[solomon]

I don't think we can fairly compare W100 with HD600, because they sound so different and it is all up to personal tastes to say which is better. If I had to describe the main difference, I would say HD600 has more realistic soundstage and a more analytical approach, while W100 excels in vocals, transparency and overall musicality. I would choose W100 100 out of 100 times, because it gives me things that HD600 can never give.
The sound of W100 is unique in my headphone experience. Haven't heard another pair of headphone that sounds remotely similiar.

 

[Spad]

Quote:

Originally posted by ai0tron [B I have several recordings that I would describe as nearly perfect in that they have no flaws which I can discern.[/B]

Perhaps you will be so good as to list these "nearly perfect" recordings so that we deluded (though seemingly universally delighted) AT owners can discover the depths of our naivete for ourselves.

For me, the quality of the ATs is a thoroughly settled issue. After eight days of almost around the clock burn-in they are now everything I hoped for but never truly expected to find in a headphone. Unless I could be guaranteed of immediately finding an exact replacement, I would not sell my W2002s for three times the price I paid for them.

 

[JML]

I hate to tell you this, but a recording is just as much an imperfect technological artifact as the stuff used to create it or which uses it to recreate a facsimile of the original. Any recording, whether of a real live performance or a studio creation, is only one part of all the associated imperfect equipment, such as microphones, cutter lathes, digital converters, cables, amplifiers, speakers, vinyl, polycarbonate, etc.

Further, unless you were present at the scene of a live event, and have perfect auditory recall, you can't tell whether or not what you are listening to via any audio equipment is faithful to what you heard in concert. If you want to have some illusions shattered, just read what John Atkinson of Stereophile, who is an audiophile par excellence, does when he engineers a recording.

"Perfect sound forever" was the original hype used when the CD format was launched. It wasn't, it ain't, and it will never be. So I'm happy to find something that helps the entire chain of technology do something that works pretty well.

I'm a bit mystified by the anti-AT stuff coming from people who haven't heard them. It's almost as if people don't want them to sound good! A bit of jealousy, perhaps? While we who have them almost universally love them, we're not saying that all the other cans are crap. What we're saying is that anyone who is considering buying something ranging in price from about $250 on up to the stratosphere ought to give these a try, because they're competitive with anything on the market, and unique in many ways.

These are not Senns, Grados, AKGs, Beyers, Stax, or Sonys, but they can probably withstand comparison with anything. No two of the cans from those manufacturers are identical, and all have strong points and weaknesses. When money is factored into the equation, these two AT cans are a phenomenal value as well. No special aftermarket cables apparently needed or even made for them, they work great with many sources and don't require megabuck estoteric amps even though they shine with them, and they're beautifully made.

It almost seems as if some folks don't want anyone to like a headphone that they themselves don't have, or just don't like the cans because they inspire the owners to sing their praises.

 

[markl]

"SACD offer improvement, but its so small you can just forget it in my opinion. It has more to do with the quality of the recording process and the quality of the SACD players."

Can you tell the difference between a CD released in the mid-80's and a newly remastered version of that same recording circa now? If you answer "no", you should hand in your headphones immediately.

The difference between an SACD and a newly re-mastered CD is equivalent to the upgrade between a circa '80's CD and a newly remastered version.

This improvement is straight out of the gate. It took CD 20 years to start sounding good. Think where SACD/DVD-A will be in 20 years?

If you want the benefits of high-resolution audio in the future, you must support it now, because once it's gone, we'll never get it back.

markl

 

[M Rael]

Quote:

Originally posted by JML It almost seems as if some folks don't want anyone to like a headphone that they themselves don't have, or just don't like the cans because they inspire the owners to sing their praises.

I agree. Thats why I wonder how Jude chooses what headphones go into the Featured Review section. Right now I dont want to guess, but I KNOW its not based on widespread availability, or price. I'm thinking I want to see an audio-technica model represented there, and if not, then why not?

 

[Mumrik]

M Rael, have you PM'ed or emailed him about it?

 

[JML]

Ross' review -- a first for him -- of the Grado was put up within a few days of his posting. The 2 AT reviews, which have been out for far longer, have not. I wonder why... Could it be the pics? I thought maybe a moderator had asked you for permission to use the stuff on your site, and then add links to the multiple strings.

By the way, M Rael, look at the string I put in the cables forum about adapters. Looks like the AT fan club could put together a collaborative spare parts and accessories order for Vincent Chen, and probably save on shipping.

 

[M Rael]

Quote:

Originally posted by Mumrik M Rael, have you PM'ed or emailed him about it?

Yes, I did that before posting. Its something I think is a good idea for reasons of 'representing' some of the active members here. And not just that, but the audio-technicas are without question very high level headphones.. I dont see a reason not to reward some of the people who were courageous and adventurous enough to seek them out, and post about it. I would have thought they (the moderators) would have seen that for themselves already! But since they havent, I'm asking.

p.s. I dont want one of my reviews posted, of course. If I had to guess I'd say that Tomcat, Spad, or JML's might be the best choice.

 

[ai0tron]

Actually, I like to present a contrary opinion just to get beyond the metaphors and ecstacy although i enjoy that stuff too.

In all truth I haven't seen such unanimous support for a headphone before and it is both intriguing and a put off at the same time. I was considering some beyer 931's but since these w100's are coming up so much it might be them that gets the call next!

Also I am personally wary of the reviews for the at2002's. The drastic changes users report during break in are definately something i feel should be suspect. As do others Im sure.

