[Ken G]

If you’re coming from an LCD-4 it probably sounds like a huge peak

 

[mikecheck95]

If you’re coming from an LCD-4 it probably sounds like a huge peak

Absolutely, everything is relative and if we become used to one thing it can be hard to go to something else. But ear-gain is necessary for clarity. Does the LCD-5 have too much? Maybe a little. It’d be interesting to see the new research Sean Olive is doing with the B&K 5128 to see how far off these headphones really are from their new preference target. I’d really be surprised if the 3k peak is more than 2db higher than it “needs to be”. Not that 2db too high can’t benefit from EQ. But is it something to nitpick about when their TOTL headphone used to be like 8db below target in that region? Not in my opinion.

Almost every non-audiophile I’ve put these headphones on has remarked on their transparency in some way. Without knowing anything about headphones or their cost.

 

[IanB52]

Anyone else want to share their “outrageous 3k peak”

I see at +10db rise from 1khz to 4khz, which is huge. Previous Audeze headphones went down a couple db in this range.

 

[IanB52]

Absolutely, everything is relative and if we become used to one thing it can be hard to go to something else. But ear-gain is necessary for clarity. Does the LCD-5 have too much? Maybe a little. It’d be interesting to see the new research Sean Olive is doing with the B&K 5128 to see how far off these headphones really are from their new preference target. I’d really be surprised if the 3k peak is more than 2db higher than it “needs to be”. Not that 2db too high can’t benefit from EQ. But is it something to nitpick about when their TOTL headphone used to be like 8db below target in that region? Not in my opinion.

Almost every non-audiophile I’ve put these headphones on has remarked on their transparency in some way. Without knowing anything about headphones or their cost.

I just don't see how anyone can call them transparent when one frequency band is so exaggerated above everything else. Listening to drums its like the snare is a foot away but the kick drum is at the back wall. Every mix is dominated by vocals or guitar bite and everything else is pushed to the back. I could not use the LCD-5 professionally without EQ correction.

I would cut that peak by 5db at least. I think Jude recommended around 3db, which would closer to the actually listenable Meze Elite.

Audeze's target is "Whatever frequency response makes for fast drivers and then you will use EQ or deal with it."

This is the last I will say. These were the only infuriatingly poorly tuned headphones I have ever owned and totally dashed my expectations coming from an older LCD-XC. At least Abyss does a weird tuning that sounds enjoyable.

Whoever is rethinking these ideal target frequencies is smoking crack. They are literally thinking "Hey, you know that obnoxious 3-4khz that we usually cut for good reason? Why don't we instead push it as far as we possibly can and rely on our customers to buy it anyway?"

 

[mikecheck95]

I just don't see how anyone can call them transparent when one frequency band is so exaggerated above everything else. Listening to drums its like the snare is a foot away but the kick drum is at the back wall. Every mix is dominated by vocals or guitar bite and everything else is pushed to the back. I could not use the LCD-5 professionally without EQ correction.

I would cut that peak by 5db at least. I think Jude recommended around 3db, which would closer to the actually listenable Meze Elite.

Audeze's target is "Whatever frequency response makes for fast drivers and then you will use EQ or deal with it."

This is the last I will say. These were the only infuriatingly poorly tuned headphones I have ever owned and totally dashed my expectations coming from an older LCD-XC. At least Abyss does a weird tuning that sounds enjoyable.

Whoever is rethinking these ideal target frequencies is smoking crack. They are literally thinking "Hey, you know that obnoxious 3-4khz that we usually cut for good reason? Why don't we instead push it as far as we possibly can and rely on our customers to buy it anyway?"

I appreciate your position on this but it hasn’t been in line with my experience. You mentioned that you “could not use the lcd-5 professionally” do you work in the music production industry? Or were you speaking hypothetically

 

[IanB52]

I appreciate your position on this but it hasn’t been in line with my experience. You mentioned that you “could not use the lcd-5 professionally” do you work in the music production industry? Or were you speaking hypothetically

I used to be employed in the music/recording industry, but now is more of a hobby with some isolated professional projects here and there.

I did a lot of mixing on headphones, which is quite fraught. We used mostly DT-770s and DT-1770s which were the industry standard, but I eventually switched to the LCD-XC. I did complain about the mids being a *little* scooped, but be careful what you wish for.

 

[mikecheck95]

I used to be employed in the music/recording industry, but now is more of a hobby with some isolated professional projects here and there.

I did a lot of mixing on headphones, which is quite fraught. We used mostly DT-770s and DT-1770s which were the industry standard, but I eventually switched to the LCD-XC. I did complain about the mids being a *little* scooped, but be careful what you wish for.

Interesting! Well you’re definitely not the only one with this experience. As I said that’s kind if all I’ve been reading/hearing lately regarding lcd-5!

 

[TheFrator]

which would closer to the actually listenable Meze Elite.

