[AmericanSpirit]

i need faith and devotion to move beyond 535 and UM3X

And not really Grado Headphones, same old pain of bright and non-comfy

Wow!!! I haven’t seen those names for at least 10 years. Your IEM/Cans do bring some nostalgia.

Why not try Tripowin Lea? It cost less than that Comply form ear tips that comes with SE535. A mere $20 and may surprise you.

If you liked laid back Westone tuning, My heartful push is Mangird Tea. Not a Grado-ish tuning.

Also you maybe enlightened by new technology of IEM’s EST(those old STAX cans or Senn’s Orpheus used electrostatic driver ) driver, as well as Planar IEM(technically it existed even from 1980s, First Planar was created by Yamaha, by the name of “Orthodynamic”, and I do own the very first Planar headphone HP-1) as well.

For planar, and laid back tuned (non-harsh treble), Wu Zetain (around 100-150usd depending on the sale) maybe a good musical one you may find enjoyable.

Pulling my memory of Single Knowles BA (like Ety’s ER4) ,First BA+DD hybrid (UE 5EB), and multi BAs(TF10Pro, 535, UMs) , things have changed. But I still remember world’s first BA+DD hybrid, UE5EB sounded utterly terrible!! bloated and muffled bass dominating the whole spectrum, with an edgy V-shape grainy BA timbre clicking around.

Here is what happened for past decade.

The issue with BA was that single BA could only handle so much of frequency dynamism without distortion, the best one was ER4, then Shure/Westone/UE started to increase the number of BA, the crossover design was still limited to 4BA or so. Then UE and other small shop brand (like JH audio) started to craft 8BA+ for Custom-IEM.

Single dynamic driver has evolved as well, Sony used LCP for their high-end IEM, but now that same technology is readily available from $20USD (the recommended Tripowin Lea, and Moondrop’s Aria/Chu also uses LCP). Many attempts to make pure sounding single dynamic, mainly by chaning diaphragm material, to elastic yet solid, some used pure beryllium, which costed $$$, some used latest nano-technology Carbon-nanotube, and some simply coated diaphragm with beryllium, titanium etc. Single dynamic has the physical energy, but the weakpoint of single dynamic is the sound image separation is limited.

The solution so far is bring multi-BA and add dynamic driver to it, mainstrram is 4BA+1DD, such as Moondrop Blessimg2.

However BA+DD isn’t perfect, the last niche of treble extension was missing. It affects presentation of airiness, so the solution was to bring electrostatic driver into an IEM. As the hot electrostatic driver needs a huge amp, Sonion applied passive electret to their EST driver. I have AKG’s passive Electret +dynamic hybrid headphone, K340, and it does sound wonderful.

There is piezoelectric driver which resembles to EST in terms of sound, but it’s a EST 0.8 to my impression, it’s distorted compared to EST.

After the EST for IEM invention, which was a mere couple of years ago, the tribrid, EST+BA+DD, is our current major config for an IEM.
Some new attempt was done by Unique Melody (they were private remold small shop before, and now a big name) improvised that EST+BA+DD and added Bone-conduction driver to it. A quadbrid, BC+EST+BA+DD. Very iimmersive and holographic.

The old Earbuds shop Head-Direct, now is renown as HifiMan, and their headphone is one of the best of all.

A small company named FiiO introduced a cheap plastic headphone amp that only costed $6USD, where a headphone amp costed at least $100, and main stream was $300-500(RSA/iqube). Now that FiiO grew to world’s one of the big3 high-end DAP maker. They do make IEM as well, and you may like it, because FiiO’s take on IEM mainly focuses rich bass and mid.

One last innovation was a finely sound Planar IEM. The planar IEM existed but not fully executed until very recent. Planar IEM, has faster attack/decay than dynamic, and has actual physical energy that BA lacks, so it’s somewhere in between BA and DD.

The new approach is to take Planar as primary source and mix with what ever existing technology(EST/piezo/BA/DD) to come over limited separation capability of Planar.

Rolling a decade back, there wasn’t really any choice besides to go with either Shure/Westone/UE, simply because there wasn’t any fully potent single dynamic IEM until Sennheiser started high-end single DD with IE7/8 series, now they are still running with same IE series, but its just lacking innovation from there.

Sennheiser basically lost the competition and sold off their consumer segment to a third party, now Sennheiser’s business is their Neumann brand and professional audio segment.

AKG also left the market, now Samsung is in charge of AKG brand.

STAX, left the market as well, they were sold to Edifier.

Japanese audio companies like Denon/JVC/Pioneer/Kenwood doesn’t exist anymore.

Etymotics/Westone left the market and sold the business to the new owner as well, thats why you see Westone/ety altogether.

