[Yan Yan]

I've been looking for an appropriate amp to match my AKG K702 for a while.
My current DAC/Amp is Teac UD-503 which provides a quite cold, detailed sound with slightly weak bass.
It could be much satisfying if the sound could become a bit warmer while the budget is around 500USD.

Schiit Asgard/Valhalla/Lyr seem to be decent choices for their high output power and warm sound (not the machine).
The latest AKG K1500, which is exactly the same as Arcam rHead, is also quite attractive to me since it's recommended by AKG. Since Arcam is not a popular brand in Taiwan, I'm curious about its performance comparing to the products from Schiit.

Is there any other recommended Amp? Looking forward to your response.

 

[arachnidsGrip]

A Fiio E10k would be enough, spending more money on an amp for K702 would be wasteful

 

[Monsterzero]

The Audio GD R2R-11 works well with the K701/702. It has a warm sound to it. It is an amp/DAC and not sure if they sell just an amp that is comparable,but for the price its one of the better bang for the buck products out there.

 

[Me x3]

I like the FiiO A5 more than the amp section on the E10K for the AKG K702.
FiiO A5 has a more impactful and smother nature, more along the lines of my former Asgard 2.
The Asgard 2 is a nice pairing too, but I've found it to be more forward in the upper midrange relative to the A5.
Since K702 is already forward in the upper midrange I've prefered the A5 as I've found the resulting sound to be more effortless.
You can also read about Violectric and Burson offerings in your price range. Violectric is known for providing a warmer character.
The Valhalla 2 is not an ideal pairing for low impedance, low sensitivity headphones like the K702. The Lyr3 can drive the K702 with ease.

 

[arachnidsGrip]

U right, a fiio A5 would be better imo

 

[ProtegeManiac]

Schiit Asgard/Valhalla/Lyr seem to be decent choices for their high output power and warm sound...

The Valhalla is an OTL amp. Given its high output impedance, even though it's low for an OTL, it can EQ the sound and not to the direction you'd want. The current performance of an OTL amp is also one of the weaknesses of that amp design, so much so that it delivers peak power at 300ohms. Even its 600ohm output is higher than its 32ohm output, and given the AKG's relatively low sensitivity, at best it might EQ the sound to make the bass louder, which does not exactly equate to clean and effortless bass reproduction considering that OTL amps' damping factor is hampered by the output impedance.

(not the machine)

What do you mean by "not the machine?"

The latest AKG K1500, which is exactly the same as Arcam rHead, is also quite attractive to me since it's recommended by AKG. Since Arcam is not a popular brand in Taiwan, I'm curious about its performance comparing to the products from Schiit.

Think of it as a slightly better Asgard. Whether the differences in the reviews justify the additional cost is up to you. Personally, yeah, sure, if I can easily spend the extra money without having to cheap out on something else, like food or other hobbies.

It could be much satisfying if the sound could become a bit warmer while the budget is around 500USD.

Heed CanAmp but they're not that easy to find, though if I remember correctly the regional distributor was in Taipei.

 

[Yan Yan]

The Audio GD R2R-11 works well with the K701/702. It has a warm sound to it. It is an amp/DAC and not sure if they sell just an amp that is comparable,but for the price its one of the better bang for the buck products out there.

Since I already have my UD-503, I prefer a pure amp rather than a DAC that comes with an amp.

I like the FiiO A5 more than the amp section on the E10K for the AKG K702.
FiiO A5 has a more impactful and smother nature, more along the lines of my former Asgard 2.

I'm quite surprised that such a small, portable amp would be recommended.
Forums in Taiwan usually consider AKG 700 series require great current output and control.
I'm not rating a product with its size, but Fiio A5 has never been on my list.

You can also read about Violectric and Burson offerings in your price range. Violectric is known for providing a warmer character.
The Valhalla 2 is not an ideal pairing for low impedance, low sensitivity headphones like the K702. The Lyr3 can drive the K702 with ease.

