[SilverEars]

i am confused when u say there is also a bump in lcd2c as they describe the vocals to be a bit recessed, and to my knowledge a bump in 1k usually results in vocals more pronounced

so back to isine you say that the vocals for example are way too forward and that is why u need to tune 1k down

LCD2C doesn't really have a bump(relatively to the nearby drop, it can be seen as a rise through), but the similarly has that drop in the mids. It's just the combination of things. If the transition of nearby frequencies are a bit drastic, you really notice it. Just like if you know there is a cut somewhere. You call it a cut since it's a bit drastic relatively to nearby frequencies. This abruptness effects how certain frequencies are heard, and the overall tonality.

Lets say you have a bump in 1k, and drop in 2k, but this 2k drop is drastic. 2k is also a vocal region like the higher regions as well. This effects vocals recorded with emphasis in those frequencies. Some tracks may have more energy in the 1k area, others not. So, depends on what part of the mids spectrum the energy drops. Usually, the energy is dropped across the range of frequencies, and with 2k being part of vocals as well, the abrupt transition will creates oddities in the vocal output, causing unintended tonal consequences outputted.

 

[Sound Eq]

LCD2C doesn't really have a bump(relatively to the nearby drop, it can be seen as a rise through), but the similarly has that drop in the mids. It's just the combination of things. If the transition of nearby frequencies are a bit drastic, you really notice it. Just like if you know there is a cut somewhere. You call it a cut since it's a bit drastic relatively to nearby frequencies. This abruptness effects how certain frequencies are heard, and the overall tonality.

Lets say you have a bump in 1k, and drop in 2k, but this 2k drop is drastic. 2k is also a vocal region like the higher regions as well. This effects vocals recorded with emphasis in those frequencies. Some tracks may have more energy in the 1k area, others not. So, depends on what part of the mids spectrum the energy drops. Usually, the energy is dropped across the range of frequencies, and with 2k being part of vocals as well, the abrupt transition will creates oddities in the vocal output, causing unintended tonal consequences outputted.

can i ask this, with isine20 can i achieve a warm, lush, full bodied signature, with great bass and nice details in the highs, using eq on a dap as I do not have ios

I do not want to end up having an in ear headphone that is cold sounding or analytical

 

[Cozmo85]

Has anyone tried a bluetooth cable like one of these? https://www.amazon.com/KZ-Replacmen...1523750657&sr=8-2&keywords=kz+bluetooth+cable

 

[Sssss]

Possibly stupid question incoming: would it be possible and safe to use one side of an iSine 10 and one side of a 20 with a single Cipher cable at the same time?

Asking because I may have an opportunity in the coming week to try these out (time being a limiting factor), and I imagine this could make comparing much easier.

 

[Devodonaldson]

can i ask this, with isine20 can i achieve a warm, lush, full bodied signature, with great bass and nice details in the highs, using eq on a dap as I do not have ios

I do not want to end up having an in ear headphone that is cold sounding or analytical

Been using my iSine 20 for a week now. I use an Android transport to a portable DAC/amp, no eq. I don't use silicone tips as I feel that they boost the treble and scoop out other frequencies. In a normal iem, I would be using a medium sized foam tips, but with the iSine, a tight seal isn't desired. A light seal allows provides the best sound IMO. Comply isolation SMALL tips don't get squeezed in my ear canal, and easily slide in. The foam creates a pleasant open soundstage and a frequency response very pleasing to my ears. I started on the Monoprice m300 6 months ago, so I knew that small foam was the best sound production IMO. Bass is tight and detailed. I'm actually happy with implementing the bass boost on my DAC/amp, and I wouldn't have said that with the m300 or my previous Sennheiser Momentum headphones. The only other monitors I would want other than these would be the LCD-i4, but that isn't happening, lol

 

[davehutch]

If you listen to vocals, and have ears for vocals, you will hear something off due to the bump, and then the drastic drop in the mids. Interestingly, I see this drastic drop on the new LCD2C as well, and it's quite audibly noticeable. I don't know if this how their method of developing their diaphragm results in(such tonal qualities) when it gets made or whoever tuning it, tunes it like this. This is part of the reason why the cipher cable exists, and so much discussion of EQ, and all the mess. Basically, it didn't get tuned correctly, and the correction is applied with EQ.

My understanding from past posts by @Audeze was that there is no real tuning possible on a single diaphragm and the reason it can sound 'off' without EQ is because basically your listening to a full size planar magnetic diaphragm that bypasses your out ear structure i.e. goes straight into your canal. It's extremely linear in response but the FR gets messed up because you don't hear them with your entire ear/head mechanism
It's unlike 'normal' IEMs that can be tuned using crossovers and multiple drivers in this respect so it was engineered to be very low distortion instead, with the ability to accept EQ particularly well by either using the Cipher or EQ software on a DAP.
There was certainly a lot of confusion as you say, at the beginning, particularly when they came out with the LCD-i4 which didn't have a Cipher cable and therefore needed EQ'ing on a DAP.
Exactly the same however, applies to the LCD-i4 regarding the fact that it doesn't interact with your outer ear structure.
The entire iSine/i4 series all need EQ to get a curve close to the Harman target response curve, if that's the kind of FR you want of course. That's the drawback of a single planar driver that goes straight into your ear canal I guess.

