[smodtactical]

All the impedance talk with the Atticus made me bring in my Tuba to work. High Z output is 35ohm which should in theory work well with the Atticus. I was using my MZ2 at work with a 2ohm OI and thought it synergized very well with the Atticus, as did the High Z output of the Midgard. But I wanted to really push the dampening factor down, hence the Tuba. I have to say the Atticus indeed opens up quite a bit with increasing OI. With the MZ2 I found the Atticus lively and controlled, and quite sweet sounding. But the Tuba somehow adds some impact to the bass while also giving it an airier top end. I'm sure the different amp configuration plays a role as well, beyond just the OI change. But this reminds me how good the Tuba plays with the Atticus.

When listening to classic rock like Journey, Rush, Queen, etc the Tuba is bringing more breath and treble presence. Don't Stop Believin' by Journey is a great example. When the chorus hits and they belt out "streetlights, people, don't stop believin!" there's proper presence in the vocals. The MZ2 pushes those vocals back a bit and isn't as breathy. It's a more natural presentation on the Tuba. And that bass! The Tuba's added impact does not make the Atticus more bassy somehow. It's more percussive but not as thick sounding. I think the overdampening comes into play here.

Besides the Atticus, i also brought the almighty Atrium Closed (AC). First time listening to it on the Tuba, which has been in mothballs for no good reason other than my stupidity. I thought the MZ2 would be the superior amp for my ZMF collection, but alas I'm having strong doubts. The AC/Tuba combo is insanely good. The AC's bass really opens up on it, with strong impact and a natural decay. Not too tight, but not boomy at all. And vocals with the Auteur suede pads....just plain sexual! I'm listening to Fleetwood Mac, sorry for that hahaha. Stevie's voice is one of the sexiest ever IMO. Listen to Dreams...

How much more detailed and airy is the AC over the atticus? I have the atticus and am considering AC.

 

[smodtactical]

This has been brought up in various online interviews and Zach's response has been that both Eikon and the OG Auteur were discontinued due to issues sourcing the original biocellulose driver used in both of those models. If you need to redesign around a new biocellulose driver you may as well design a new headphone (e.g. Auteur Classic with ADS, Atrium and Atrium Closed - which some are calling a "super Eikon")

Zach has also stated that ZMF has kept enough of the original driver stock on hand for servicing existing pairs if the owners should require it.
Now, how many is "enough" I cannot answer, but Zach and Bevin aren't ones to leave a customer hanging in the breeze. I'm continually amazed at how much effort they (and the ZMF team) put into customer service and simply making things right (under legitimate circumstances).

If an atrium is a super eikon... what headphone is a super atticus?

 

[Wes S]

If an atrium is a super eikon... what headphone is a super atticus?

Bokeh. Not exactly a direct replacement, but it's the closest thing in my opinion. I have only used my Atticus a handful of times since getting the Bokeh. The Bokeh take fun (what the Atticus do) to a whole new level, and it's easier to drive as well.

 

[smodtactical]

Bokeh. Not exactly a direct replacement, but it's the closest thing in my opinion. I have only used my Atticus a handful of times since getting the Bokeh. The Bokeh take fun (what the Atticus do) to a whole new level, and it's easier to drive as well.

Wow interesting. I thought bokeh wasn't meant to be in the same league as atticus. Cool.

 

[Wes S]

Wow interesting. I thought bokeh wasn't meant to be in the same league as atticus. Cool.

The Bokeh is actually taking the Atticus's spot in the lineup as the entry level closed back tuned for fun. That being said, the Atticus will still be available in the future through the custom shop.

I have both and love them both. They do react differently to amps, being they have different impedance and sensitivity, but both are on the warm side with excellent mids and slamming middbass.

 

[heliosphann]

Wow interesting. I thought bokeh wasn't meant to be in the same league as atticus. Cool.

The Bokeh is actually taking the Atticus's spot in the lineup as the entry level closed back tuned for fun. That being said, the Atticus will still be available in the future through the custom shop.

