Beyerdynamic

[trane]

So im looking for headphones. Originally I wanted the k701 or sennheiser 650, but then I found out I would have to invest in a good amp to truly appreciate those headphones. So I started looking at headphones with low impedance cuz i guess that if a headphone has a low impedance I wont need an amp as much. I considered the Denon D2000, AD900, and a couple others that were recommended to me. One I came across on the forum, but was not recommended to me was the Beyerdynamic dt48e which have an impedance of 25 ohm i think. It looks like these headphones have a handful of people who own them and absolutely love them. In a dt48-senn hd650, they were described as cold, analytical,  and dry though. So I have a few questions: Why aren't these as widely recommended as the other brands I mentioned? Are these headphones good for jazz, soul/rnb, classical, what genre are they best suited for? and what does cold, analytical and dry mean, compared to warm, im new to this so im not familiar with the terminology.

 

[Mr Joboto]

The DT48 are supposed to be extremely neutral, they don't colour the sound in any way (adding or sucking out bass, mids or treble) so I'd say they aren't a headphone that 'suits any genre' rather they pick apart the music and let you hear what the recording was originally intended to sound like.

 

[kool bubba ice]

Unknown.. Not well respected by the masses. Very genre specific..But have one of the most beautiful & authentic mid range regardless of price IMO. Beyer only markets then to a certain market. polarizing. Not 'musical', whatever that means.. The only 'cold', 'dry,' & 'analytical' DT48 are the DT48A.. They are audio metric & overly analytical IMO..
Quote:

So im looking for headphones. Originally I wanted the k701 or sennheiser 650, but then I found out I would have to invest in a good amp to truly appreciate those headphones. So I started looking at headphones with low impedance cuz i guess that if a headphone has a low impedance I wont need an amp as much. I considered the Denon D2000, AD900, and a couple others that were recommended to me. One I came across on the forum, but was not recommended to me was the Beyerdynamic dt48e which have an impedance of 25 ohm i think. It looks like these headphones have a handful of people who own them and absolutely love them. In a dt48-senn hd650, they were described as cold, analytical,  and dry though. So I have a few questions: Why aren't these as widely recommended as the other brands I mentioned? Are these headphones good for jazz, soul/rnb, classical, what genre are they best suited for? and what does cold, analytical and dry mean, compared to warm, im new to this so im not familiar with the terminology.

 

[Soaa-]

The DT 48 sounds perfectly musical to me. Excellent in terms of neutrality and transparency, and extremely life-like. It's not the powerful and awe inspiring sound that people have come to expect; they produce a very natural and straight to the point sound that's faithful to the recording.

 

[Uncle Erik]

First, impedance does not tell you how easy a headphone is to drive. Impedance is a term that tells you the efficiency of power transfer from an amplifier to headphones, or speakers for that matter. The closer the output impedance matches the impedance of your headphones, the better the power transfers. If there is an impedance mismatch, you can have power loss. There are formulas for this and a few other ins and outs, but impedance, by itself, tells you nothing. If you have an engine with 500HP, that might seem like a lot. 500HP in a 1,500lbs. car is tremendous. 500HP in a school bus is, well, not quite as impressive.

It can be the case that a speaker has a very low impedance, like Apogees. One model has a 1.2 Ohm impedance. However, it is a very tricky load. If you use an amp not up to the task, the Apogees will overheat and melt the amp.

As for buying a headphone amp, there's one cheap way out: used receivers. You can get something like a HD-650 or a K-701 if you pick up an old receiver for $20-$50 at a garage sale. Some receivers sound very good with headphones and, thankfully,they're fully depreciated and two channel receivers are often unwanted these days. Pick one up if you want to power good headphones on the cheap.

The DT48 is a special case. I've had a couple of pairs for awhile and they draw very mixed reactions at meets. Some people are surprised and really like them and some hate them. I find the DT48 incredibly transparent and it works well with acoustic, vocals, classical, and acoustic jazz. There is truly something special about their mids - few headphones get them as "right" as the DT48 does. Also, the build quality is excellent. Only the HP-2 is better made. I don't know why the DT48 doesn't have a bigger cult following, but I am happy that Beyerdynamic continues to manufacture it. I am very happy with the pairs I own and they will always be a part of my collection.

