[money4me247]

  Are you saying LCD-2 is summit-fi? or just that the el-8 isn't summit-fi? because it's already looking like it might have better tone and just overall better sound than the LCD-2 from the impressions I've read.

I don't think either the LCD-2 or the EL-8 can be summit-fi if within Audeze's own line-up all their other headphones are priced much higher. Though I consider summit-fi to be the best headphones offered by the manufacturer.
 
However, really the $700 to $2000 price range of headphones are all extremely high-end & really comes down more to personal preference of sound signature & other elements rather than anything else.

 

[goldendarko]

$700 is certainly not chump change, and certainly more than most people will ever spend on headphones. But when the company making them sells their TOTL headphone for 3X the price, I think you have to consider this their "value" offering. A chance for the rest of us to own a pair of Audeze's as it were...

 

[GrindedDown]

Can't wait till someone actually posts something really substantive about the SQ.

Me, I'm going to CES tomorrow.  I've loaded my phone with my FLAC test tracks and I'm bringing my E11 amp and HP100 headphones.  They're nothing special, but they should give me a baseline that I'm comfortable with for comparing the sound signatures.  We'll see if that helps at all.  lol

Thats awesome that youre going. Be sure to come back and post all your impressions.

And yes its good to have someone else from vegas. We'll probably have to link up to demo gear and the likes.

Have fun at ces.

 

[lamode]

  $700 is certainly not chump change, and certainly more than most people will ever spend on headphones. But when the company making them sells their TOTL headphone for 3X the price, I think you have to consider this their "value" offering. A chance for the rest of us to own a pair of Audeze's as it were...

 
Or... it could be like Canon offering the 13MP 5D full-frame camera for 1/3 of their flagship's price (the 16MP 1DMkII, I think it was). People were shocked at the time. Did Canon lose money by undercutting their flagship like this? No, it become their most profitable unit because it was a runaway success.
 
I suspect Audeze is doing the same with the EL-8. They want to stay ahead of the competition on performance and price. It's a bold move. I suspect they are betting the farm on it too.

 

[DreamKing]

  I don't think either the LCD-2 or the EL-8 can be summit-fi if within Audeze's own line-up all their other headphones are priced much higher. Though I consider summit-fi to be the best headphones offered by the manufacturer.
 
However, really the $700 to $2000 price range of headphones are all extremely high-end & really comes down more to personal preference of sound signature & other elements rather than anything else.

I agree and would say that they wouldn't belong in that tier when thinking of the industry as a whole too. They're still highly desirable though and create just as much excitement from folks here.

 

[Beagle]

  Are you saying LCD-2 is summit-fi? or just that the el-8 isn't summit-fi?  Won't be summit-fi obviously but LCD-2 isn't either anymore

 
After about 16 months, every 'flagship' is plummet-fi...

 

[Lohb]

$700 about upper limit premium mainstream consumer prices, but lower mid/mid-tier for the full-time can fanatics ?

 

[Sam Edwards]

Hopefully we'll be able to hear them at the So Cal Head Fi Meet Up...

 

[Stillhart]

  Are you saying LCD-2 is summit-fi? or just that the el-8 isn't summit-fi? because it's already looking like it might have better tone and just overall better sound than the LCD-2 from the impressions I've read. Especially since the sound is based on the X and XC. Won't be summit-fi obviously but LCD-2 isn't either anymore (I probably got what you're saying confused though).

 
Again, try to put this into perspective.  So many Audeze fans get caught up in the fact that the LCD-2 has been surpassed by even more absurdly expensive headphones that they forget where it stands compared to just about every other headphone on the market.  
 
The LCD-2 *is* summit-fi.  It's $1000 (!!!) and when it came out it was one of the best cans you could buy.  For many people it's an end-game can.  Are there better and/or more expensive headphones out there?  Yup.  But not NEARLY as many worse/cheaper headphones.  Relative to the whole market, the LCD-2 is summit-fi in both price and sound.
 
Regardless, what I was saying in my previous post was that *I theorize* the sound of the EL-8 won't be at the level of the LCD-2 by design.  They cannot have something that sounds as good or better than the LCD-2, while being cheaper, without undercutting the market for the LCD-2.  Since they've flat out stated that the two aren't competing, it stands to reason that the EL-8 shouldn't sound as good.
 
If they hadn't stated that they weren't competing, I'd say they were purposely undercutting the LCD-2 to grab a larger market share.

 

[mlxx]

I don't think they're measuring it differently. I think they've incorporated tech or things into the LCDs too that can be found in the EL-8s. Maybe for later announcement. If it's a new technology, they should.

 
They might incorporate them after the EL-8 is released but they would be silly to do it now. It took the changes in the LCDX 6 months to be added to the rest of the range. They should prove them in the EL-8 first. They also said they will be more transparent when they make changes in the future.
 
