[sp33ls]

I will say that frequency response plays a role in how people pickup on detail.

Take the HD800S for example. It's a pretty detailed headphone, but a good bit of that is from the treble peaks. The LCD-5 having more laid back treble presentation could give off the impression that it's not as detailed.

But, I've noticed the details are all there... Very much so indeed. In fact, I find that they're too detailed at times lol. Sure, maybe some other stupid expensive cans can provide even higher levels of details but... why? I find the LCD-5 to have a certain cohesion to it which makes it so appealing. It's like an exciting version of a reference hifi system.

Speaking of which, I'd rather take a high-end, well-designed loudspeaker system over any pair of headphones. Sure, the details are fun at first, but speakers still make you feel the music in a way headphones can't. Pressurizing a room is just a different (and superior, IMO) experience. Of course, the compromise is the size, portability, and isolation which headphones offer.

Idk, I just feel like people in the headphones hobby get too wound up over this gear vs that. Find what suits you best and enjoy them. There's always going to be "better" systems out there. But at what cost? And does it move you the way you want it to move you?

Sometimes I enjoy my "lesser" cans as I'm not focused on all the technicalities -- just enjoying the music.

 

[chargedcapacitor]

We can agree to disagree, which is totally cool. And the LCD-R and LCD-5 are closer in tonality and sound than anything else (only tonality wise, bass is an absolute landslide for the LCD-5). It's a toss up, take your pick. Neither are transparent. (but the LCD-R's mids are amazing, and the LCD-5 right behind that. I'm not saying transparency is an end all be all). The difference is much clearer in regards to more transparent headphones.. i.e. not the LCD-R or 007.. but certainly with the TC/Sr1a/009.

And on the second point I just absolutely disagree. Once you introduce EQ, and drastically to the point of literally not liking the headphones out of the box to EQing to actually liking them, no comparisons should be made. Again, you can do this with any headphones. But that is just my opinion.



I think this is totally fair and reasonable. If EQ was my thing I probably wouldn't listen to me either. Again, I have no problem with people doing so. But people can't act as if impressions without EQ are totally irrelevant when no other TOTL headphones absolutely require EQ and when no one is EQing to the level that the LCD-5 are doing. Again, if EVERYONE thinks EQ is necessary, it says a LOT. Likewise, if you EQ, your opinion is less relevant to my assessment, although still relevant to others.

I respect your opinion. For me, no matter how much EQ I used on the susvara, I could never get the bass to match the texture of the LCD-4. As much of a fan I was of the sus, I just couldn't shake that soft bass, even on a speaker amp. So both headphones EQ'd, I chose the LCD-5.

 

[number1sixerfan]

I will say that frequency response plays a role in how people pickup on detail.

Take the HD800S for example. It's a pretty detailed headphone, but a good bit of that is from the treble peaks. The LCD-5 having more laid back treble presentation could give off the impression that it's not as detailed.

I'm glad you mention this because I do want to make it clear that I'm speaking only on clarity/transparency, which isn't necessarily the same as detail. I do agree that they perform at a high level from a detail perspective, even if not at the top of the pack. Most of your entire post resonates with me.

I respect your opinion. For me, no matter how much EQ I used on the susvara, I could never get the bass to match the texture of the LCD-4. As much of a fan I was of the sus, I just couldn't shake that soft bass, even on a speaker amp. So both headphones EQ'd, I chose the LCD-5.

I agree with you. Again I don't have the Susvara here, but from memory the punch certainly is better and the bass does feel better overall--and that's with speaker amps that I used with it. I get that perspective and choice entirely.

 

[Violent_Sneeze]

Just received the LCD-5 today and listening to it now! Amazing headphone, better synergy it seems on my setup than the LCD-4. I'm in love with the midrange on these things.

 

[Volote]

Just received the LCD-5 today and listening to it now! Amazing headphone, better synergy it seems on my setup than the LCD-4. I'm in love with the midrange on these things.

