[Audio Bling]

 
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[..} My suggestion if you don't need 24/96 would be an ART Legato. That should crush any sound card you can name.

 And you believe this because..?

 

[DaveBSC]

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And you believe this because..?

 
It's got a much higher quality fixed frequency clock than anything you'll find in a consumer grade sound card, or any M-Audio, RME, or Lynx card. Internal sound cards get their power from the noisy computer PSU, and have to deal with boatloads of electronic noise inside a PC. The Legato has none of that. It has full galvanic isolation, so there's no common ground. It has its own internal power supply, so there's no reliance on noisy USB power. The Legato even goes a step further, and comes with a custom USB cable that has no power connection. Only the audio signal is actually transmitted, so it's completely isolated from noise from the computer's power, and there's no need for an expensive audiophile grade USB cable.
 
The drawback of the design is that it only handles 16/44, but I think to noticeably outperform it at that frequency, you'd need to spend $2000.

 

[haloxt]

Sokolov, why be so vocal about audio-gd products? Not trying to be rude, but the last time I saw someone keep praising audio-gd he was banned, and I wouldn't want that to happen to you.
 
Having kept up with audio-gd discussions since the beginning, I have noticed several people who said higher tier neutral audio-gd weren't their cup of tea, and I completely understand where they are coming from. I have heard multiple times that Kingwa tried to deter some people from his higher tier neutral gear when they asked to buy, but I believe he must be too busy nowadays to probe buyers about what they really want. He even offers combo discounts, saying he is worried people might pair gear badly. I'll let you decide how much of that is because of that concern or because it is good for sales.
 
Imo, purist audio reproduction is an acquired taste, at least after a lifetime of listening to colored and pleasantly simple music reproduction. Just ask yourself how often do you listen for how close an instrument in reproduced music matches your memory of real life instruments and all their tiny nuances. And ask yourself how often you listen for euphony instead. Although I think higher tier acss is truer to recording, I don't think it's everybody's goal in this hobby.

 

[sokolov91]

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Sokolov, why be so vocal about audio-gd products? Not trying to be rude, but the last time I saw someone keep praising audio-gd he was banned, and I wouldn't want that to happen to you.
 
Having kept up with audio-gd discussions since the beginning, I have noticed several people who said higher tier neutral audio-gd weren't their cup of tea, and I completely understand where they are coming from. I have heard multiple times that Kingwa tried to deter some people from his higher tier neutral gear when they asked to buy, but I believe he must be too busy nowadays to probe buyers about what they really want. He even offers combo discounts, saying he is worried people might pair gear badly. I'll let you decide how much of that is because of that concern or because it is good for sales.
 
Imo, purist audio reproduction is an acquired taste, at least after a lifetime of listening to colored and pleasantly simple music reproduction. Just ask yourself how often do you listen for how close an instrument in reproduced music matches your memory of real life instruments and all their tiny nuances. And ask yourself how often you listen for euphony instead. Although I think higher tier acss is truer to recording, I don't think it's everybody's goal in this hobby.

Well I was just discussing why I made my choice because someone asked. If he hand't mentioned I wouldn't have said anything... but thanks for the heads up.
 
My phoenix is just in the door, but my Ref-7 is still nowhere to be found hopefully tonight or the coming days. 
 
You are very right though that perceived neutrality and technical neutrality (not saying I am fully qualified to define technical) are very different animals. What people want to hear, and what is actually there are two different things.
 
I haven't even heard any of this gear I keep talking about lmao, so I can't wait. My phoenix is opened up and warming up, literally, because it was too damned cold to plug in and play when it arrived. I figured letting it slowly warm up, instead of shoving some current through it will guarantee it works.
 
 
And as far as my comments about kingwa, they were just speculative at best. So far I have had nothing but help and kindness from the man and can't fault him in any way. I was simply saying that for many audio designers, stating they believe/can hear differences in cables and all this speaks to the hearts of audiophiles, whether or not it is actually the case. Think about it. If you believe in cables, and you have someone trying to sell you top level stuff but doesn't care for the cables, vs someone who doesn't actually know much -but covers their basses with fancy caps and crazy wiring... which one would you pick? Frighteningly enough, a lot of people go for the voodoo stuff.
 
Anyways, again my posts so far are merely discussion, speculation, and reasoning. I clearly said I haven't heard the gear with my own ears .... which I am dying too!!
 

 

 

[SP Wild]

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Well I was just discussing why I made my choice because someone asked. If he hand't mentioned I wouldn't have said anything... but thanks for the heads up.
 
My phoenix is just in the door, but my Ref-7 is still nowhere to be found hopefully tonight or the coming days. 
 
You are very right though that perceived neutrality and technical neutrality (not saying I am fully qualified to define technical) are very different animals. What people want to hear, and what is actually there are two different things.
 