Looking at these 2 posts below... I do think its just different measuring now so it compares better with what the others are doing...
 
http://www.head-fi.org/t/738025/new-audeze-prototype-z/75#post_10973571
http://www.head-fi.org/t/509710/audeze-lcd-2-impressions-thread/3765#post_10800419
 
But if they have made changes, can I send in my 3F to have it updated?

 

[Uberclocked]

The LCD-2 isn't summit-fi.
It isn't the HE90.
Seriously though, it's sold at less than $1000 right now so I wouldn't really consider it summit-fi material.  The fact that there's an LCD-3 just furthers my point.  Summit-fi is supposed to be the best of the best, not just really nice.

 

[DreamKing]

   
Again, try to put this into perspective.  So many Audeze fans get caught up in the fact that the LCD-2 has been surpassed by even more absurdly expensive headphones that they forget where it stands compared to just about every other headphone on the market.  
 
The LCD-2 *is* summit-fi.  It's $1000 (!!!) and when it came out it was one of the best cans you could buy.  For many people it's an end-game can.  Are there better and/or more expensive headphones out there?  Yup.  But not NEARLY as many worse/cheaper headphones.  Relative to the whole market, the LCD-2 is summit-fi in both price and sound.
 
Regardless, what I was saying in my previous post was that *I theorize* the sound of the EL-8 won't be at the level of the LCD-2 by design.  They cannot have something that sounds as good or better than the LCD-2, while being cheaper, without undercutting the market for the LCD-2.  Since they've flat out stated that the two aren't competing, it stands to reason that the EL-8 shouldn't sound as good.
 
If they hadn't stated that they weren't competing, I'd say they were purposely undercutting the LCD-2 to grab a larger market share.

Alright, thanks for clarifying! But do you have a quote from them saying that just for reference? I must have missed it.

 

[Currawong]

Prior to the LCD-2s and HD-800s, to get better sound quality than a pair of HD-650s you had to buy a pair of discontinued Grado HP-1000s or Sony MDR-R10s at vastly greater prices than the current flagships cost. Now we have makers like Audeze and Hifiman who are bringing down their flagship technology (LCD-3 and HE-6) to under $1k and other companies like Oppo and Fostex are getting in on the game. I think that is great. 

 

[diamondears]

Again, try to put this into perspective.  So many Audeze fans get caught up in the fact that the LCD-2 has been surpassed by even more absurdly expensive headphones that they forget where it stands compared to just about every other headphone on the market.  

The LCD-2 *is* summit-fi.  It's $1000 (!!!) and when it came out it was one of the best cans you could buy.  For many people it's an end-game can.  Are there better and/or more expensive headphones out there?  Yup.  But not NEARLY as many worse/cheaper headphones.  Relative to the whole market, the LCD-2 is summit-fi in both price and sound.

Regardless, what I was saying in my previous post was that *I theorize* the sound of the EL-8 won't be at the level of the LCD-2 by design.  They cannot have something that sounds as good or better than the LCD-2, while being cheaper, without undercutting the market for the LCD-2.  Since they've flat out stated that the two aren't competing, it stands to reason that the EL-8 shouldn't sound as good.

If they hadn't stated that they weren't competing, I'd say they were purposely undercutting the LCD-2 to grab a larger market share.

+1. Great post. Given the deal they offered just recently (last month) on the LCD-2F Bamboo+amp (Geek?) combo for the same price of $999, I think they're purposely sacrificing LCD-2F for more sales.

They might incorporate them after the EL-8 is released but they would be silly to do it now. It took the changes in the LCDX 6 months to be added to the rest of the range. They should prove them in the EL-8 first. They also said they will be more transparent when they make changes in the future.

Looking at these 2 posts below... I do think its just different measuring now so it compares better with what the others are doing...

http://www.head-fi.org/t/738025/new-audeze-prototype-z/75#post_10973571
http://www.head-fi.org/t/509710/audeze-lcd-2-impressions-thread/3765#post_10800419

But if they have made changes, can I send in my 3F to have it updated?

But the difference is very huge. From 93 to 101dB/mW??? Plus I have hands-on experience listening to both LCD-2.2 (listed at 91dB/mW) and LCD-2F and have found the sensitivity ratings to be true. For perspective, at same volume dB to my ears, the LCD-2F is only louder from the LCD-2.2 by 2 clicks/levels at most with the iPhone 6. If it's really 101dB, the difference would have been around at least 5 clicks/levels.

Experts please correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[Uberclocked]

  Prior to the LCD-2s and HD-800s, to get better sound quality than a pair of HD-650s you had to buy a pair of discontinued Grado HP-1000s, Sony MDR-R10s, HE90s/HE60s, or B34t5 Pr05 at vastly greater prices than the current flagships cost. Now we have makers like Audeze and Hifiman who are bringing down their flagship technology (LCD-3 and HE-6) to under $1k and other companies like Oppo and Fostex are getting in on the game. I think that is great. 

FTFY
Once a higher tier is released by a manufacturer, their former flagship headphones stop becoming summit-fi (at least in my opinion).