sound pretty great and more importantly very enjoyable!

Personally I feel that as a 'mastering engineer' your giving other 'mastering engineers' a bad name by entering a thread for the p7w and proceeding to leave your negative comments and un-constructive criticism where previously there'd been good natured and friendly discussions designed to help people make informed decisions on what headphones are right for them.

There, I said my piece.
haha. Didn't notice the wink?
Besides, many P7 advocates were in other threads doing what you described. Didn't seem to be a problem then.
 
Apr 11, 2017 at 3:29 AM Post #1,221 of 1,955
haha. Didn't notice the wink?
Besides, many P7 advocates were in other threads doing what you described. Didn't seem to be a problem then.


Maybe I was a bit harsh in my comments. I just see this forum as somewhere for like minded individuals to get together and share their experiences, and any undue negativity and argumentativeness just seems to go against the spirit of what should be a friendly and inviting place to come. I realise that my comments just added to the negativity and for that I apologise.
 
Apr 11, 2017 at 4:37 AM Post #1,222 of 1,955
No kidding - a recording/mastering engineer is what produced what may be my favorite worst-sounding album of all time, Californication by Red Hot Chili Peppers. Such a great, great album just completely destroyed by horrific mastering. :frowning2:

What I would give to hear it mastered properly.


Don't blame the mastering engineers, blame the client - "It needs to be louder"
 
Apr 11, 2017 at 5:04 AM Post #1,223 of 1,955
i blame mastering sound engineers for all the suffering we have to put with due to how badly they threw at us recordings. If i was an artist and my album was recorded badly man I would not let it be released 
 
Apr 11, 2017 at 5:12 AM Post #1,224 of 1,955
  i blame mastering sound engineers for all the suffering we have to put with due to how badly they threw at us recordings. If i was an artist and my album was recorded badly man I would not let it be released 


I don't think it's right just to 'have a go' at mastering engineers per-se. They have a job to do, like all the people in this industry, and on balance they often produce beautiful results.
And anyway, wasn't this meant to be a thread on the P7W? Can we keep to topic, rather than character-assassinate people unrelated to the thread, who have a job to do?
 
Apr 11, 2017 at 6:07 AM Post #1,225 of 1,955
i blame mastering sound engineers for all the suffering we have to put with due to how badly they threw at us recordings. If i was an artist and my album was recorded badly man I would not let it be released 


A mastering engineer has nothing to do with the actual recording.

What a mastering engineer's job is, is to take the final mixdown of the track, or especially tracks for an EP or Album and produce a consistency across them in so that you don't get tracks that don't match from a tonal balance or volume level point of view, and also to get the most out of what they've been supplied. Unfortunately if they get a turd, they can probably polish it a bit, but it'll still be a turd. Often it might be so bad that the mastering engineer might request that the track goes back to the mix stage again.

Originally a mastering engineers job was to figure out how to get the track/s onto vinyl in such a way as the stylus doesn't skip when playing, and so that the cutting head servos didn't burn out when the master was cut, as well as maintaining a good balanced sound quality.
 
Apr 11, 2017 at 6:12 AM Post #1,226 of 1,955
A mastering engineer has nothing to do with the actual recording.

What a mastering engineer's job is, is to take the final mixdown of the track, or especially tracks for an EP or Album and produce a consistency across them in so that you don't get tracks that don't match from a tonal balance or volume level point of view, and also to get the most out of what they've been supplied. Unfortunately if they get a turd, they can probably polish it a bit, but it'll still be a turd. Often it might be so bad that the mastering engineer might request that the track goes back to the mix stage again.

Originally a mastering engineers job was to figure out how to get the track/s onto vinyl in such a way as the stylus doesn't skip when playing, and so that the cutting head servos didn't burn out when the master was cut, as well as maintaining a good balanced sound quality.

so its then the recording engineer that is to be blamed sorry for not get the right person to be blamed right :wink:
 
Apr 16, 2017 at 4:40 PM Post #1,228 of 1,955
Beforehand, I must say I didn't read all 88 pages... @Page 50 or so I ordered the B&W P7 Wireless :wink:
 
Still.....
 
For what it's worth, I wanted to give something back to the community, as I purchased the B&W P7 Wireless mainly whilst reading the topics over here. Now beforehand: my native language is Dutch, so please forgive any flaw on my behalf regarding grammar, punctionation and all that. I am leaning towards being an audiophile, that is I tend to listen to music intensely and more focussed than most, I'd say. I love the sensation of listening to good music and good equipment and I can distinguish a low-end sound-set from a higher end set for sure. I skip the Noise Cancelling setting on the PSB M4U as sound quality drops way to much to be part of any quality discussion IMHO. Nice gimmick, but that's about it.
 
Both the PSB M4U 2 and the B&W P7 Wireless were connected with the accompanied cable to a DragonFly Black V2 DAC to a Surface Pro 4. Listenend to samples of Pirates of the caribbean 2007 At World's End, especially "Hoist the Colours" and "Singapore" as well as 2011 On Stranger Tides, especially the track "On Stranger Tides" both FLAC, 672kbps / 746kbps / 711 kbps.
 
