[Sajid Amit]

for the record I like the 5 as is...it is a different sounding HP than the TC and susvara and sol p but thats good not bad....the idea of trying to adapt all HP's to a certain curve or sound might work for everyone else but not me...I too had the 4 and used the roon audeze setting and it was fine but nothing that made me stand up and notice....it was at best a marginal difference I am not sure if it was better or worse...when I want a bass heavy presentation...when I want something more laid back I listen to the susvara...when I want a spacious open and incredibly detailed listen I turn to the sr1a...I am lucky enough to own several TOTL HP's that all have different characteristics and strengths and weaknesses and I like it that way...more power to everyone else

That actually makes sense.

I suppose EQ-ing is an itch, and when you scratch it, it's fun, and if you see improvement (relative), all the more reason to keep scratching it.

I didn't care much about EQ for any other headphone. Like I wouldn't dream of EQ-ing an SR009S, lol. I just find it pristine and perfect with its imperfections.

All that said, the 5 for me did improve with EQ. But I respect those that do not care to EQ.

 

[EMINENT]

The LCD-5 equalizes better than any headphone I have ever tried. After trying many of the recommended equalizing options recommended here- I find that all of them to one degree or another make the sound closer to that of the TC. In fact- my favorite options are the one that get it closest to the TC sound.

My question to myself- is what do I gain by getting a 90% duplicate sound to my TC after EQ on the 5? I still prefer the TC, although the 5 with EQ is a close contender and does have the advantage of unlimited volume with zero distortion. I'm not sue this is enough of a reason to keep it.

I am still on the fence for a second headphone to go with my TC. Susvara is to soft; I tried it twice and it will not work for my tastes. LCD-5 is much better in this regard- but still not better than the TC overall. I am certinly not getting a new amp. for the SR1a or CRBN. I am getting closer and closer to accepting that the TC is the holy grail for me. I guess- this is not so bad.

I have quit trying to better the TC. It is to my taste- the best- period. I am just considering a second headphone that is very different- even though it will not be technically equal. Maybe a closed headphone? Maybe a dynamic headphone? Maybe- nothing. Can you imagine that?

I am at a loss as to why somebody who loves and already owns a TC would want to spend a lot of money for a different HP and then try to adjust its tuning to be that of the TC....I however dont get this whole obsession with trying to make HP's into different tunings with EQ...I am not criticizing anyone who does it...I just dont get it

Interesting. This is the first time I have read that the 5 sounds anything like the TC when eq'd. Definitely a good point if they sound so similar and you clearly like one over the other. I don't see why anyone would need another headphone if they have found the one that is so agreeable to them, unless they want a different one for every genre for fun.

I 100% agree. I have a lot of headphones because I like the different flavors they give. I even have the R10P, which “experts” say measures “strangely.” I like that it measures that way. I don’t want all my headphones to sound the same. That said, I do use a convolution filter for my SR1as that ups the bass, without affecting the rest of the FR. So, I can see EQing being helpful in this case. The SR1as don’t need the convolution filter though.

I don’t have the LCD-5s, but it seems that you have to EQ them for them to sound good. Again, I’ve never tried them, but if you have to EQ a pair of headphones to make them sound good, what does that say about the headphones?

I think preferences differ with different perspectives. I definitely envy you all that get to hear all sorts of gear. I have a fraction of the gear you have and can only have one. You can use whatever you want because you want. In my situation, I have to go with the best of my means and if using eq makes something sound similar or better than something else with or without, what does that say about the other headphones out there? If I had all your gear and still eq'd all of them, what would that say too? Maybe that no headphone is perfect for every genre and person?

Yeah true. I have the LCD-4 and the CRBNs. I’ve tried the EQ setting in Roon for the 4, and it sounds alright. I think they sound good without EQ too. I tried EQing the CRBNs, but it was a fail. Either it doesn’t increase the bass noticeably or it creates bad distortion

I can see this. I think the 5 sounds great stock at low volumes. When I want throbbing bass though, the mid forwardness rears it's head. This is where eq'ing helps me. If it were distorted, yeah, I wouldn't do it. But, if it sounded good or even possibly better, what is technically/audibly wrong about it? I don't believe anyone can really be true to source as no one will ever have the same speakers, amps, cables or whatever the original mix had when made.