 

[Sound Eq]

Been using my iSine 20 for a week now. I use an Android transport to a portable DAC/amp, no eq. I don't use silicone tips as I feel that they boost the treble and scoop out other frequencies. In a normal iem, I would be using a medium sized foam tips, but with the iSine, a tight seal isn't desired. A light seal allows provides the best sound IMO. Comply isolation SMALL tips don't get squeezed in my ear canal, and easily slide in. The foam creates a pleasant open soundstage and a frequency response very pleasing to my ears. I started on the Monoprice m300 6 months ago, so I knew that small foam was the best sound production IMO. Bass is tight and detailed. I'm actually happy with implementing the bass boost on my DAC/amp, and I wouldn't have said that with the m300 or my previous Sennheiser Momentum headphones. The only other monitors I would want other than these would be the LCD-i4, but that isn't happening, lol

thanks for this reply, so can i get a warm, lush, full bodied signature, with great bass and nice details in the highs, using eq on a dap as I do not have ios

 

[AlwaysForward]

thanks for this reply, so can i get a warm, lush, full bodied signature, with great bass and nice details in the highs, using eq on a dap as I do not have ios

Yes. However, for pure convenience, I’d recommend getting a used iPod Touch off Craigslist/eBay/Amazon for about $100 and treat it like a custom DAP for the iSine.

It’s not uncommon for people to have multiple desktop amps for pairings. So in the scheme of things, that’s a relatively inexpensive custom pairing.

Now back to listening to these puppies.

 

[Sound Eq]

Yes. However, for pure convenience, I’d recommend getting a used iPod Touch off Craigslist/eBay/Amazon for about $100 and treat it like a custom DAP for the iSine.

It’s not uncommon for people to have multiple desktop amps for pairings. So in the scheme of things, that’s a relatively inexpensive custom pairing.

Now back to listening to these puppies.

thanks but why an ipod when i have a totl dap cowon plenue s, just for cypher cable u mean to work with isine, I would consider it

so using an eq on a dap will not give the same results as the cypher cable

 

[AlwaysForward]

thanks but why an ipod when i have a totl dap cowon plenue s, just for cypher cable u mean to work with isine, I would consider it

so using an eq on a dap will not give the same results as the cypher cable

If you have a good parametric EQ, @KMann can help

 

[antdroid]

Has anyone tried a bluetooth cable like one of these? https://www.amazon.com/KZ-Replacmen...1523750657&sr=8-2&keywords=kz+bluetooth+cable

You can use it, but you will have to cut a slit for the notch in the iSine connector into each side. It's not too hard to do.

 

[Sound Eq]

If you have a good parametric EQ, @KMann can help

If you have a good parametric EQ, @KMann can help

So can i ask, you know how it is usually when people say an iem has a wide soundstage or start to compare an iem to headphones. With all my iems I would never ever compare an iem to headphones, now is the isine really different than regular iems in that regard. Would you feel they are different than iems in terms of presenting sound

 

[AlwaysForward]

So can i ask, you know how it is usually when people say an iem has a wide soundstage or start to compare an iem to headphones. With all my iems I would never ever compare an iem to headphones, now is the isine really different than regular iems in that regard. Would you feel they are different than iems in terms of presenting sound

IMHO, comparing the iSine to any other headphone is really apples and oranges. It kind of created it's own new class of sound presentation. Yes, the soundstage is very wide. Tips can impact this quite a bit and the stock groovy tips are very wide presentation indeed.

However, they are still in your ears. So you kind of have this hybrid thing going on where the center image is more pronounced & intimate feeling than you would experience with supra-aural cans. Also, the bass presentation retains more energy than you would typically get with open-backs. Bass is also very much in your ears vs the outside.

So it's got this low end definition you might get from an IEM or closed back over-ear. If you swap between an over-ears and these, while different, you'll find the image width/depth and resolution to be quite similar.

I spent a day at the local shop and compared the whole Focal & MrSpeakers lines + LCD-2 and HD800 with a Questyle 400 amp/dac and found that the slight difference in presentation, for me, didn't justify giving up the portability + spending $2k+ on a desktop rig when I have these. My takeaway was that these are my favorite headphones I've ever tried. However, I could be biased because I've been listening to them for an hour per day for about a year now.

Do they compare? Kind of. Are they the same as? No. Are they better? Maybe.

 

[Devodonaldson]

thanks for this reply, so can i get a warm, lush, full bodied signature, with great bass and nice details in the highs, using eq on a dap as I do not have ios

Yes you can. Tips will play a big role as well. ISine comes with silicone tips. Cipher cable is eq'd based on silicone tips, I assume. I notice a very different frequency presentation with silicone vs foam. For analog connection, Comply tips 600 series is a must.

 

[AlwaysForward]

Yes you can. Tips will play a big role as well. ISine comes with silicone tips. Cipher cable is eq'd based on silicone tips, I assume. I notice a very different frequency presentation with silicone vs foam. For analog connection, Comply tips 600 series is a must.

Also, if you're into foamies, the Symbio Mandarine-E gives the best of both worlds and doesn't wear out + keeps sharper highs/lows + extended soundstage vs pure-foam. IMHO, IME.