As always, your ears and your wallet. But to my ear, the Elite's lacked imaging and resolution compared to the 5 when I demoed them side by side at a local store. For comfort and laid back stock tonal balance, Elite is it though.

 

[IanB52]

As always, your ears and your wallet. But to my ear, the Elite's lacked imaging and resolution compared to the 5 when I demoed them side by side at a local store. For comfort and laid back stock tonal balance, Elite is it though.

True enough. Though the Mezes do improve a lot when you get away from their stock cable. LCD-5 actually has an extremely good stock cable.

 

[Ragnar-BY]

I just don't see how anyone can call them transparent

Well… because they sound transparent. At least to me and other owners. I never really look at headphone measurements. I don’t see any benefit in this, because if I like the headphones, then what will change after viewing the frequency response graph? Nothing, because I'm not participating in some kind of measurement championship, I'm just buying myself headphones to listen to music.

Can’t say that LCD5 are perfect. I don’t like how this headphones play Symphonic music and never use mine for classical. But to call it “unlistenable” or “not transparent” would be a completely unfair exaggeration.

 

[IanB52]

Well… because they sound transparent. At least to me and other owners. I never really look at headphone measurements. I don’t see any benefit in this, because if I like the headphones, then what will change after viewing the frequency response graph? Nothing, because I'm not participating in some kind of measurement championship, I'm just buying myself headphones to listen to music.

Can’t say that LCD5 are perfect. I don’t like how this headphones play Symphonic music and never use mine for classical. But to call it “unlistenable” or “not transparent” would be a completely unfair exaggeration.

I don't relate to your experience here. I know for a fact that in a professional recording studio nobody mixes towards a frequency response like the LCD-5. Vocal edges, and midrange instrument bite and twang being shoved in your face, and bass and kick drum sitting way in the back is not what any mix or mastering engineer intends. If the music itself is no longer balanced, if the instrument balance actually changes to the detriment of the music, something is not right.

You can listen to some near field or midfield ATC, PMC, Genelec, Neumann etc professional monitors. Then throw on the LCD-5 and it will sound totally cranked between 3-4khz and out of balance.

I can appreciate that some people might want to hear 3-4k above anything else in the mix. You know, like if you listen to unaccompanied banjo, etc. But the actual target for complex mixes is to have instruments sounding generally balanced from top to bottom and LCD-5 throws that out of whack.

I've spoken my peace.

 

[nwavesailor]

This is now, and has been for some time, a tedious LCD-5 EQ thread.

I am able to enjoy the 5 with or w/o EQ. When I do add a bit of bass it is with the Loki Max and I'm a happy guy!

 

[jlbrach]

measurements, charts and EQ = boring

 

[Ragnar-BY]

in a professional recording studio nobody mixes towards a frequency response like the LCD-5

This is not a very good argument for our hobby. The vast majority of music is now released in such a way that it can sound good through bluetooth speakers, cheap headphones and car radio. With this approach, headfiers need not buy anything better than AirPods

You can listen to some near field or midfield ATC, PMC, Genelec, Neumann etc professional monitors. Then throw on the LCD-5 and it will sound totally cranked between 3-4khz and out of balance.

What for? Do you seriously think that Audeze designer never heard the sound of a studio monitor?

Studio monitors for work, audiophile headphones for pleasure. No wonder they sound different. For professional use Audeze now has a specially designed MM series.

 

[mikecheck95]

This is not a very good argument for our hobby. The vast majority of music is now released in such a way that it can sound good through bluetooth speakers, cheap headphones and car radio. With this approach, headfiers need not buy anything better than AirPods


What for? Do you seriously think that Audeze designer never heard the sound of a studio monitor?

Studio monitors for work, audiophile headphones for pleasure. No wonder they sound different. For professional use Audeze now has a specially designed MM series.

The really funny thing is everyone here is saying they don’t care about measurements but, they still measure quite well. In theory, they are close to harman neutral with no bass shelf and a slightly darker treble. And, to my ears, they just sound normal. I’ve been around instruments all my life and, to my ears, they reproduce the natural timbre of instruments quite well. To me, classical guitar, chamber music, anything with percussion all sound fantastic on the LCD-5. I’ve noticed on some metal music with a lot of electric guitar chording where the midrange can get pretty saturated that presence in the upper mids can become a little fatiguing after a while, so, this is why we have EQ. But, even then, I’m only taking that peak down about 2db. Different strokes for different folks though. You like “flat” mids Audeze still makes LCD 4z, 3, and 2.

MM 500 and LCD-5 are so similar in their measurements that it had me worried when I first saw the graphs that Audeze had just repackaged the same driver in a heavier chasis and dropped the price. (Now know this isn’t the case)
Manny Maroquin has put his name on these headphones. Hardly do I think someone would do that if they actually found the FR to be completely inaccurate. Bob Katz created an EQ profile for the LCD-5 and his adjustments are very minor (he did not flatten the 3k region to match that of the LCD-4 for instance).