 

[ptr516]

I would also like to add that I don't think EQ is a free lunch. I listen to a wide range of music, and the main reason I adjust the tonality on the LCD-5 is to work better at higher volumes with my harsher music that has a tendency to have a lot of upper mid energy, e.g. metalcore. However, I find changing the tonality from the stock tuning makes them lose a bit of the magic from vocal-centric tracks that they are excellent with by default.

 

[EMINENT]

So, I think I have a good bit of burn in on the iCan Sig to give a first impression after 125 hrs.

Let me first start off with why. I have always been curious about the power thing and how much it affects things. With my limited experience, I have found these do scale but not the same way. Firstly, the LCD5's do scale from an M15 to desktop quite a bit when eq'd, but not so much without. Definitely more bite and authority with the desktop setup. The WA7 (3rd gen.) was up to the task stock, but I was maxed out with eq. Just not enough overhead but it worked. The Mini/X26 Pro was much more powerful. More bass, more headroom, more punch, more loud.

The iCan Sig intrigued me moreso with it's remote volume because I have read mixed feelings about decreasing digital volume on the dac, and wanted an amp with remote volume. Plus, the greater power. I wanted to see if the Mini could be improved upon.

Well, not really. I haven't found anything standout about the iCan Sig sound wise that is better than the Mini. Either stock or eq'd. The reports about the tube/tube+ stage are true in that it isn't much of a difference between tube/solid state and even less between tube/tube+. I can hear slightly less treble or what seems like a more laid back presentation or softer. I think some reviews said this is less transparent or less resolving but just a hair. Leading edge of tones is stronger in ss mode.

Xbass, 10hz is literally not even worth it. 20hz is nearly identical to the amount of bass in Resolve's eq when I removed the two bass bands and enabled it. 40hz is too much even for me. I leave this off for now and just go with the .5db increase instead as I don't like where the shelf begins as shown on the original iCan measurements on ASR even though they sound about the same.

3D, is interesting but not using it as the 30 and 60 options are different presentations in stage airiness, not really bigger, 90 is noticeably more airy but ultimately liked it off.

 

[joseph69]

(I own an early rev, a 2020 version, and a friend brought his late pre-2020 version).

Can you please elaborate on the difference between the pre-2020 Utopia and the 2020 version, as well as their differences and when Focal announce this revision?
Thanks

 

[sirumcz]

Hey Sajit I've actually compared my LCD5 with 3 different pairs of Utopia (I own an early rev, a 2020 version, and a friend brought his late pre-2020 version).

What is shocking is that there is just as much if not more variance in my earliest rev Utopia and 2020, as there is between it and LCD5.

Ultimately I rank in terms of natural reproduction as follows Old Utopia > LCD5 Non-EQ'd> 2020 Utopia = Friend's Utopia > LCD5 Resolve's older EQ

If re-ranking in terms of dynamics it changes quite a bit: 2020 Utopia = Friend's Utopia > Old Utopia > LCD5 Resolve's older EQ > LCD5

LCD5 and Utopia are very very similar headphones, which is surprising given the different driver techs - we're talking the 2 respective closest to baseline neutral available to market, yet both have a very slight coloration.

LCD5 is ruler flat with a slightly rolled off/ darker treble. The LCD5 without EQ is very fast, e-stat like really, and can come across as both warm yet dry and ever slightly lean.

Utopia is a just a smidge more generous in its midbass, then a bit of a lower treble rise. This gives it a neutral tuning with a bit more sharpness and the midbass hump is more a trait of the dynamic driver's response. The Utopia is both richer and sharper in its presentation, and has better timbre overall.

If one prefers the LCD5; they would find the Utopia to sound narrow in its left to right stage, reaching less deep in its sub bass and a bit metallic in the treble, maybe even bright.

Utopia has better resolution; LCD5 is more detailed.

LCD5 prefers SS amps; Utopia meshes nicely on tube, and very warm SS.

If one prefers the Utopia; they would find the LCD5 to lack depth image/stage, crossfeed focus, a bass response which is a bit too fast in decay, upper mids a bit more shouty and a large lack of airiness.

Both headphones are a must with copper ideally, but LCD5 with EQ benefits from silver cables to help with the softer treble. Stock LCD5 with Silver becomes to brittle sounding.

I can confirm that lcd-5 stock cable lacks depth, when I swap my Kimber Axios CU it sounds holographical and has gained more bass. I do find the stock cable sounds brighter and has wider soundstage, however, axios cu is more musical. I listen to lcd-5 without any EQ, I feel my cables are doing some tunings for me already.