PSB M4U 2 set to Off setting.
-> Very good, rich, detailed, never really pronounced. Pure and fair throughout the entire spectrum, a touch less sprankling in the upper regions (>8 - 10 Khz) maybe and a tiny bit 'muddy' in the lower mids and lower regions (you hear a rumbling sound, but cannot really grasp it, hard to explain....)
PSB M4U 2 On setting (Red, no noise cancelling, internal amplifier on) -> Separation and detail overall increases a lot in my opinion. Even better detail, a bit more pronounced and detailed in the low regions (they tend to be flatter, more natural throughout the lowest you can hear, I found it to be more natural and pleasing, also with more detail than with the 'off' setting). Higher frequencies also get even better, more flat throughout the spectrum for sure. Detail and seperation both are very, very good at the On setting. I think the mids are a bit too pronounced though at some frequencies (very noticable listening to "Hoist the Colours" @ 0:18), and tend to get a bit too much aplification. Here the B&W's sounds much better I think. There is a detectable less detailed mid frequency response to my liking and it really is a bit too pronounced. In "Hoist the Colours" at the end you can hear what sounds like coins falling or chains. It is as if you can hear each coin falling seperately / each link in the chain seperately... It is subtle, but still. I can hear more detail and more seperation in the last few seconds off "Hoist the Colours". Whereas with the B&W's I can't. Here, the PSB wins in my opinion (although I still very much like the B&W p7 wireless 'but wired' upper frequency response!). Overall: mids are too pronouned, highest frequencies are very good with lots of detail and separation. Lower regions are true, pure and fair. Very pleasing indeed.
 
B&W P7, also with wired connection to aforementioned DragonFly.
Overall, these win in my opinion, except for the highest frequency detail. Although the highest frequencies do sound more pleasant (compared to PSB!), they lack some separation (compared to PSB!), B&W sounds more vidid / sprankling in the upper most regions though. I still like the B&W sound and can live with a tad less separation. I went over from one to the other many many times.... *Overall* detail is a tiny bit better. Lowest regions are way better with the B&W's I think. More separation, more detail. These are warm sounding headphones. The lower end is, hard to explain, warmer, lower, deeper, more pleasant sounding compared to the PSB. What I liked the most with B&W is the warmer sound, the better detail overall (except highest frequencies). The mids are a bit less pronounced compared to the PSB, I liked the B&W's way more!. I have to say I like hearing a rich and dark sound, one might say the B&W P7 sounds warm/dark/rich. But I do say the treble, the higher end of the spectrum also sounds very very good! Strange thing is, highest high is less detailed, but still more pleasant sounding. For mids and lows the B&W's really wins in all regards in my opinion. Highs might be subjective. I like it more than the PSB highs, although, as said, there is less detail and separation.
 
Overall, to me, wired, the B&W P7 wins by a hair compared to the PSB in the "ON" setting. Compared to the PSB in OFF setting the B&W wins by 2 hairs. If I was forced to give a recommendation, I'd say listen to both if you can, to me the B&W wins. Enough so to make me very very happy with my purchase... but read on!
The most strange finding of all (to me): The B&W WIRELESS (with a good source - same as wired - and a good bluetooth connection) sound almost as good as wired. Wired is detectable better, but not by much. You loose a hair of separation and detail, but it is really barely noticable! I have never ever heard anything sounding this good, WIRELESS. It really is astoundingly good, and barely detectable less good as a wired connection. I could hear a difference, but really, bluetooth B&W P7 wireless is very, very good indeed. So good I have decided to drop the dragonfly DAC and wire for my everyday listening pleasure. Only when I really want to immerse myself, and truly focus 100% on the music at hand, I find myself connecting the DragonFly / wire. It is better, by a hair (or 2, allright then...)
 
The B&W P7 Wireless really deserve a thourough listen. I think they are on par with the PSB M4U wired, and even with the B&W themselfs wired, although you lose maybe a few percent detail and separation. Well done B&W, very well done...
 
Apr 17, 2017 at 8:26 AM Post #1,229 of 1,955
  ... Well done B&W, very well done...

I agree with your take on the P7 wireless, still my favourite wireless signature to date but as always, honourable mention to the H500BT that really bumps up right against the P7W for sound quality and agreeableness of the signature. Nice to hear that this thread helped you make a purchasing decision and one that you are happy with. Enjoy.
 
Apr 19, 2017 at 11:09 AM Post #1,230 of 1,955
Considering I've owned the B&W P7 Wireless for a little while, I'm almost embarrassed to ask this but I will.  Does the B&W P7 Wireless have a microphone built in or did it come with a cable I can't find with a Mic on it?  
 
I've just read about Dolby Atmos capabilities in headphones from the Xbox One that supposedly work with any existing headphones - so I would love to see how a game like Overwatch, which is Atmos enabled, sounds with the B&W P7 Wireless headphone run in wired mode to plug into the controller.
 

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