I definately appreciate the reviews though, and Tomcats was very nicely written. So thanks.

Also regarding SACD. My admittedly brief experience with the SACD 333es was not all that positive. It's redbook was inferior to the Njoe Tjoeb IMO. And the SACD was not anything to get too happy about. I was using R10's and an Earmax pro. Not the best match but certainly not the worst.



Very good redbook recordings:

Al Di meola Friday night in San Francisco is very nice
Aphex twins Druqks is very nice
Eva Cassidys Live at Blues alley is nice
Dave Brubecks Take Five is nice
Dave mathews and Tim Reynolds Live is nice
Vivaldi 4 seasons by a Chamber orchestra I cant remember is good (the cover is green)
Bachs Cello suites played by Janos Starker on CBS records
Bachs Cello suites played by Yo Yo ma on sony classics (first recording)
Schuberts Arpeggione played by Mistislav Rostropovich on decca records

 

[pigmode]

Quote:

Originally posted by ai0tron Actually, I like to present a contrary opinion just to get beyond the metaphors and ecstacy although i enjoy that stuff too.

Smile when you say that! Dang the W100 sounds mighty intriguing--to bad I've sworn off new phones.

 

[M Rael]

Quote:

Originally posted by JML Could it be the pics? I thought maybe a moderator had asked you for permission to use the stuff on your site, and then add links to the multiple strings. By the way, M Rael, look at the string I put in the cables forum about adapters. Looks like the AT fan club could put together a collaborative spare parts and accessories order for Vincent Chen, and probably save on shipping.

I added the picture to Ross's 325 review on my own, without Ross or anyone elses prior knowledge. I just wanted to.

I checked out the thread you mentioned. Tell you what- in a day or two I will have gotten an answer back from Vincent about how the earpads come off, and I will (by the middle of the week) probably have gotten my replacement pads from him as well. I'll have a lot to say about the ease of earpad removal and some nice pictures of the interior construction too. Let me crank out that stuff, and then we'll see what we can do. It might be that I can get us a good price.

 

[kelly]

Skepticism is healthy, especially with ridiculously priced extravangances like this.

I'd like to see a review posted in the reviews section too, but I don't know what the criteria is for being a reviewer. Do you have to be a long standing member of HeadFi? Is it purely subjective Jude favoritism? That's not unreasonable, if it is, but it'd be nice to know what qualifies someone.

I find Tomcat's review to be overly positive. I enjoyed reading it but frankly there's just no such thing as a perfect headphone and if he has no criticisms at all, I'm more than suspicious. I'd prefer to see balanced reviews in the reviews archives--but that's coming from me, a newbie peon.

I also relate to aiotron's suspicion of the breakin period. Here's what I can say to that: All burn in, in my opinion, is vastly overrated--W2002 not excepted. However, there are minor improvements. The HD600 sounded smoother after 30 hours or so while the DT831s didn't seem to benefit much, if at all, from burn in. The W2002 benefits more than the HD600 did and does, indeed, seem to improve over a longer length of time. Whether this is due to the wooden enclosures, unique design or whatever, I don't know but as small a difference as it may make, it's significant enough to warrant letting them play in. *shrug*

 

[pigmode]

Quote:

Originally posted by kelly I'd like to see a review posted in the reviews section too, but I don't know what the criteria is for being a reviewer. Do you have to be a long standing member of HeadFi? Is it purely subjective Jude favoritism?

It's called a perk. It comes with owning the place. Maybe if you sent in a Straightwire mini/mini...

 

[M Rael]

Quote:

Originally posted by JML ..spare parts and accessories order for Vincent Chan.

I heard back from Vincent about the earpads/changing earpads. There is still a mystery about this process (to me), even though Vincent has mentioned it twice in emails. His description of replacing the earpads seems vague, even though his tone is one of 'its no big deal'. What I wanted to do is to remove my earpads and partially disassemble the W2002 to see how they are put together.. but since the process still seems sketchy, I'm not sure I'm going to do that.
My latest understanding is that the earpad covering is what gets replaced (if and when you ever wanted to replace your earpads) the padding itself does not get replaced. The earpad covering is apparently removed by just slowly pulling it off..

in another email Vincent said once the padding is removed, there are a few screws holding the enclosures themselves in place. That part makes sense. What I dont understand is how the earpad covering is supposed to go back on after it has been taken off. On this point Vincent only says it requires 'time and patience'..
It would be nice to know how this all works before we order spares. I'll keep working on it.

 

[Matt]

I have been very skeptical these days about burn-in, too, however, I can personally attest to the fact that the W100s really do change. I think it's like when you really have to use the restroom: it feels so bad at first that when you "return to normal," it feels like bliss itself.

I don't want to say they've "sold" me on burn-in as a phenomenon that occurs in most or even some cans/amps/wires, but for these cans it has convinced me that a physical burn-in does take place.

I have enjoyed these cans way more than HD600s and they have many a wonderful RS-1-like quality to them, while sounding very different. For one, I can second the "ease" bit: they have an uncanny ease of delivery. This was very apparent right from the box and it lends a non-fatiguing quality to these cans.

The bass definitely fills out with burn-in. Less so, the midrange becomes more transparent.

I barely listened to mine while they were/are burning in, so there is scant chance that the phenomena would be from exposure and mental adjustment (though that "more transparent midrange" thing might be...again, am skeptical of certain things).

The burn-in differences have been perceptually more than I experienced with any of my Grados, the HD600s or Etys, that's fer shure.

- Matt