I have both and love them both. They do react differently to amps, being they have different impedance and sensitivity, but both are on the warm side with excellent mids and slamming middbass.

I think the Bokeh Closed and Atticus are more or less a side-grade. I've been listening to both a lot lately, and while they do share a similar sound, they have their own strengths/weaknesses.

The Bokeh is a much better entry headphone to new ZMF owners, with it's ease of drivability and fun, but well tuned sound. The Atticus is more of specialist, and can be pretty hard to dial in. However, when it has great system synergy, it's still delivers far above it's weight class. You can also tell it's held back technically by being an early design from Zach. But, at the same time that's what helps give it it's charm and lush sound.

 

[Wes S]

I think the Bokeh Closed and Atticus are more or less a side-grade. I've been listening to both a lot lately, and while they do share a similar sound, they have their own strengths/weaknesses.

The Bokeh is a much better entry headphone to new ZMF owners, with it's ease of drivability and fun, but well tuned sound. The Atticus is more of specialist, and can be pretty hard to dial in. However, when it has great system synergy, it's still delivers far above it's weight class. You can also tell it's held back technically by being an early design from Zach. But, at the same time that's what helps give it it's charm and lush sound.

I agree. If you put a gun to my head and told me I could only have one, it would be a tough call.

 

[smodtactical]

I agree. If you put a gun to my head and told me I could only have one, it would be a tough call.

Does bokeh get a benefit from ha 300 mk2 over a more basic amp ?

 

[Wes S]

Does bokeh get a benefit from ha 300 mk2 over a more basic amp ?

Yes, it does scale. However, it's not quite as dramatic a change as it is with the 300ohm headphones.

 

[robo24]

How much more detailed and airy is the AC over the atticus? I have the atticus and am considering AC.

Quite a bit. Very different headphone that is more neutral, has more sub-bass, less mid-bass, larger stage, more detail. You'll want both the Caldera & Bokeh suedes for them.
The Bokeh I was very surprised that I preferred it over both the Atticus and Eikon. Stage is similar but everything else I said about the AC compared to Atticus applies.
I actually have 2 AC now, the less hard wood is more airy and is brighter so far, but the harder wood still needs burn in. On lighter woods you get more of the Atticus type boomy bass, which is more tight and punchy on harder woods. It's the only ZMF I have 2 of (so far) because the wood density makes so much difference.

 

[JNKM]

Wow interesting. I thought bokeh wasn't meant to be in the same league as atticus. Cool.

Not to turn this into too much of a Rashomon situation, but Bokeh, to me, with all due respect, is not in the same league as the Atticus. I don't mean to discount anyone else's experience in saying this, as I'm most certainly in the minority here, but I just wanted to offer a slightly different perspective.

To me, the whole point of the Atticus -- and I'm specifically talking about listening with its stock Ori leather pads -- was its uncompromisingly bombastic, visceral, and fun midbass and its huge, thick, lush, romantic mids and vocals that did not sacrifice clarity, space, or nuance. It was an audiophile's guilty pleasure for modern genres (rock, pop, electronic, etc.), while also being able to do special things for other genres (acoustic, etc.). The case can be made for the Bokeh carrying the torch for the latter (thick, lush mids), and the hybrid pads bring even more liquidity and resolution to the midrange and vocals (at the cost of bass, of course), but the fun midbass is gone: it strives to be more neutral in its bass presentation all the way down -- even with its stock pads.

Curiously, with the stock pads, Bokeh sounded like a softer, mellower version of the Atticus (again, stock Ori leather pads). I think part of the reason for this has to do with the pads: the Ori leather pads are solid all the way around and have smaller ear openings, which not only traps bass energy but also gives transients a harder edge or initial attack, which translates to a livelier sound. The Bokeh pads are thinner, with much larger ear openings, and are perforated, which dissipates a lot of that energy, and the resulting sound is a lot more -- chill, laid back? I've never tried suede pads on the Atticus, but I imagine many people go for this kind of softer sound, especially if it means a more balanced frequency response curve (hence, why so many people use the Atticus with the suede Ori or Eikon pads). Also, I never tried the Ori or Eikon leather pads on the Bokeh -- it never crossed my mind to do so -- but I wonder now how that might have changed things (madness perhaps?).