Lake People series from Violectric is well recommended to match AKG headphones.
I would try G103-P and see whether it is suitable or not. Thanks a lot.

The Valhalla is an OTL amp. Given its high output impedance, even though it's low for an OTL, it can EQ the sound and not to the direction you'd want. The current performance of an OTL amp is also one of the weaknesses of that amp design, so much so that it delivers peak power at 300ohms. Even its 600ohm output is higher than its 32ohm output, and given the AKG's relatively low sensitivity, at best it might EQ the sound to make the bass louder, which does not exactly equate to clean and effortless bass reproduction considering that OTL amps' damping factor is hampered by the output impedance.

Thanks a lot for your detailed reply. According to your description, Valhalla is definitely not a proper choice for me.
Though I said that I'm looking for an amp with a warm voice base, I dislike headphones with strong bass.

What do you mean by "not the machine?"

Just making fun of the astonishing temperature of Schiit series.

Heed CanAmp but they're not that easy to find, though if I remember correctly the regional distributor was in Taipei.

I would definitely go look for it.

 

[Me x3]

I'm quite surprised that such a small, portable amp would be recommended.
Forums in Taiwan usually consider AKG 700 series require great current output and control.
I'm not rating a product with its size, but Fiio A5 has never been on my list.

Yes, the AKG K7-series is quite power hungry because of its low impedance and low sensitivity, but the A5 is a compact powerhouse.
It has way more power than needed for the K7-series and also very low output impedance for great damping factor and control.

 

[ProtegeManiac]

Thanks a lot for your detailed reply. According to your description, Valhalla is definitely not a proper choice for me.
Though I said that I'm looking for an amp with a warm voice base, I dislike headphones with strong bass.

Might be better to just get a different headphone first if you want the vocals warmer, ie, there's barely a dip in the 1000hz to 2000hz range and everything above 2000hz is rolled off gently so you don't get peaks in the treble that mess up female vocals or apply auditory masking than trying out amps where you can't just use an OTL amp that is deliberately going to apply an EQ curve like that and make some headphones warmer by comparison with other amps.

Not that no other amps will make the vocals richer but it's like how you have to strain hard to hear for example the difference between a Marantz amplifier and a NAD amplifier, with the difference being a slightly sweeter midrange on the Marantz, something that you won't hear unless you're in a very quiet room cranking up both amps.

So very generally while I'll consider a Meier Jazz FF, Violectric V200, or Audio GD NFB-11 over say a Schiit Magni or Jotunheim or even the Lyr, or the O2, etc, even if the smoother midrange is one of the reasons why, it you deliberately want a much warmer midrange than just "I want the bare minimum of pikes in my ears even on an HD600 with a 3500hz peak," you're already using the amplifier as an equalizer at that point, which it isn't and not supposed to be.

Just making fun of the astonishing temperature of Schiit series.

Errr we don't really refer to audio hardware as machines save for music servers, which of course are closer to computers; even TTs with all their mechanical parts don't get to be called that.

Also it's only really the Asgard that gets that hot since it runs full Class A in that small chassis, and the Valhalla and Lyr have the tubes sticking outside so the heat doesn't accumulate inside the case. Amps like the GIlmore Lite also run full Class A in a small chassis and can get nearly as hot, just that this one did not get the same sales volume (they're mostly popular critically; it's like getting an Oscars without dominating the box office) much less from people who've never had or been around Class A amps before (I've been in a room with two Class A monoblocs running speakers and the A/C was just barely working for that room - 16C setting but minimum fan to keep noise down) or are just getting into audio.

It's like how Rockford Fosgate amps that had a lot of fins got called "BBQ" because they look like a grill pan and ran a lot of Class A-bias (despite ultimately running Class A/B), cost less, and had a lot of power, so a lot of people even those who are more into adding bass than outright low THD+N bought them, but at the time what would really be laughable in terms of heat output and particularly vs wattage output would be the 15w to 25w full Class A Soundstream amplifiers.