UE is sold off to mouse/keyboard consumer electronics, the Logitech.

So major shift has occured. Western audio company lost competition, and now we only have Sony left as a hardcore players.

I forgot about Bose, but they were not high-end from the beginning. Bose kept B-Grade product for a decade and their specialization strategy worked, a decade later Bose still makes nice B-grade IEMs.

So that’s the end of the what happened for the past decade.

The recommended Wu Zetian, is the fully executed Planar, which may fit your new expectation. That’s the new IEM ground of 2022.

 

[taygomi]

i just saw the kz pr1 hifi. are there any noteworthy alternatives in this pricerange and planar magnetic? otherwise i will go for them

 

[Carpet]

i just saw the kz pr1 hifi. are there any noteworthy alternatives in this pricerange and planar magnetic? otherwise i will go for them

They have a KKZ PR1 Pro out which is half price, using a coupon or code. Follow the store should get one messaged to you on the phone app. They don't show up in other stores on a search yet, but they will!

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005004965009239.html

 

[taygomi]

thank you, but its not available from my location.
whats the difference between them and the original? its half the price more than the normal pr1

 

[baskingshark]

Same experience and view here.

Well, My take on how Shure/Westone kept their popularity for decades as a good Harvard Business School case study of modeling and maintaining a brand value and goodwill intangible.
Despite their merchandise’s inferiority, brand name and legacy, practice /presence on a professional field(studio field), do form a reputation and value-addition.

Senn took same approach IMO, kept their core business value in brand-generating professional field (Neumann), and left consumer market.

Covid killed a few boutique audio companies - RHA, Audiofly, Onkyo, Aiwa for example. Even Sennheiser as you said, had to sell away their consumer wing.

Sad, but it is kind of a survival of the fittest game going on. The audio hobby is considered "discretionary spending". Consumers will know whether something is providing good price-to-performance or not. CHIFI generally are much cheaper than some of these boutique brands and if a company rests on their laurels, and continue selling overpriced gear without innovating, then they may face the music (literally).

 

[Carpet]

thank you, but its not available from my location.
whats the difference between them and the original? its half the price more than the normal pr1

I don't know if anyone has had a chance to try them out yet. They have only been out for two days. Reviewers may have received samples earlier, but we are still waiting for feedback. As usual that will probably arrive after the promotional price finished!

 

[RCracer777]

Japanese audio companies like Denon/JVC/Pioneer/Kenwood doesn’t exist anymore.

Most of these company's are still around and making new products to this day. Sure, their presence in the audio market has diminished over time, except for Denon which at least over here is still going strong. Only pioneer is gone, though Pioneer DJ is still around as that wasn't part of Onkyo.

 

[Barndoor]

Anyone recommend a pair of budget Bluetooth headphones that don't sound horrific and have good range. They are for my wife who really doesn't care too much about how they sound.

The plan is to buy a transmitter from ali (with claimed long range) and connect it to the back of a Sonos zoneplayer. We've had Sonos for well over 10 years, she has her play lists on it and has no desire to learn or try anything else.

 

[r31ya]

Anyone recommend a pair of budget Bluetooth headphones that don't sound horrific and have good range. They are for my wife who really doesn't care too much about how they sound.

The plan is to buy a transmitter from ali (with claimed long range) and connect it to the back of a Sonos zoneplayer. We've had Sonos for well over 10 years, she has her play lists on it and has no desire to learn or try anything else.

Mpows for the cheap or just go for Soundcores

 

[4ceratops]

Anyone recommend a pair of budget Bluetooth headphones that don't sound horrific and have good range. They are for my wife who really doesn't care too much about how they sound.

The plan is to buy a transmitter from ali (with claimed long range) and connect it to the back of a Sonos zoneplayer. We've had Sonos for well over 10 years, she has her play lists on it and has no desire to learn or try anything else.

If you don't care about ANC, I recommend OneOdio PRO-C (link below) based on my own experience. I bought them for my daughter for Christmas, tried them out and was very pleasantly surprised by the sound quality over bluetooth (only SBC and AAC). In bluetooth mode, the battery life is unbeatable (realistically at least 80 hours). The sound quality is surprisingly worse when connected by cable, wearing comfort without reservations. However, with their battery life, the option to connect them by cable is still only a backup solution. The "champagne" color is captured realistically in the photos.

Ali link:
https://m.it.aliexpress.com/item/1005002068507443.html?gatewayAdapt=glo2ita

Review:
https://www.audioreviews.org/oneodio-pro-c-dw/#Final_Remarks

 

[RCracer777]

Anyone recommend a pair of budget Bluetooth headphones that don't sound horrific and have good range. They are for my wife who really doesn't care too much about how they sound.

