Anyone else tired of 'typical' headphone recommendation requests ?

[Uncle Erik]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaloS /img/forum/go_quote.gif I was hoping someone would say exactly this. Maybe FAQ is not the right word, but a "Introduction & Guide" can be written objectively. Opinions about what is good and what is not can be left to review and discussion threads, but there is lots of information that is missing from the posts we are discussing here - that is merely matter of "what does this thing do." (Ever seen posts like: What does a DAC do? Do I need it? How do I use it? - I actually did not know at first either - and while it is totally possible to figure it out, it takes more work than it should).

Yes, exactly!

I'm thinking about a library/Wiki where you could put up a photo tutorial for connecting a DAC to a computer, that sort of thing. I can't imagine that being controversial, it would help lots of people and it would clear away unnecessary discussions.

Maybe set up a library type of page and submit guides to the mods for approval and posting. I know that means more work for them (and they do a lot behind the scenes) but it might also make their jobs easier with fewer threads. It would also allow for really comprehensive guides - like a thorough build of a CMoy with instructions and info at every step. That sort of thing is tough to do in a thread, and then the thread will eventually get buried.

I really think a library/Wiki of information would be much more helpful than stickies or even a FAQ. I think a number of members would step up with contributions, too. Give it a few years, and it'd fill up with useful information. All the "best cans for rock" threads can stay in the forums.

 

[catscratch]

Quote:

Originally Posted by HD_Dude /img/forum/go_quote.gif But still, rather than seeing this place like a bunch of old men on their porches...try seeing it as a University, which in many ways it is. Full of professors...who have the knowledge. Full of students who want to learn. And full of the search for ways to connect the two. If a student asks a question that's been asked a hundred thousand times? That's learning. It's because it's a universal question...that occured to a hundred thousand students. Let them ask! It's a poor University that responds...'That question has been asked before, so many times...Damn you. Go find your answer in the library. We are too important, too busy and too above you...to even read your question without offense. Fact is, let's make rules, so we professors aren't bothered by this drivel any more.''

I think, at least to continue your university analogy, that the situation right now isn't one of a student getting that kind of a response from professors, but a student getting a few responses from professors but mostly a lot of responses from other students, some of which are correct, many of which are wrong, and many more of which don't even answer the question to begin with.

It's like someone asking "what's 2 + 2" and then getting the responses "3", "4", "5", "7", "rabbits", "sausage", "5 miles" and "23 degrees". And there's no way for the student to tell who's right, and who's a professor to begin with.

What this teaches them is not only that "2 + 2 = sausage", but also that it's ok to simply mouth off whatever the heck they want.

Meanwhile, the professors are throwing their hands up in desperation and saying "stop!" and are getting flak for it, because somehow they're being seen as being against the students. It's small wonder then that they either leave, or stay and become increasingly bitter simply through trying to maintain the proper atmosphere.

And at the same time, newer students come in but can't get at any kind of meaningful information thanks to the endless noise of everyone yelling "2 + 2 = Daffy Duck!" and ask the same legitimate question, to pretty much the same effect.

However, Pabbi1 makes a very good point. This whole analogy fails because we're not professors that are paid to teach, and beginners are not students that pay to learn. Newbies are not owed anything, and are receiving help that others are giving voluntarily, and given the current situation, often at their own detriment and cost measured in frustration and time, and sometimes money.

So, attitudes need to adjust to reflect that reality. And I'm not asking for any undue worship but for respect, and not only towards the older members but towards the community as a whole. People need to actually put in some thought and respect into their posts, and when they don't, they need to be told to stop. People need to respect the forum content that they themselves create, otherwise it will never improve, and this needs to be done not only by a select few that are committed to it, but by everyone involved. We all contribute to this community in our different ways. And the whole FAQ trip I'm on is simply a disciplinary measure to get people to stop posting crap that only hurts the whole community. It, or something like it, will simply be used to dial down the volume of noise and crack down on the loudest offenders.

 

[vcoheda]

that type of moderation (or even oversight by those who take it upon themselves) will never happen in a place of this size - just not practical. in a smaller forum with fewer created threads, fewer posts and members, it may be possible. but here, threads are buried as quickly as they are created. in a sense, that is moderation itself. the better threads get bumped often; the rest are never seen again. things sort themselves out in the end.

 

[achristilaw]

We have so many newbie equipment recommendation posts...BECAUSE we have so many newbie equipment recommendation posts..

I'll explain....your new to the forum and you want to get your feet wet. You look about, and wanting to fit in, you keep your first outing a safe one.

And what are most other newbies doing??...Asking for headphone, amp and source recommendations.

I'll respond if they are approached with reason and have some explanation of other equipment used and music likes etc.

It's a theory...but a "sound" one...

 

[boomana]

vocheda, no on here is talking about moderation. I think the point that many of us are trying to make is that we, as members, need to think before posting, and as members (not moderators, not enforcers) can ask that we each be more conscious of the content we put out there for the benefit of all. What's the harm in that?

 

[smeggy]

nothing, as long as we can all agree that 2 + 2 = cantaloupe. Everything else is negotiable.