Agreed. Got mine earlier this month and have been throwing every genre into this. Love the midrange, drums.... finally got around to playing Tool and was super happy with how the LCD-5 handles it without EQ. My expectations might not be as high as many, but F me sideways on a lunchbox, best thousands I've spent

 

[MN8372]

Hi all

Interesting discussion re LCD 5 v Susvara. I’m sure everyone hears differently but I don‘t get some of the hyperbole on here. Is the Susvara/SR09 really so much more transparent than the LCD5? I respect anyone who thinks that one hp is more transparent than the other but (for me) the degree of magnitude is slight. My personal opinion is that people are equating airiness with transparency. The Susvara does have a wider/airiier soundstage. Of that I have no doubt. In fact switching from the Sus to the LCD5 is most unpleasant. Like going from FM to AM. But then you listen. Listen some more. Then the LCD5 starts to open up and show its true colours. It is technically very impressive. Transparent even…. With a punch that the Sus jus’t cant match. Regarding tonality - that’s so personal - but I “currently” prefer the LCD 5 (without EQ) to the Sus. The Sus is an amazing headphone but I can’t listen to it for so long - there is a very feint brittleness in the treble (not much but it’s there) that the LCD 5 does not have. The LCD5 is darker yes but still with all the detail,.

All this is of course system dependent (and human dependent!). I have a CFA3 enroute from Dukei which I suspect will bring the punch for the Sus but maybe with some more added brightness that will not be so positive… That’s where a tube pre-amp may come into play!

It seems to me there is quite a big difference in tonality and relative strengths and weaknesses between the top headphones. But saying one is so much better than the other doesn’t make any sense to me (based on my limited experience).

Although I currently prefer the LCD 5 to the Sus in my system doesn’t mean the Sus is ”worse“ than the LCD 5. They are both incredible headphones.

But I do get how some people may not jive with the LCD5. For me, it is a Utopia v2. It’s not a Hifiman that’s for sure.

 

[Trance_Gott]

I respect your opinion. For me, no matter how much EQ I used on the susvara, I could never get the bass to match the texture of the LCD-4. As much of a fan I was of the sus, I just couldn't shake that soft bass, even on a speaker amp. So both headphones EQ'd, I chose the LCD-5.

That's the case a lot of headphones don't really respond good to EQ. For example you can never EQ punch. 009, Susvara you get more bass volume but that means not more punch.

 

[Dloines]

I will say that frequency response plays a role in how people pickup on detail.

Take the HD800S for example. It's a pretty detailed headphone, but a good bit of that is from the treble peaks. The LCD-5 having more laid back treble presentation could give off the impression that it's not as detailed.

But, I've noticed the details are all there... Very much so indeed. In fact, I find that they're too detailed at times lol. Sure, maybe some other stupid expensive cans can provide even higher levels of details but... why? I find the LCD-5 to have a certain cohesion to it which makes it so appealing. It's like an exciting version of a reference hifi system.

Speaking of which, I'd rather take a high-end, well-designed loudspeaker system over any pair of headphones. Sure, the details are fun at first, but speakers still make you feel the music in a way headphones can't. Pressurizing a room is just a different (and superior, IMO) experience. Of course, the compromise is the size, portability, and isolation which headphones offer.

Idk, I just feel like people in the headphones hobby get too wound up over this gear vs that. Find what suits you best and enjoy them. There's always going to be "better" systems out there. But at what cost? And does it move you the way you want it to move you?

Sometimes I enjoy my "lesser" cans as I'm not focused on all the technicalities -- just enjoying the music.

Good points, I agree and I am a home stereo guy myself and have a separate room dedicated to my my home stereo, I use my LCD for the times when I don't want to do a long listen session or late at night (2:00 am, crazy huh?), so I only need one pair of TOTL headphones, I heard them all, and I agree, there is no comparison to well recorded live music on nice home stereo speakers.

 

[jlbrach]

Hi all

Interesting discussion re LCD 5 v Susvara. I’m sure everyone hears differently but I don‘t get some of the hyperbole on here. Is the Susvara/SR09 really so much more transparent than the LCD5? I respect anyone who thinks that one hp is more transparent than the other but (for me) the degree of magnitude is slight. My personal opinion is that people are equating airiness with transparency. The Susvara does have a wider/airiier soundstage. Of that I have no doubt. In fact switching from the Sus to the LCD5 is most unpleasant. Like going from FM to AM. But then you listen. Listen some more. Then the LCD5 starts to open up and show its true colours. It is technically very impressive. Transparent even…. With a punch that the Sus jus’t cant match. Regarding tonality - that’s so personal - but I “currently” prefer the LCD 5 (without EQ) to the Sus. The Sus is an amazing headphone but I can’t listen to it for so long - there is a very feint brittleness in the treble (not much but it’s there) that the LCD 5 does not have. The LCD5 is darker yes but still with all the detail,.