All this to say: the Bokeh is a great headphone for all the reasons detailed by people above -- but for me, I wouldn't think of it (in stock form) as a true successor to the Atticus: the similarities are there in some ways, but it's very much its own animal (which, I suppose, is the point). When I tried to think of the Bokeh as a replacement for my Atticus (I could only keep one), I kept returning to and appreciating the Atticus more and more. It's difficult to unhear a lot of what makes that headphone special particularly when you feel another headphone is aspiring to do similar things in certain areas. If I had endless resources, though, I'm sure it would've found a place in my stable.

 

[smodtactical]

Not to turn this into too much of a Rashomon situation, but Bokeh, to me, with all due respect, is not in the same league as the Atticus. I don't mean to discount anyone else's experience in saying this, as I'm most certainly in the minority here, but I just wanted to offer a slightly different perspective.

To me, the whole point of the Atticus -- and I'm specifically talking about listening with its stock Ori leather pads -- was its uncompromisingly bombastic, visceral, and fun midbass and its huge, thick, lush, romantic mids and vocals that did not sacrifice clarity, space, or nuance. It was an audiophile's guilty pleasure for modern genres (rock, pop, electronic, etc.), while also being able to do special things for other genres (acoustic, etc.). The case can be made for the Bokeh carrying the torch for the latter (thick, lush mids), and the hybrid pads bring even more liquidity and resolution to the midrange and vocals (at the cost of bass, of course), but the fun midbass is gone: it strives to be more neutral in its bass presentation all the way down -- even with its stock pads.

Curiously, with the stock pads, Bokeh sounded like a softer, mellower version of the Atticus (again, stock Ori leather pads). I think part of the reason for this has to do with the pads: the Ori leather pads are solid all the way around and have smaller ear openings, which not only traps bass energy but also gives transients a harder edge or initial attack, which translates to a livelier sound. The Bokeh pads are thinner, with much larger ear openings, and are perforated, which dissipates a lot of that energy, and the resulting sound is a lot more -- chill, laid back? I've never tried suede pads on the Atticus, but I imagine many people go for this kind of softer sound, especially if it means a more balanced frequency response curve (hence, why so many people use the Atticus with the suede Ori or Eikon pads). Also, I never tried the Ori or Eikon leather pads on the Bokeh -- it never crossed my mind to do so -- but I wonder now how that might have changed things (madness perhaps?).

All this to say: the Bokeh is a great headphone for all the reasons detailed by people above -- but for me, I wouldn't think of it (in stock form) as a true successor to the Atticus: the similarities are there in some ways, but it's very much its own animal (which, I suppose, is the point). When I tried to think of the Bokeh as a replacement for my Atticus (I could only keep one), I kept returning to and appreciating the Atticus more and more. It's difficult to unhear a lot of what makes that headphone special particularly when you feel another headphone is aspiring to do similar things in certain areas. If I had endless resources, though, I'm sure it would've found a place in my stable.

Atticus = the king of darkness! (I say that in a positive way).

But my question is what truly takes Atticus to the next level besides a better chain ? I thought maybe thats atrium but seems thats more in the vein if Eikon.

 

[erics75]

How much more detailed and airy is the AC over the atticus? I have the atticus and am considering AC.

My comments refer to the AC with stock Caldera lambskin pads, and Atticus with stock Ori lambskin pads.

I find the AC noticeably more resolving of ultra fine detail vs the Atticus. The Atticus always resolved more than enough for me, but the AC can pull out finer detail and separate it for easier identification. I usually don't listen that analytically, but at times the AC forced me to as it was resolving things clearly that were a bit muddy/dull on the Atticus. But that's with very high quality audiophile recordings. With most music I listen to, that added resolution isn't really of much value. Crappy metal recordings are still crappy metal recordings. I do think the AC scales a bit more as well. My most resolving amp is my Stratus, and all my headphones seem clearer on it. But the AC definitely benefits more than the Atticus. That being said, the Atticus is amazing on the Stratus.

