[KMann]

Thanks! I thought I was crazy because I couldn't find it in the data sheets, but it turns out it's only in the article that I didn't read.

It does look like the target I mentioned, only that they only used 10 bands to equalize and thus not doing well in between the bands. They did add some sub-bass but they probably would have done better by using a better target. They had a good idea but did not think it through, in my opinion. Weird that a company with so much experience uses such an odd choice for an equalizer.

The DSP inside the Cipher cable adds the effect of outer ear and brings the over all response close to what a pair of tonally neutral speakers sound in a well treated room. Tyll has already published how this looks like through his measurements. The Cipher uses IIR filters and our proprietary algorithms to precisely model the effect of outer ear. Of course it would be silly to implement such a target using 10 band EQ. We realize that there may not be 'one-size-fits-all' when it comes to EQ. that is the reason why we provide the 10 band EQ to allow users to personalize what they hear. Any change you make using the 10 band EQ is applied in addition (i.e., in series) to the default tuning and is not a replacement. The 10 band EQ profile Tyll posted is his personalized EQ that rides on top of the default tuning.

We choose the 10 Band EQ as many are familiar with the interface and it is far less intimidating than a full fledged parametric EQ. It gets the job done if you want to do minor tweaks.

I hope I have cleared your doubt. If you have any further questions please feel free to let me know.

 

[Gowry]

The 10 band EQ of the App uses a Q of 1.414 and the center frequencies are already as listed in the App. The variants I posted are warmer versions of the default tuning. You can do a rough approximation using the following settings in your App and then go from there:

125Hz => 2 dB
250Hz => 1 dB
2kHz => -1 dB
4kHz => -3dB
8kHz => -4dB (optional, remove if you feel edges sound dull)
16kHz => 3dB

Thank you,

I like this setting a lot.

 

[willsw]

With the notch facing you and the pins pointing up. The positive conductor is on left for the left ear and right for the right ear.

Thank you very much!

 

[HuoYuanJia]

I'm asking because what I see in Tyll's measurements is not what I get when listening to sine sweeps.

Speak for yourself because except for the bass boost the sine sweep gave me exactly what the measurements show.

The DSP inside the Cipher cable adds the effect of outer ear and brings the over all response close to what a pair of tonally neutral speakers sound in a well treated room.

I think the issue here is that "well treated room" is one without reflections and one that no one is used to. That explains the shouty midrange and why the majority complain about brightness. Some kind of correction for room reflections would result in a warmer tonality would probably be perceived as more natural sounding from most (or even everyone outside an anechoic chamber).

Harman has two targets. One for IEM and one for headphones. The target for IEMs has less midrange and more bass. What Tyll measured with the iSine looks like the target for full-sized headphones.

Anyway, this is just my opinion. Thank you for the insight, though.

 

[KMann]

I think the issue here is that "well treated room" is one without reflections and one that no one is used to. That explains the shouty midrange and why the majority complain about brightness. Some kind of correction for room reflections would result in a warmer tonality would probably be perceived as more natural sounding from most (or even everyone outside an anechoic chamber).

Harman has two targets. One for IEM and one for headphones. The target for IEMs has less midrange and more bass. What Tyll measured with the iSine looks like the target for full-sized headphones.

Anyway, this is just my opinion. Thank you for the insight, though.

A well treated room is not an anechoic chamber or a 'dead' room, yes no one listens nor mixes in those. A well treated room is one with active and passive traps where the reverberation is controlled and the frequency response is reasonably smooth.

The Harman target for IEMs is for IEMs that are closed, iSines are not closed IEMs and that target does not apply here. Harman's targets are based on listener preferences and it is not necessarily the yard-stick for sounding neutral.

Listener preferences, including yours varies and that is the reason for us providing the ability to customize through our app..

 

[Textfeud]

@Audeze I'm thinking of getting the iSine 10 second hand on the classifieds but how would that work with warranty? He doesn't have the proof of purchase with it. Would that void any warranty?

