[Blitzula]

I know people love the DAC1, but it was way too bright and sibilant for me.

 

[kuma]

Blitzula,

The CD3.5 uses a 18 bit DAC with Phillips VAM1201 transport.
Amasingly still a good player but it can sound really rough around the edges compared to the newer Naim players. I do like how this player carries on the tune. It drives the music from the bottoms up rather than the head first. No sticking out trebles and has a better note shaping than its predecessor.
Upside of the CD3.5 over the CD5i is you have an option to add an external PSU later whereas CD5i, you can not.

CDS2/XPS:
This is a Naim's former flagship player with the old PSU. ( current model is XPS2 with slightly different voicing )
Most natural sounding out of all Olive range. Better frequency extension, resolution and warmer tonal balance yet it has the best timing out of the old range and can still compete well with the new players.
As you expect, it is better rounded than the CD5i and it just offers so much more in frequency extensions and whole lot less mechanical. ( even compared to the new CDX2 )

CDX/XPS
The seller is offering it with the older PSU. I even liked this player *bare*.
What added power supply units offer is a better handling on the bass notes and it opens up the entire frequency range. ( wider stage and effortlessness )
The music sounds more convicing.
The sonic gain from the CD3.5 and even a bare CDX ( meaning not using an external power supply ) is quite large.
Don't get hang up on the word 'smoother'.
It's relative to the CD5i. It's smoother compared to the CD5i or CD3.5.
But it's still a Naim player. IF the speed, fun and dynamcis are your thing, it kicks arse over any of the familiar CD players mentioned on this board (excluding Krell players

)

At any rate, if you are thinking buying used off the net, I'd suggest get the serial numbers from the seller and check it against the service record at NANA. ( Naim Audio North America)
And check it against how old the unit is: Naim Product History
Naim Serial Numbers

Generally, later the serial numbers, better. As Naim often revises the inside cct. without letting the public know. Also, as a rule of thumb, for digital gear, newer is better because of less wear and glitches on the transport themselves.

AFAIK, Naim still stocks the transports used in aforementioned players, but I would also check with NANA. I was told that they are out of CD3 and older transports.

Also, ask the seller if the players have the PIC upgrade. This is important since PIC chip will able to read the copy protected discs. ( Still all Naim players can't read a CDRW )
Info on the PIC upgrade

Finally, all those older players do not have RCA outs. ( infamous DIN thing ) so you need a DIN/RCA lead if you are using non-Naim preamp. No biggy as number of after market cable producers should be able to fit source end DIN. Just make sure pin configutaion is correct. ( consult NANA )
Manuals

Is it pain in the arse?
You bet ya. But you really ought to do a home-work before you purchase one of the older Naim players off the Net.

This is one of the reason, I prefer to deal with an authorised dealer.

Good luck.

 

[GoRedwings19]

Kuma has good points. As far as Naim stuff goes it's not really a problem for me as I have a Naim dealer a mile away from my house. He is brill as he forgets stuffs so I lend loadsa bits and he forgets about them!!!! Out of the range Kuma suggested then I like the cds2/xps. I feel it has the most exciting sound for rock. Fast, punchy and pace faster than maurice greene

 

[Blitzula]

Kuma, thanks for a very informative and useful post.

Let me ask you a question in addition to all the very valuable information you provided. I'm all about the excitement, drive, authority, and fun in my music reproduction. If a player has those features, I'm set.

If you were to recommend a blow your socks off Naim player in the areas I mentioned, regardless of tonal balance and other audiophile criteria (in other words...based on musicality as I defined it alone), would you pick one of the Naim players/PSU you mentioned, or another Naim combo? Assuming a budget up to $4k. I realize my tastes are different from yours, so I'm asking for your perspective from my point of view, as far as that is possible.

 

[kuma]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blitzula If you were to recommend a blow your socks off Naim player in the areas I mentioned, regardless of tonal balance and other audiophile criteria (in other words...based on musicality as I defined it alone), would you pick one of the Naim players/PSU you mentioned, or another Naim combo? Assuming a budget up to $4k. I realize my tastes are different from yours, so I'm asking for your perspective from my point of view, as far as that is possible.

Sorry, I can't even imagin what other ppl are hearing! ( I stopped the assumption long time ago ! )
I can only offer the reco of what *I* think I can live with.

For my money?
CDX/XPS presents the best value out of the used Naim digital assuming it's in excellent condtion with all upgrades.

New unit + used PSU:
CD5X/used Hi-Cap ( 3k + 700$ or so )

Beyond that,
CDX2/XPS2
CDS3/XPS2

That's it.