Airy is a tough one, I would not call either airy with stock pads. I think the Atticus might actually have just a hair more treble presence vs the AC, but it's not as smooth. But it's so close I'm not sure on that. Going back and forth with them, the only thing that really sticks out to me definitively is how much smoother the AC driver is up top. I wouldn't call the Atticus harsh in a vacuum, but in direct comparison IMO it's treble has a bit rougher of an edge, leading to just a bit more discomfort at higher volumes or longer sessions. But we're not talking a huge difference, and again, only in direct comparison. The Atticus is still IMO one of the least fatiguing and easiest listening sets ever.

What sets the AC apart from the Atticus IMO though is pad swapping. Honestly the only two sets of pads I like on the Atticus are the stock lamb Ori pads, and Eikon lamb pads. The suede Ori pads are decent as well, I just like how lamb sounds more than suede in general. But I have five pads I like quite a bit on the AC, and there are more to try. The stock Caldera pads (suede and lamb) are great, as are the BE2 lamb, Auteur suede, and Universe lamb. And the sound changes noticeably on each, but not in a bad way. The Atticus seems to be at it's best with the stock pads, and doesn't take to alternative pads as well (just my opinion!). But the AC transforms with pad swaps.

With the stock lamb pads the AC has thunderous bass, a neutral midrange, and soft treble but with good detail. Very Atticus like, but the key differences being the Atticus' midrange is more forward, and it's treble a bit more gravely sounding. Go to the stock suede pads and the AC becomes very balanced and linear. Very Auteur-like, with more forward mids, much more treble presence, and less boisterous bass. The Auteur solid suede split the stock pads nicely, displaying a nice blend of both pads, leaning more towards warmth, without giving up the bite and presence in the upper mids and treble. The BE2 cool things a bit but oddly seem to bring out more subbass vs the Auetur suede. I'd say it also sits in the middle of the two stock pads, with an quirkier but still enjoyable blend of the stock characteristics. The Bokeh protein pads are very similar to the stock lamb pads but give you a bit more bite up top, and mid bass punch. It's a bit more exciting and snappy, if that makes sense, but still sticks pretty close to the stock lamb sound overall. It's like hitting a loud button with them on, but without actually getting louder. Everything just seems a bit more aggressive and immediate.

I love the Atticus. It's been the constant in my lineup ever since I got one many years ago. So many have come and gone, and it remains. The AC has pulled me away from it. The AC is different, but for me personally, better. It does all the things the Atticus does so well, but better. I've been making an effort to even out my work rotation, where i do the bulk of my listening, giving the Atticus a more equal footing with the AC and Bokeh. But as much as i love it, i still lean towards the newer sets. That's not to say I don't love listening to my Atticus, i absolutely do. I just love the others just a bit more. Despite that though I've decided not to sell the Atticus. I was leaning towards it, but i just can't.

As others have mentioned, the Bokeh is a blast too. It's giving the AC a real fight for my top spot. I swear every day I try to rank them that ranking changes. One day it's Bokeh, the next it's AC. I love the Bokeh. It's not as resolving or polished/refined as the AC, but IMO it's just a bit more fun. With rock/metal the Bokeh is my drug of choice. But when more audiophile type music is called upon, the AC's refinement wins the day. Given how much cheaper the Bokeh is, IMO try grabbing a used one first and see how you like it. It might surprise you.

 

[robo24]

Atticus = the king of darkness! (I say that in a positive way).

But my question is what truly takes Atticus to the next level besides a better chain ? I thought maybe thats atrium but seems thats more in the vein if Eikon.

I guess that's just it. There is no Super Atticus and personally I'd love that, but at least it does scale well. The AC is certainly sort of a Super Eikon. Atticus was my first ZMF and I still love it, but I'd love it more being a bit more detailed. For a lot of music though it's still a sonic sweet spot.

 

[smodtactical]

My comments refer to the AC with stock Caldera lambskin pads, and Atticus with stock Ori lambskin pads.