 

[chinesekiwi]

Quote:

The DT48 is a special case. I've had a couple of pairs for awhile and they draw very mixed reactions at meets. Some people are surprised and really like them and some hate them. I find the DT48 incredibly transparent and it works well with acoustic, vocals, classical, and acoustic jazz. There is truly something special about their mids - few headphones get them as "right" as the DT48 does. Also, the build quality is excellent. Only the HP-2 is better made. I don't know why the DT48 doesn't have a bigger cult following, but I am happy that Beyerdynamic continues to manufacture it. I am very happy with the pairs I own and they will always be a part of my collection.

 
Well, it's a rare headphone thus not many have heard it. Simple explanation really.
 

 

[kool bubba ice]

I'd say more unknown then rare..I been at head Fi for two yrs before I heard about them. Beyer just does a terrible job marketing them (not casual friendly) cause they are just for a niche group of professionals.. They been around for ever, so I wouldn't say it's due to their rarity.. The 600 ohm DT880 are probably more rare, but are helped by the popularity of the DT880 in general.. & they do have a excellent track record for being quality headphones.
Quote:

 
Well, it's a rare headphone thus not many have heard it. Simple explanation really.
 

 

[kool bubba ice]

Just another happy new DT48 owner:
 
 My long search for headphones with perfect mids is over for now...thankfully. I thought I'd have to try the k50X, the dt880/600ohm and the hd6X0's and maybe the Fostex orthos, but thankfully the dt48e is giving me the reference can I've been looking for for a long time...at least covering the mid range. I tried re-mixing a couple of my own songs with them and they're amazing! You can hear every minor EQ change or change in compressor settings. Incredible!!!! Wish I had these 2-3 years ago when I recorded a lot of my songs for my CD
Lejaz

 

[Maxvla]

Quote:

If you have an engine with 500HP, that might seem like a lot. 500HP in a 1,500lbs. car is tremendous. 500HP in a school bus is, well, not quite as impressive.

I LOL'd quite audibly at the above reference. Good stuff, Erik.

 

[kool bubba ice]

I respectivley disagree with this comment. I talked to a MOTT who has vast experience with both headphones who told me the DT48 does a better job at protecting their drivers.. & While the HP2 uses hot glue, the DT48 use nuts, bolts, & steel.. In fact, there is no plastic, or glue in any part of the DT48 design, minus the padding.. The Diaphram & magnetic are not glued together like 99% of headphones, they are separated in individual metal housing.. He also told me, the Construction of the DT48 is quite amazing.. So, I would say the DT48 is more sturdy & better built then the HP2.
 
Now if you want to tell me the HP2 sounds better, I can't argue with that.. I never heard the HP2. Sound is always subjective.. If a person thinks the DT48 is the worst headphone ever, I can't prove him wrong.. But construction is a different story.. I'm still amazed how some think the DT48 is nothing unique & is just your average headphone.. I'm not talking about their sound either.. I sold a DT48E to Lejaz for 135.00.. He told me the mid range is like sex.. A headphone you can get for 135.00 with a mid range that is comparable to headphones in the 1,000-2,000 range is quite astonishing.
 
Detractors would make you believe it just me who feels this way.. But ask Soaa & Lejaz & a host of other DT48 owners whose admiration for the DT48 is un wavering..
 
Quote:

First, impedance does not tell you how easy a headphone is to drive. Impedance is a term that tells you the efficiency of power transfer from an amplifier to headphones, or speakers for that matter. The closer the output impedance matches the impedance of your headphones, the better the power transfers. If there is an impedance mismatch, you can have power loss. There are formulas for this and a few other ins and outs, but impedance, by itself, tells you nothing. If you have an engine with 500HP, that might seem like a lot. 500HP in a 1,500lbs. car is tremendous. 500HP in a school bus is, well, not quite as impressive.

It can be the case that a speaker has a very low impedance, like Apogees. One model has a 1.2 Ohm impedance. However, it is a very tricky load. If you use an amp not up to the task, the Apogees will overheat and melt the amp.