 

[PATB]

Just in case it has not been posted in this thread yet (too lazy to go through the pages). http://stereophile.com/digitalsourcereviews/1104naim/.

--Pat

 

[Blitzula]

Thanks Kuma...you too Pat. I've read about all the reviews of the Naim players on the web (including that one), and the Naim forums as well.

I need to find a way to audition, or speak to someone who's listened to these combos. I'd like to post on the Naim forums, but they failed to register me and haven't said why at all. Although...the typical post on the Naim forum is, A isn't as good as B (B is more than A), B isn't as good as C (C is more than B), etc. So maybe I'm not missing some insight.

 

[kuma]

Blitzula,

Which preamp are you using?

And really, there is no good substitute for listneing to 'em yourself.

You can ask 100 other ppl. what they thought of a player, but at the end of the day, you'll be still guessing.

 

[Blitzula]

All I'm using is a headphone/amp combo....overkill?

I agree on the 100 ppl comment, but whenever I hear more refined, smoother, boogies less but I liked it more, less engaging initially, those all scream, "Go for the less refined, more engaging, boogier player" to me.

Like Sennheiser/Grado...conventional wisdom on the strengths/weaknesses has generally proven true to me.

For example, I found this post on the Naim forums that made me think...yeah, the CDX is the way to go versus the CDX2.

"A CDX is about life and energy. Lots of get-up-and-go but lack in innerdetails and finer decays of notes. Inevidably it sounds rough around the edges when you directly compared it to the newer kit. A CDX2 is about finesse. Bit more restrained comparatively with a much better resolution in frequency extremes and microdynamics but lacks in jump factor."

I'm talking to someone about a CDX right now (17X sn, 2001) that was one of the first units to have RCA outputs. Does that sound right, or is this a CDX2? Edit: Bought it for $1,650. It's been "dampened" with cromalin vc strips...no cluse what that means. I'll pick it up this weekend and report back.

If I like it, the XPS/XPS2 used is next.....

 

[kuma]

Quote:

I'm talking to someone about a CDX right now (17X sn, 2001) that was one of the first units to have RCA outputs. Does that sound right, or is this a CDX2? Edit: Bought it for $1,650. It's been "dampened" with cromalin vc strips...no cluse what that means. I'll pick it up this weekend and report back.

Blitzula,

It is a CDX. ( CDX2 hasn't been around for that long ).
An owner could fit a set of RCA at additional cost in those days. ( all new Naim comes with the RCA built in these days )

A word of caution, tho. I prefer using DIN/RCA rather than going RCA/RCA. But, I guess you can try both ways.
I hope the seller is including at least a SNAIC as the original CD player comes with it.

As far as 'dampend' chassis... Newer Naim kit has a better chassis. But they all ring.

A chromalin strip is to dampen the vibration off a transport. It does matter but so long as you place a CDX on a proper rack, I don't think it matters as much. ( they are rather sensitive to what they are sitting on, btw )
Some people put a hocky puck directly above the power supply and swear it makes a difference. ( I certainly could not.

)

And give it at least a day to warm up.

You got lucky if you can pick it up localy. ( you have no idea how some people pack a digital gear for shipping )

Good luck!

 

[Blitzula]

That's good to know...I was going to put it on a wood dresser in my room. I'll have to find some sort of small rack that I can put on the dresser....there isn't room to do anything else in the area I have. I hope that will work ok.

I'll have to check and see if he has the SNAIC (din connector?) and extra puck, as well as the original packaging.

 

[walkman666]

Hey congrat's, blitz! I heard the cdx at the audition this past weekend. It did sound quite good. And you got it for a good price (I was quoted $2350, which is absurd, I know...). Report back on the eval.

kuma: You are the naim man! Unreal knowledge and help.

- walkman666

 

[Blitzula]

Yeah, thanks for all the help Kuma. I'll look into anti-vibration options, maybe there are feet or something I can use.

 

[kuma]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blitzula I'll look into anti-vibration options, maybe there are feet or something I can use.

If you want to use any types of *feet*, please avoid all sorbothane or rubber type feet. They kill timing and pace. literally, they deaden the music.

Once you settle a player in, you might want to post a question at the Naim board as many other CDX users experiment with aftermarket feet.

For a rack, Ikea Lack table is very good.

Now you are in the 'flat-earth' Zone.

mass loaded=bad

 

[Blitzula]

I've never gotten my registration approved to allow me to actually, you know, post at the Naim forums. I've tried twice now. I'll try e-mailing one of the admins.

What do you think the loss in sound quality would be if I put the cd player on my wooden desk?