I find the AC noticeably more resolving of ultra fine detail vs the Atticus. The Atticus always resolved more than enough for me, but the AC can pull out finer detail and separate it for easier identification. I usually don't listen that analytically, but at times the AC forced me to as it was resolving things clearly that were a bit muddy/dull on the Atticus. But that's with very high quality audiophile recordings. With most music I listen to, that added resolution isn't really of much value. Crappy metal recordings are still crappy metal recordings. I do think the AC scales a bit more as well. My most resolving amp is my Stratus, and all my headphones seem clearer on it. But the AC definitely benefits more than the Atticus. That being said, the Atticus is amazing on the Stratus.

Airy is a tough one, I would not call either airy with stock pads. I think the Atticus might actually have just a hair more treble presence vs the AC, but it's not as smooth. But it's so close I'm not sure on that. Going back and forth with them, the only thing that really sticks out to me definitively is how much smoother the AC driver is up top. I wouldn't call the Atticus harsh in a vacuum, but in direct comparison IMO it's treble has a bit rougher of an edge, leading to just a bit more discomfort at higher volumes or longer sessions. But we're not talking a huge difference, and again, only in direct comparison. The Atticus is still IMO one of the least fatiguing and easiest listening sets ever.

What sets the AC apart from the Atticus IMO though is pad swapping. Honestly the only two sets of pads I like on the Atticus are the stock lamb Ori pads, and Eikon lamb pads. The suede Ori pads are decent as well, I just like how lamb sounds more than suede in general. But I have five pads I like quite a bit on the AC, and there are more to try. The stock Caldera pads (suede and lamb) are great, as are the BE2 lamb, Auteur suede, and Universe lamb. And the sound changes noticeably on each, but not in a bad way. The Atticus seems to be at it's best with the stock pads, and doesn't take to alternative pads as well (just my opinion!). But the AC transforms with pad swaps.

With the stock lamb pads the AC has thunderous bass, a neutral midrange, and soft treble but with good detail. Very Atticus like, but the key differences being the Atticus' midrange is more forward, and it's treble a bit more gravely sounding. Go to the stock suede pads and the AC becomes very balanced and linear. Very Auteur-like, with more forward mids, much more treble presence, and less boisterous bass. The Auteur solid suede split the stock pads nicely, displaying a nice blend of both pads, leaning more towards warmth, without giving up the bite and presence in the upper mids and treble. The BE2 cool things a bit but oddly seem to bring out more subbass vs the Auetur suede. I'd say it also sits in the middle of the two stock pads, with an quirkier but still enjoyable blend of the stock characteristics. The Bokeh protein pads are very similar to the stock lamb pads but give you a bit more bite up top, and mid bass punch. It's a bit more exciting and snappy, if that makes sense, but still sticks pretty close to the stock lamb sound overall. It's like hitting a loud button with them on, but without actually getting louder. Everything just seems a bit more aggressive and immediate.

I love the Atticus. It's been the constant in my lineup ever since I got one many years ago. So many have come and gone, and it remains. The AC has pulled me away from it. The AC is different, but for me personally, better. It does all the things the Atticus does so well, but better. I've been making an effort to even out my work rotation, where i do the bulk of my listening, giving the Atticus a more equal footing with the AC and Bokeh. But as much as i love it, i still lean towards the newer sets. That's not to say I don't love listening to my Atticus, i absolutely do. I just love the others just a bit more. Despite that though I've decided not to sell the Atticus. I was leaning towards it, but i just can't.

As others have mentioned, the Bokeh is a blast too. It's giving the AC a real fight for my top spot. I swear every day I try to rank them that ranking changes. One day it's Bokeh, the next it's AC. I love the Bokeh. It's not as resolving or polished/refined as the AC, but IMO it's just a bit more fun. With rock/metal the Bokeh is my drug of choice. But when more audiophile type music is called upon, the AC's refinement wins the day. Given how much cheaper the Bokeh is, IMO try grabbing a used one first and see how you like it. It might surprise you.

Masterful write up, thanks.

What do you like about bokeh over atticus ?