 

[cyberidd]

Personally, I really like the community atmosphere here at head-fi. There is information on just about anything headphone and by either searching or asking the right questions you can get some good (although varied) answers. I believe that most of the people who are posting the "2+2=Superman" recommendations are doing it to TRY to benefit the community. I think that new head-fiers can tell that there is a sort of a "bond" between head-fiers who have been around for a while, and they want to become a part of that. The easiest way to do that would be to make intelligent and well backed comments about equipment (at least in their minds). Unfortunately as many newbies have not experienced much in the way of gear, the only way to do that is hearsay. Fortunately they feel they have a very good grasp of what headphones sound like, and which should be recommended for what purpose since they have read countless other threads making the same suggestions. Now, backed by this "knowledge" they make their suggestion. Of course if all the information they read taught them that 2+2=pizza pops, thats the answer they think is right, and (trying to be helpful) pass on to the next newbie they meet. The problem is that they don't understand the possible misinformation and harm they could be causing by simply trying to help others as they have seen others do in other threads. In short, I think it is just a misplaced attempt to be helpful which in and of its self is not bad IMHO, its just the newbies wanting to fit in with the rest of the crowd.

 

[achristilaw]

Quote:

Originally Posted by smeggy /img/forum/go_quote.gif nothing, as long as we can all agree that 2 + 2 = cantaloupe. Everything else is negotiable.

2+2= Dr. Pepper and Dr. Pepper+2= Cantaloupe

 

[cyberidd]

Quote:

Originally Posted by smeggy /img/forum/go_quote.gif nothing, as long as we can all agree that 2 + 2 = cantaloupe. Everything else is negotiable.

You're wrong, 2+2 definately equals choochoo train.

(and this thread has just been derailed! (pun intended))

 

[smeggy]

You are all off my Christmas list.

 

[achristilaw]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cyberidd /img/forum/go_quote.gif You're wrong, 2+2 definately equals choochoo train. (and this thread has just been derailed! (pun intended))

Ain't that the 4-4-2.....

 

[vcoheda]

Quote:

Originally Posted by boomana /img/forum/go_quote.gif vocheda, no on here is talking about moderation. I think the point that many of us are trying to make is that we, as members, need to think before posting, and as members (not moderators, not enforcers) can ask that we each be more conscious of the content we put out there for the benefit of all. What's the harm in that?

no harm.

just seems like wishful thinking. that's all. what should we do. make a sticky that says "don't make stupid posts," which is a great idea except that no one will even read it because there are too many stickies as it is and even if there were fewer, people still wouldn't read it due to carelessness, stupidity and general thoughtlessness. this thread is well intentioned but like all threads in this massive place will be buried and forgotten by tomorrow or the next day if lucky. and it's probably being read mostly by people who are not the problem anyway. what you suggest - changing the atmosphere or attitude/approach of posters - is a type of moderation, at least that is the only way it could be accomplished, and would take a sustained effort by groups of individuals over a long period of time to work.

 

[catscratch]

Quote:

Originally Posted by boomana /img/forum/go_quote.gif vocheda, no on here is talking about moderation. I think the point that many of us are trying to make is that we, as members, need to think before posting, and as members (not moderators, not enforcers) can ask that we each be more conscious of the content we put out there for the benefit of all. What's the harm in that?

Exactly. If we really do want this change to go through, we will need to do it ourselves. I'm not playing the moderator angle, it is simply something that will have to be done by many members in the community until it snowballs and becomes the norm. We have to use the same effect that has deteriorated content quality, but in the other direction.

The only place we may need moderator support is in dealing with the troublemakers, but that will come later. First, we need to do something, whatever that something may be, to set a precedent for improving forum content, and make that precedent spread.

Quote:

Originally Posted by vcoheda /img/forum/go_quote.gif the better threads get bumped often; the rest are never seen again. things sort themselves out in the end.

Clearly, things don't sort themselves out in the end because we're in the situation that we're in. Forum content is rubbish for the most part and the noise is drowning the signal out.

I honestly think that this decline should have been prevented when it was happening, around 2006. I don't remember things in the forum well enough by then but there already were some people making posts to this effect and they did receive some flak (and I only remember that is because I was one of them).

Incidentally, most people that expressed these thoughts back then have left, and as a result we have lost a lot of the very people that helped build the popularity of this place, and now we are worse off in terms of resources we have to work with even though we're far more popular. Even worse, we now have to go against the grain to effect positive change, rather preventing a virulent negative change while it's in its formative stages.

But, I also think that this process was an inevitable by-product of becoming successful, and was largely the result of a gradual generation change at head-fi (generation here not directly referring to poster age but rather poster background and dedication to the hobby). From passionate and knowledgeable enthusiasts backed by experts and a few small manufacturers, we went to a community of some experts and enthusiasts but mostly techies that are less mature and generally less committed to the community and the quality of its content - and manufacturers some of which are less than ethical because they realize that they can get away with it. Basically, we're in the mediocrity stage and are paying the price for being successful, and we will only keep sliding even more into mediocrity until every ounce of quality content is drowned out by our self-generated noise. And by and large there will be no dedicated and experienced members left at all.

I don't want to see that, which is why I'm making some noise to this effect.

 

[achristilaw]

I know the feeling...If I see asked one more Sennheiser Amp recommendation thread..I'll toss my choo-choo!~~~~!

What upsets me more...........People NEVER having heard the equipment, wanting to chime in and offer the stellar, go to recommendation. ACTING as if it's resting on they're head as they are typing. They Never FRICKIN' heard it...and they say it's the best thing since condoms. GROUP SLAP (smack)!!!

 

[cyberidd]

^ I maintain that it is mostly newbies trying to help others in the community to the best of their vicariously attained knowledge.