[Satsugai]

Preordered the iSine 20 on Cyber Monday. 
 
Can't wait!

 

[xuan87]

I managed to get a good listen to both the iSine 10 and 20 last weekend at a local audio event, so I thought I'll share my impressions here. I didn't read through this thread, so it will be good if someone can help to confirm or deny the concerns that I have.
 
Firstly, these things are big, but light, being that they are made out of plastics. The magnets are extremely strong too, so I'll be careful about putting them too close to each other. 
 
First concern is the build quality. These are demo units so I can understand if they're beat up. However, the removable cables are extremely loose and break free extremely easy. Even when they're in, they cut out easily with a simple head movement so I have to keep my head perfectly still. I wonder if this is due to many many enthusiastic auditions and cable swaps (only 1 3.5mm cable and 1 lightning cable for both units), or just below-average durability.
 
Next, as they are only 2 ear grips (the black inner ear and white outer ear) and 2 different tips, I wasn't able to get a good insert and proper isolation. Hence, I do not know if the high level of noise leakage is due to the bad fit, or the earphones themselves.
 
Finally, getting to the sound, both the iSine10 and 20 sound pretty similar to each other and I won't say that the iSine 20 is a clear step above the iSine10 in all aspects. I won't go into too much details (due to bad fitting) but I will say that the iSine10 is more engaging, while the iSine 20 is more spacious, like sitting in the front row vs further back row of a concert, to put it very very simply.
 
Overall, these earphones tilt slightly towards the neutral end of the spectrum rather than warm, but not too much.
 
Both of them have GREAT bass slam. I'm not a basshead but bass is one of, if not, the most important aspect to me. The iSine 20's bass hits harder and to me, it's too much bass.
 
Overall I prefer the iSine10, due to the more engaging sound signature and less (but still very much present and prominent) bass. The fact that it's cheaper is just a bonus (will still prefer the iSine10 at the same price). The pricing for the iSine 10 is fair while I felt it's too much for the iSine 20.
 
However, I will hold back my purchase first to see if anyone has encountered any kind of durability problems within the first few months of ownership, and I will want to try them with a wider range of eartips to see how they truly sound like with the proper seal.
 
NOTE:
Ok, just want to share with all a very weird experience: The lightning cable and the 3.5mm cables sound like day and night difference, a term that i don't often use (and won't use to describe the iSine 10 and 20). The lightning cable is the better sounding cable, while the 3.5mm cable plugged to my DPX1 (a more neutralish DAP) made both iSine sound muffled, overly warm and like $5 IEMs. I tried both cables on both iSine and the results are consistent: The lightning cable sounds lightyears ahead plus the DPX1 isn't what you would call a warm player.
 
I'll be interested if another one else has the same experience with the cables.

 

[Sound Eq]

  I managed to get a good listen to both the iSine 10 and 20 last weekend at a local audio event, so I thought I'll share my impressions here. I didn't read through this thread, so it will be good if someone can help to confirm or deny the concerns that I have.
 
Firstly, these things are big, but light, being that they are made out of plastics. The magnets are extremely strong too, so I'll be careful about putting them too close to each other. 
 
First concern is the build quality. These are demo units so I can understand if they're beat up. However, the removable cables are extremely loose and break free extremely easy. Even when they're in, they cut out easily with a simple head movement so I have to keep my head perfectly still. I wonder if this is due to many many enthusiastic auditions and cable swaps (only 1 3.5mm cable and 1 lightning cable for both units), or just below-average durability.
 
Next, as they are only 2 ear grips (the black inner ear and white outer ear) and 2 different tips, I wasn't able to get a good insert and proper isolation. Hence, I do not know if the high level of noise leakage is due to the bad fit, or the earphones themselves.
 
Finally, getting to the sound, both the iSine10 and 20 sound pretty similar to each other and I won't say that the iSine 20 is a clear step above the iSine10 in all aspects. I won't go into too much details (due to bad fitting) but I will say that the iSine10 is more engaging, while the iSine 20 is more spacious, like sitting in the front row vs further back row of a concert, to put it very very simply.
 
Overall, these earphones tilt slightly towards the neutral end of the spectrum rather than warm, but not too much.
 
Both of them have GREAT bass slam. I'm not a basshead but bass is one of, if not, the most important aspect to me. The iSine 20's bass hits harder and to me, it's too much bass.
 
Overall I prefer the iSine10, due to the more engaging sound signature and less (but still very much present and prominent) bass. The fact that it's cheaper is just a bonus (will still prefer the iSine10 at the same price). The pricing for the iSine 10 is fair while I felt it's too much for the iSine 20.
 
However, I will hold back my purchase first to see if anyone has encountered any kind of durability problems within the first few months of ownership, and I will want to try them with a wider range of eartips to see how they truly sound like with the proper seal.
 
NOTE:
Ok, just want to share with all a very weird experience: The lightning cable and the 3.5mm cables sound like day and night difference, a term that i don't often use (and won't use to describe the iSine 10 and 20). The lightning cable is the better sounding cable, while the 3.5mm cable plugged to my DPX1 (a more neutralish DAP) made both iSine sound muffled, overly warm and like $5 IEMs. I tried both cables on both iSine and the results are consistent: The lightning cable sounds lightyears ahead plus the DPX1 isn't what you would call a warm player.
 
I'll be interested if another one else has the same experience with the cables.

hmmm the last note makes us wait for an android cable version then

 

[lostman]

 I wasn't able to get a good insert and proper isolation.

I thought they're not supposed to insert into ears at all. When I tried them at a show I was told they're just supposed to sit on top of your ears.
 