All this is of course system dependent (and human dependent!). I have a CFA3 enroute from Dukei which I suspect will bring the punch for the Sus but maybe with some more added brightness that will not be so positive… That’s where a tube pre-amp may come into play!

It seems to me there is quite a big difference in tonality and relative strengths and weaknesses between the top headphones. But saying one is so much better than the other doesn’t make any sense to me (based on my limited experience).

Although I currently prefer the LCD 5 to the Sus in my system doesn’t mean the Sus is ”worse“ than the LCD 5. They are both incredible headphones.

But I do get how some people may not jive with the LCD5. For me, it is a Utopia v2. It’s not a Hifiman that’s for sure.

going back and forth between the susvara and 5 is really difficult...you have to spend a fair bit of time which each one because they are so different...while both are extremely detailed the 5 is so much more forward and aggressive that it really hits you when you first put it on...if one likes a more laid back balanced presentation the susvara with its airier and more open sound stage will suit you...if on the other hand you like a more aggressive and forward presentation you will like the 5...it is a preference thing..the solitaire p is kind a mid point between the 2

 

[number1sixerfan]

Hi all

Interesting discussion re LCD 5 v Susvara. I’m sure everyone hears differently but I don‘t get some of the hyperbole on here. Is the Susvara/SR09 really so much more transparent than the LCD5? I respect anyone who thinks that one hp is more transparent than the other but (for me) the degree of magnitude is slight. My personal opinion is that people are equating airiness with transparency. The Susvara does have a wider/airiier soundstage. Of that I have no doubt.

Airiness has nothing to do with transparency. They are two, totally separate things. Transparency to me, is about where headphones fall on a scale between color and neutrality. It's also about a sense of clarity. The 009 is one of the most transparent headphones I've ever heard. It has a greater sense of clarity than almost anything. The Sr1a is the only other that tops that. There is a very clear difference going from either of them to the LCD-5.

 

[sp33ls]

Airiness has nothing to do with transparency. They are two, totally separate things. Transparency to me, is about where headphones fall on a scale between color and neutrality. It's also about a sense of clarity. The 009 is one of the most transparent headphones I've ever heard. It has a greater sense of clarity than almost anything. The Sr1a is the only other that tops that. There is a very clear difference going from either of them to the LCD-5.

Out of curiosity, what genres do you typically listen to?

 

[number1sixerfan]

Out of curiosity, what genres do you typically listen to?

I listen to everything except Metal and Hip Hop. Hip Hop I listen to in my speaker setup though.

Also, regarding an earlier statement, the LCD-R and LCD-5 are very, very close tonality wise. I would remove it from the comparison list I made earlier.

 

[Andrew_WOT]

Airiness has nothing to do with transparency. They are two, totally separate things. Transparency to me, is about where headphones fall on a scale between color and neutrality. It's also about a sense of clarity. The 009 is one of the most transparent headphones I've ever heard. It has a greater sense of clarity than almost anything. The Sr1a is the only other that tops that. There is a very clear difference going from either of them to the LCD-5.

http://www.faqs.org/faqs/AudioFAQ/part2/

Transparent: Easy to hear into the music, detailed, clear, not
muddy. Wide flat frequency response, sharp time response, very
low distortion and noise.

Airy: Spacious. Open. Instruments sound like they are
surrounded by a large reflective space full of air. Good
reproduction of high-frequency reflections. High-frequency
response extends to 15 or 20 kHz.

 

[paradoxper]

I listen to everything except Metal and Hip Hop. Hip Hop I listen to in my speaker setup though.

Also, regarding an earlier statement, the LCD-R and LCD-5 are very, very close tonality wise. I would remove it from the comparison list I made earlier.

I must be the only person listening to Despised Icon on electrostatic speakers.

 

[johnzz4]

A couple of huge variables in these comparisons are headphone cables used and chain. Listening on the stock cable and the DHC Prion4 are very different experiences. Also, with such a low impedance, I would expect substantial variance between amps.