I haven't even heard any of this gear I keep talking about lmao, so I can't wait. My phoenix is opened up and warming up, literally, because it was too damned cold to plug in and play when it arrived. I figured letting it slowly warm up, instead of shoving some current through it will guarantee it works.
 
 
And as far as my comments about kingwa, they were just speculative at best. So far I have had nothing but help and kindness from the man and can't fault him in any way. I was simply saying that for many audio designers, stating they believe/can hear differences in cables and all this speaks to the hearts of audiophiles, whether or not it is actually the case. Think about it. If you believe in cables, and you have someone trying to sell you top level stuff but doesn't care for the cables, vs someone who doesn't actually know much -but covers their basses with fancy caps and crazy wiring... which one would you pick? Frighteningly enough, a lot of people go for the voodoo stuff.
 
Anyways, again my posts so far are merely discussion, speculation, and reasoning. I clearly said I haven't heard the gear with my own ears .... which I am dying too!!
 

 

If I didn't hate you then...I certainly hate you know. 

 
Just out of curiosity, have you ever assessed the impact of cabling and jitter with the LCD2 as the magnifying glass?  Perhaps your conclusion was made when using lesser cans, sources and amps - and now that you have arguably "the best" chain, perhaps its time to carry out further evaluation to see if perhaps your opinion might change?
 

 

[sokolov91]

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If I didn't hate you then...I certainly hate you know. 

 
Just out of curiosity, have you ever assessed the impact of cabling and jitter with the LCD2 as the magnifying glass?  Perhaps your conclusion was made when using lesser cans, sources and amps - and now that you have arguably "the best" chain, perhaps its time to carry out further evaluation to see if perhaps your opinion might change?
 

hahaha well to be fair you didn't order a Phoenix!! So you have nothing to be mad about... until my Ref - 7 gets here that is >:  )
 
 
Could very well be lesser cans weren't up to the task of revealing such things - I am open to anything.  A skeptic is just someone who wants real proof before they believe something .

 

[ccschua]

i wonder if anyone has posted their dsp 1 v5 review ? how you find it in the ref 7 ?

 

[Dynobot]

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i wonder if anyone has posted their dsp 1 v5 review ? how you find it in the ref 7 ?

I'm waiting for v6.
 
No reason to think there won't be one...

 

[les_garten]

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/img/forum/go_quote.gif





I'm waiting for v6.
 
No reason to think there won't be one...

 
 
 

How about DSP FV?
 
KW does Final Versions!

 

[IPodPJ]

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i wonder if anyone has posted their dsp 1 v5 review ? how you find it in the ref 7 ?

I did, when I got it awhile back.  It's in this thread.

 

[Dynobot]

Hmmm, maybe just wait until DSP FV.
 
Any bets on what version that will be? 
 
 
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How about DSP FV?
 
KW does Final Versions!

 

[IPodPJ]

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I'm waiting for v6.
 
No reason to think there won't be one...

That would be a bad choice.  Firstly, v5 changes things drastically.  Second, supposedly he's discontinuing the R2R DACs which means no more DSP modules.  There's no profit in upgrading what you no longer sell, unless the unit is defective which clearly it is not.

 

[Dynobot]

Ahhhhh, you have a point there.
 
Surely future development of R2R dacs and accessories has ended.
 
 
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That would be a bad choice.  Firstly, v5 changes things drastically.  Second, supposedly he's discontinuing the R2R DACs which means no more DSP modules.  There's no profit in upgrading what you no longer sell, unless the unit is defective which clearly it is not.

 

[vrln]

Actually I have some information about that... My reasoning was also that it´ll be the last one. But when I asked Kingwa, he basically told me: as a businessman, he doesn´t want to pay for another version, but as an audiophile he is tempted to because even if he can´t make money off DSP-1 anymore, he is interested in finding the optimal sound. The DSP-1 V4 was already marketed as the final version when it came out, so actually he didn´t really financially benefit from DSP-1 V5 either. So what I got was a "maybe, maybe not". In other words I wouldn´t rule out a potential V6 someday, but yeah it´s quite unlikely of course.
 
EDIT:
 
As for the glue some guys are worried about (on DSP-1 V5 jumpers). This is normal, it is not a conducting material so it doesn´t really do anything except keep the jumper in place. Asked Kingwa about this when I got my new DSP-1...

 

[Dynobot]

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Originally Posted by vrln /img/forum/go_quote.gif
.....but as an audiophile he is tempted to because even if he can´t make money off DSP-1 anymore, he is interested in finding the optimal sound.

Sounds like Versions 6, 7, 8 are  likely.  The drive for an audiophile to find optimal sound is very strong.  Of course in the back of our minds we know we can never get it [perfect sound] but we try anyways, even if it is obtained for a moment....as it was with v4, v3, v2 and v1.  Perception can always be tweaked, I myself have been perceiving an improvement in sound for years.  I wonder if I am just going in circles.  Oh well its fun!