Regarding magnets and putting them close together, I hope that's not a problem. The official case was kinda big and I hope I could pack them into something much smaller.

 

[xuan87]

  I thought they're not supposed to insert into ears at all. When I tried them at a show I was told they're just supposed to sit on top of your ears.
 
Regarding magnets and putting them close together, I hope that's not a problem. The official case was kinda big and I hope I could pack them into something much smaller.

 
I'm not sure if I understand you right but there is actually a nozzle that you will put a typical eartip on. Check out my photo below, in particular the iSine 20 on the left.
 

 

[lostman]

When I tried them on I was told not to try to jam the nozzle into my ear but rather let it just sit on top of my ear canal and be held there by clamping force from the little plastic bit that goes behind the ear. More like an earbud than in-ear.

 

[BlinkST]

  NOTE:
Ok, just want to share with all a very weird experience: The lightning cable and the 3.5mm cables sound like day and night difference, a term that i don't often use (and won't use to describe the iSine 10 and 20). The lightning cable is the better sounding cable, while the 3.5mm cable plugged to my DPX1 (a more neutralish DAP) made both iSine sound muffled, overly warm and like $5 IEMs. I tried both cables on both iSine and the results are consistent: The lightning cable sounds lightyears ahead plus the DPX1 isn't what you would call a warm player.
 
I'll be interested if another one else has the same experience with the cables.

 
That's not all that weird or unusual. People have had the same remarks about the Cipher cable from the first Sine on-ears. 

 

[SomeGuyDude]

  Ok, just want to share with all a very weird experience: The lightning cable and the 3.5mm cables sound like day and night difference, a term that i don't often use (and won't use to describe the iSine 10 and 20). The lightning cable is the better sounding cable, while the 3.5mm cable plugged to my DPX1 (a more neutralish DAP) made both iSine sound muffled, overly warm and like $5 IEMs. I tried both cables on both iSine and the results are consistent: The lightning cable sounds lightyears ahead plus the DPX1 isn't what you would call a warm player.
 
I'll be interested if another one else has the same experience with the cables.

So wait.
 
You put cable A into player A, then cable B into player B, and you're trying to compare the cables. Like, it's not occurring to you that a proprietary cable going direct digital into an iPhone might be changing things somehow. 
 
Put the 3.5mm into your iPhone and compare it then. 

 

[Madcat207]

  So wait.
 
You put cable A into player A, then cable B into player B, and you're trying to compare the cables. Like, it's not occurring to you that a proprietary cable going direct digital into an iPhone might be changing things somehow. 
 
Put the 3.5mm into your iPhone and compare it then. 

This.  You cant completely change players and then say its *just* the cable.  I have no doubts the DAC in the cable is tuned quite extensively, but its not a for sure conclusion without testing on the same device...

 

[Satsugai]

 
This.  You cant completely change players and then say its *just* the cable.  I have no doubts the DAC in the cable is tuned quite extensively, but its not a for sure conclusion without testing on the same device...
 

Not to mention the built in iOS app that it asks you to install. I am certain that not only the DAC but the app are coloring the sound in some way.
 
This MIGHT mean that people will need (want?) other versions of the iSINE CIPHER DAC for their different devices. This is a PITA if true.

 

[SomeGuyDude]

  Not to mention the built in iOS app that it asks you to install. I am certain that not only the DAC but the app are coloring the sound in some way.
 
This MIGHT mean that people will need (want?) other versions of the iSINE CIPHER DAC for their different devices. This is a PITA if true.

 
That's even a bigger issue. The app is specifically made for these cables. I do not doubt in the slightest it's a factor.

 

[_PsiFire_]

Just read some impressions from RMAF also saying the earphones were much better while using cipher cable.. This is worrying since I don't have Apple products.

So hyped for these but starting to think I should have waited for more impressions..which is what I wanted to do but $100 off had me.

 

[Riley Beale]

How is the isolation of the Isine 20 if properly inserted using tips that properly fit my ears?  Would the isolation be sufficient for long car rides in a fairly quiet new car with my parents playing an audio book over the stereo at low to moderate volume?  Would the noise leakage from the Isine themselves be loud enough to disturb them?  Would I be able to pretty much just focus on my music or would the noise get through too much being open back or semi open back?

 

[Br777]

they sound different with the lightening cable because the EQ settings that audeze tuned for them are saved in the cable's memory.  Their app lets you create custom eq settings and save them to the cable.   When you demo them with a standard cable you are getting the stock sound, when you try them with the lightening cable, you are getting the custom audeze eq'd sound.

 

[Audeze]

1.  We have tuned the DAC to provide a neutral response.
2.  The iOS app does not change the tonal response unless the graphic EQ is used to change the EQ.  Even then, the audio is changed only when it reaches the DAC/DSP. The App just controls the electronics and does not process any audio. The IOS system bypasses the app. You can easily test this by not installing the app. 
3.  The installation of iOS app is not required to play music via the Cipher cable, but it will be required if one wants to update firmware.
 
Even without lightning the iSine headphones have one of the smoothest (and perhaps the least distorting) of any in-ear ever. The soundstage in either case is typical of an on-ear headphone.
The presentation when using the lightning (CIPHER) cable is different from using the analog cable. With the lightning cable, we have leveraged the integrated DSP, think of this as our IEM house EQ curve. The differences people hear between the lightning and analog are very likely due to this. One could still apply an EQ on top of our tuning using the Audeze App.
 
Quote:

  Not to mention the built in iOS app that it asks you to install. I am certain that not only the DAC but the app are coloring the sound in some way.
 
This MIGHT mean that people will need (want?) other versions of the iSINE CIPHER DAC for their different devices. This is a PITA if true.