The plan is to buy a transmitter from ali (with claimed long range) and connect it to the back of a Sonos zoneplayer. We've had Sonos for well over 10 years, she has her play lists on it and has no desire to learn or try anything else.

If TWS are allowed I'd recommend the Huawei Freebuds Pro 2. Amazing sound and good functionality but not exactly the cheapest at €199,-. On a budget I'd say the SoundPeats H1 are a good option with great battery life. Both have good range* and stability.
I don't use wireless headphones atm so I can't really comment on them.

* Bluetooth range is always a discussion point with wireless and it has everything to do with the bluetooth class used. Class 1 has a range of 100m, class 2 is 10m and class 3 only 1m max. As you've probably guessed class 2 is what you'll find in most consumer electronics. There is a tolerance on the max distance dependent on antenna design and environment but the difference will be a few meters at most, so no 15m+ range on a class 2 bluetooth device.

While class 1 might look good at a glance, the 40x power consumption, increased price and antenna which class 1 devices require on both ends turns people off real quick, especially for portable use. Hope you like a TWS with a 4" antenna and 12 minutes of play time max

 

[NymPHONOmaniac]

Yes, Lea / Chu plays better than most of CNT single DD out there. Both got very good tuning, Lea slightly spiced up U-shape but pretty neutral, and Chu with lean and cleaner tone.

The design and material of lea makes it looks not like a $20 IEM, meanwhile the cencibel/rhombus/HBB mele does look “you get what you paid for” kinda cheaply made quality… good example of don’t judge book by its cover haha.

yeah...i regret having give the Lea...cable is decent but i feel they can scale up a bit with better one. Ear tips was of prime importance too...i guess i use KB07 as near always...
Have you try Olina, its great apart mids are a bit dryish to me, yet the SE version seem to solve that...was very cheap on ALi 11/11 sale.
right now im enjoying alot the Simgot EN1000, talking about a construction that feel premium for its price:

 

[Carpet]

Anyone recommend a pair of budget Bluetooth headphones that don't sound horrific and have good range. They are for my wife who really doesn't care too much about how they sound.

The plan is to buy a transmitter from ali (with claimed long range) and connect it to the back of a Sonos zoneplayer. We've had Sonos for well over 10 years, she has her play lists on it and has no desire to learn or try anything else.

Edifier TWS1Pro sounds clean, without the bass boost that seems to dominate so many others. Very good battery life at 12 hours plus 30 in the case and charges fast. Controls aren't programmable but include volume which is very useful. Also pretty inexpensive.

 

[AmericanSpirit]

Covid killed a few boutique audio companies - RHA, Audiofly, Onkyo, Aiwa for example. Even Sennheiser as you said, had to sell away their consumer wing.

Sad, but it is kind of a survival of the fittest game going on. The audio hobby is considered "discretionary spending". Consumers will know whether something is providing good price-to-performance or not. CHIFI generally are much cheaper than some of these boutique brands and if a company rests on their laurels, and continue selling overpriced gear without innovating, then they may face the music (literally).

I didn’t know RHA and audiofly pulled their business…sad sad. I’m regretting throwing Aiwa/Okyo speakers away when I moved, it’s a piece of history now.

As one of poor young man who enjoyed Senn/Shure/Akg/Westone/UE/and AKG product it’s sad that they are reducing/minimizing/or simply quitting the portable audio segment resources. Once they were leading big brands.. and yes right now it’s a red ocean, battle royale going on, and as you say if they rest on the legacy and kept overpriced gear without innovation, sooner than later we will see the consequences.

I’m glad to see AKG/Harman/Samusung is trying to price cut some of their overpriced IEMs and showing the fighting pose.

Like 4BA+1DD N5005, from $1k to $199, and single DD TWS N400 from $150 to $49, the N400 although having old school bluetooth transmission, still sounds amazing for $50, it can trade blows with starfield class CNT DD.

 

[AmericanSpirit]

Most of these company's are still around and making new products to this day. Sure, their presence in the audio market has diminished over time, except for Denon which at least over here is still going strong. Only pioneer is gone, though Pioneer DJ is still around as that wasn't part of Onkyo.

I saw their chapter 11 news, but thanks to refresh the info, it looks like only ONKYO/Pioneer left home audio segment, and rest of companies merged as JVC/Kenwood! It’s my hometown Yokohama Japan they have current headquarter located at. Hope they bring a new breath to the IEM market.

And Sony, amazingly is still the top runner. I worked at Sony before and as far as I know it’s Brand name and actual investment, business modeling, talented engineers, worldwide manufacturing capability and sourcing, marketing and logistics, backed with their group finance ($B of B of cash) is that made it possible to stay in frontline while others simply exhausted over the time.