 

[MatW]

I use EQ with the LCD XC and the LCD 4, and I love how they sound with that. I could not EQ the LCD 5 in a way that made me like them. They are much too forward for my taste. I found the vocals weird sounding, and did not like the bass. I let them go within a day. (They were used, so already burned in.)

It's a shame. They are very detailed. With the new headband they are still quite clampy for me, but it's OK. Very light. Just not my taste soundwise. I kind of knew that from the FR, but I wanted to give them a try, and I expected to be able to EQ them. The only TOTL left for me to try is the Solitaire P. Looking at the FR it's almost the opposite of the LCD 5 in the upper mids, so let's see.

EDIT: unwatching this thread now.

 

[hawk13]

I use EQ with the LCD XC and the LCD 4, and I love how they sound with that. I could not EQ the LCD 5 in a way that made me like them. They are much too forward for my taste. I found the vocals weird sounding, and did not like the bass. I let them go within a day. (They were used, so already burned in.)

It's a shame. They are very detailed. With the new headband they are still quite clampy for me, but it's OK. Very light. Just not my taste soundwise. I kind of knew that from the FR, but I wanted to give them a try, and I expected to be able to EQ them. The only TOTL left for me to try is the Solitaire P. Looking at the FR it's almost the opposite of the LCD 5 in the upper mids, so let's see.

Scary similar to my experience, impressions, actions, and gear situation. Scary.

 

[ufospls2]

Can you please elaborate on the difference between the pre-2020 Utopia and the 2020 version, as well as their differences and when Focal announce this revision?
Thanks

As far as I know, the 2020 revision supposedly has no changes sonically (at least officially) and came with a case, and different cables. Accessory changes, nothing changed on the headphone.

 

[chargedcapacitor]

I would also like to add that I don't think EQ is a free lunch. I listen to a wide range of music, and the main reason I adjust the tonality on the LCD-5 is to work better at higher volumes with my harsher music that has a tendency to have a lot of upper mid energy, e.g. metalcore. However, I find changing the tonality from the stock tuning makes them lose a bit of the magic from vocal-centric tracks that they are excellent with by default.

That's the thing, if EQ is done properly on a headphone with low distortion and an even FR (no big dips or jaggedness like the 1266 or early LCD-X), it is a free lunch. Now using resonators to shape the FR, that's when you get into the "no free lunch" physics wise. All that being said, using EQ past 3-5khz becomes a crap shoot because that's where everyone's hearing really begins to diverge.

 

[Tanalasta]

I can confirm that lcd-5 stock cable lacks depth, when I swap my Kimber Axios CU it sounds holographical and has gained more bass. I do find the stock cable sounds brighter and has wider soundstage, however, axios cu is more musical. I listen to lcd-5 without any EQ, I feel my cables are doing some tunings for me already.

It's not a 'bad' cable. But for those of us used to sonically better ; it can definitely be improved upon.

I'm wondering how a Danacable will go with the LCD-5 but just cannot justify the cost at the moment.

 

[joseph69]

As far as I know, the 2020 revision supposedly has no changes sonically (at least officially) and came with a case, and different cables. Accessory changes, nothing changed on the headphone.

Exactly.
There was never a 'revision" of the Utopia, at all. The only difference was the content included in the later packaging. People seem to be misleading others into thinking that the Utopia was revised in 2020 and sound different from the pre-2020 models. Not true at all.

 

[Slim1970]

Exactly.
There was never a 'revision" of the Utopia, at all. The only difference was the content included in the later packaging. People seem to be misleading others into thinking that the Utopia was revised in 2020 and sound different from the pre-2020 models. Not true at all.

This how I understood it as well. Focal threw in a carrying case and different cables that's it. Nothing was done to the headphones themselves.

 

[joseph69]

This how I understood it as well. Focal threw in a carrying case and different cables that's it. Nothing was done to the headphones themselves.

Yes, and if something was revised on the Utopia headphone I'm absolutely sure it would've been announced by Focal and would've been very big news.

 

[VandyMan]

Yeah true. I have the LCD-4 and the CRBNs. I’ve tried the EQ setting in Roon for the 4, and it sounds alright. I think they sound good without EQ too. I tried EQing the CRBNs, but it was a fail. Either it doesn’t increase the bass noticeably or it creates bad distortion

How did you EQ your CRBN? I added a bass shelf using Roon and get no distortion at all. Do you listen very loud?