As for buying a headphone amp, there's one cheap way out: used receivers. You can get something like a HD-650 or a K-701 if you pick up an old receiver for $20-$50 at a garage sale. Some receivers sound very good with headphones and, thankfully,they're fully depreciated and two channel receivers are often unwanted these days. Pick one up if you want to power good headphones on the cheap.

The DT48 is a special case. I've had a couple of pairs for awhile and they draw very mixed reactions at meets. Some people are surprised and really like them and some hate them. I find the DT48 incredibly transparent and it works well with acoustic, vocals, classical, and acoustic jazz. There is truly something special about their mids - few headphones get them as "right" as the DT48 does. Also, the build quality is excellent. Only the HP-2 is better made. I don't know why the DT48 doesn't have a bigger cult following, but I am happy that Beyerdynamic continues to manufacture it. I am very happy with the pairs I own and they will always be a part of my collection.

 

[lejaz]

 
Quote:

So im looking for headphones. Originally I wanted the k701 or sennheiser 650, but then I found out I would have to invest in a good amp to truly appreciate those headphones. So I started looking at headphones with low impedance cuz i guess that if a headphone has a low impedance I wont need an amp as much. I considered the Denon D2000, AD900, and a couple others that were recommended to me. One I came across on the forum, but was not recommended to me was the Beyerdynamic dt48e which have an impedance of 25 ohm i think. It looks like these headphones have a handful of people who own them and absolutely love them. In a dt48-senn hd650, they were described as cold, analytical,  and dry though. So I have a few questions: Why aren't these as widely recommended as the other brands I mentioned? Are these headphones good for jazz, soul/rnb, classical, what genre are they best suited for? and what does cold, analytical and dry mean, compared to warm, im new to this so im not familiar with the terminology.

One reason why they are not widely recommended: I love the dt48 with vocals and acoustic instruments, but...and a big but...they make the k70X
sound like bass monsters. They are very cold. For what they do well though, there's nothing I've heard that's quite like them. They are not at all speaker like. They almost totally remove the distance between the listener and the performer. Listening to Norah Jones with them, it seems like she's sitting a couple of inches away from you singing into your ear. Made me almost feel like I was cheating on my girlfriend!

 

[Soaa-]

Quote:

 
One reason why they are not widely recommended: I love the dt48 with vocals and acoustic instruments, but...and a big but...they make the k70X
sound like bass monsters. They are very cold. For what they do well though, there's nothing I've heard that's quite like them. They are not at all speaker like. They almost totally remove the distance between the listener and the performer. Listening to Norah Jones with them, it seems like she's sitting a couple of inches away from you singing into your ear. Made me almost feel like I was cheating on my girlfriend!

And that is the great thing about them. They sound as they should -- like headphones, really damn good headphones, and nothing else.
 
Odd that they make the K 70x sound like bass monsters though; I thought the DT 48 was supposed to have a flatter bass extension them? It could just be the source not coping well with the low impedance. I haven't found a source yet that copes with low impedance either, so I just made an impedance adapter for mine.
 
And, I guess it's a plus that I'm single!

 

[lejaz]

 
@Soaa
I'd love to hear the dt48 with some decent low end. I'll PM you about the impedance adapter. Don't want to derail the thread.

 

[kool bubba ice]

IMO.. Only the DT48A are cold.. I really don't consider the DT48e cold... I mean, compared to the 650 or RS1, then, yes.. They are ice type cold.. But on their own, they are not cold at all..
 
If you feel they are cold.. Get a tube amp.. They will do wonders.. There will be more richness to the sound & add nice warmth to the vocals.. & as I stated prior.. If the low end is a problem, try the new models, they are a bit better in that area. The bass is total neutral & 100% depends on the source.. Beyers needed to make certain sacrifices to meet NAGRA's strict standard.. A better seal also helps.

 

[EYEdROP]

To me, they are not cold sounding but are still "bass light" when you compare to more colored headphones. They lack bass slam and frequency extension. The bass it does have however is very controlled, tight, and consistent with the recording. It is the type of bass you hear, not feel. However, if the song inheritly has lots of bass slam (like rap music), it will still be reproduced and sound bass heavy (by DT48 standards). Its just that it dosent rattle your head by any means.
  
For me, the bass incorporates perfectly into the mids and highs. They are "bass light" for a reason.