 

[HuoYuanJia]

A well treated room is not an anechoic chamber or a 'dead' room, yes no one listens nor mixes in those. A well treated room is one with active and passive traps where the reverberation is controlled and the frequency response is reasonably smooth.

The Harman target for IEMs is for IEMs that are closed, iSines are not closed IEMs and that target does not apply here. Harman's targets are based on listener preferences and it is not necessarily the yard-stick for sounding neutral.

Listener preferences, including yours varies and that is the reason for us providing the ability to customize through our app..

I have extracted Tyll's measurements and held them against the Harman Over-Ear target. It matches it well from 20 Hz to 3 kHz. (I don't know if I'm allowed to upload the target so I didn't.)
But the IEC 11904-2 matches it even better starting from 300 Hz, including the characteristic 5-6 kHz dip and 8 kHz peak. My ears did not fail me. (See picture.)

There seems to be a 4 kHz peak that has never come up in any target. I would say this could be useful for loudness correction, but the iSine don't necessarily strike me as warm or full sounding. Personal preference? Maybe.

This is where I'm at, in case anybody is interested:
+1 @ 250 Hz
-1 @ 1 kHz
-1 @ 2 kHz
-3 @ 4 kHz
-3 @ 8 kHz
-3 @ 16 kHz
The 10 freq band EQ is not enough to get the sound perfectly like I want it. Using a sine sweep I can still hear plenty peaks and dips in between.
Overall it does sound great when shuffling music right now. I will try to get my settings measured or improved otherwise.

 

[Sharkhunter]

@Audeze I'm thinking of getting the iSine 10 second hand on the classifieds but how would that work with warranty? He doesn't have the proof of purchase with it. Would that void any warranty?

You will be at Audeze's mercy. I would avoid buying with out a receipt.

 

[Textfeud]

You will be at Audeze's mercy. I would avoid buying with out a receipt.

I had contact with them over e-mail and they told me I will have warranty from manufacuring date. Very nice customer service. So I went ahead and bought them, can't wait! Loved the LCD-2 versions, LCD-X and LCD-XC so hopefully I will like the iSine 10 as well. I only didn't like the EL-8 that much.

 

[bvng3540]

Does anyone know where I can buy the cipher with the 2 pins thanks

 

[howdy]

You mean just a cipher cable as they are all 2 pin. You can buy it on Moon Audios website which is what i did.

 

[pinoyman]

thanks for the EQ SETTINGs, mates.
ill try them one on mine...been looking for those because i dont know how to EQ.
this helps alot.

 

[pinoyman]

hats off to the AUDEZE company, they replaced my cipher when i freshly bought my isine 20, the paint chipped in the lightning part, and they helped me instantly by replacing my cipher which id be using in our AudioFans meet in the Philippines.

 

[scottsays]

Just got my Isine 20's with the standard cable--second set. I sent the first pair back because I did not like the sound at all coming out of a FiiO X5 1st gen. It was very tinny and metallic sounding. I returned them and then discovered this thread with the EQ settings needed and I have since upgraded my player---so wanted to try again. I am using a Cayin I5, sound is better. I plugged in my Cayin C5 amp and the sound improves a lot. The really key thing is to use the EQ to fix it up---as posted in this thread.
Without the EQ the sound is really muddy and not that great. I recently got a set of Noble Encore--so anything compared to that is a letdown.
I think with adjusting the EQ the sound is very good--looking forward to experimenting with these---
I wish they could somehow make an EQ cord that would work for other music players--or make a separate I20 built and tuned for other players-----

 

[ubs28]

I listened to the iSine 10 or 20 I believe and I was super impressed with them for the price they are asking. Now I'm curious how their more expensive models sound though.

But since they offer 0% isolation, it's probably not something that I will buy (which is the reason why I got rid of my Apple Earpods).

If Audeze can make a closed version with good isolation, then they got a winner at their respective price levels.