 

[Yan Yan]

Yes, the AKG K7-series is quite power hungry because of its low impedance and low sensitivity, but the A5 is a compact powerhouse.
It has way more power than needed for the K7-series and also very low output impedance for great damping factor and control.

I would definitely try it out if possible.

Not that no other amps will make the vocals richer but it's like how you have to strain hard to hear for example the difference between a Marantz amplifier and a NAD amplifier, with the difference being a slightly sweeter midrange on the Marantz, something that you won't hear unless you're in a very quiet room cranking up both amps.

So very generally while I'll consider a Meier Jazz FF, Violectric V200, or Audio GD NFB-11 over say a Schiit Magni or Jotunheim or even the Lyr, or the O2, etc, even if the smoother midrange is one of the reasons why, it you deliberately want a much warmer midrange than just "I want the bare minimum of pikes in my ears even on an HD600 with a 3500hz peak," you're already using the amplifier as an equalizer at that point, which it isn't and not supposed to be.

I do enjoy the clean, chill vocal of my K702 a lot, so switching to another headphone isn't my current consideration.
I haven't tried out much amps and that's why I might be overestimating the effect of amps on the voice.
I'm just looking for an qualified amp with warmer vocal comparing to product at the same price, not trying to convert my K702 into a bass monster like HE-500.

As your words, I might be trying to use amp as an equalizer, but I don't consider it incorrect.
Each part of a system has its own frequency response and distortion. However, I think the most important thing is whether the combination touches us or not.
For example, people would change the headphone wires of IEMs to modify their sound.

Errr we don't really refer to audio hardware as machines save for music servers, which of course are closer to computers; even TTs with all their mechanical parts don't get to be called that.

Also it's only really the Asgard that gets that hot since it runs full Class A in that small chassis, and the Valhalla and Lyr have the tubes sticking outside so the heat doesn't accumulate inside the case. Amps like the GIlmore Lite also run full Class A in a small chassis and can get nearly as hot, just that this one did not get the same sales volume (they're mostly popular critically; it's like getting an Oscars without dominating the box office) much less from people who've never had or been around Class A amps before (I've been in a room with two Class A monoblocs running speakers and the A/C was just barely working for that room - 16C setting but minimum fan to keep noise down) or are just getting into audio.

It's like how Rockford Fosgate amps that had a lot of fins got called "BBQ" because they look like a grill pan and ran a lot of Class A-bias (despite ultimately running Class A/B), cost less, and had a lot of power, so a lot of people even those who are more into adding bass than outright low THD+N bought them, but at the time what would really be laughable in terms of heat output and particularly vs wattage output would be the 15w to 25w full Class A Soundstream amplifiers.

I believe that this is me making a mistake on using vocabulary, LOL.
At first, I was one step away from ordering a Valhalla directly from Schiit before I read some user reviews.
From the reviews I read, products from Schiit including Valhalla, Lyr do run at higher temperature even comparing to other amps which leads to slight distortion. (I'm not sure about the distortion since I own neither Valhalla nor Lyr.)

I do appreciate your reply a lot. I looked for the Heed CanAmp and found less information. Is there any other amp recommended to fit my headphone?

 

[ProtegeManiac]

I do enjoy the clean, chill vocal of my K702 a lot, so switching to another headphone isn't my current consideration.
I haven't tried out much amps and that's why I might be overestimating the effect of amps on the voice.
I'm just looking for an qualified amp with warmer vocal comparing to product at the same price, not trying to convert my K702 into a bass monster like HE-500.

Bass Monster vs no bass aren't your only options when I mentioned using the amp as an equalizer.

And neither am I saying that there are absolutely no differences between amps.

What I am saying is that the primary goal of the amplifier is precisely to not modify the sound, ie, amplify the sound without adding (audible) noise and distortion. This is why it's called an amplifier instead of something like a warmifying boombasticator sugar enfuser. Basically, all the amp does in changing the sound primarily is to get to a higher output level without distorting or clippingand without adding noise; the secondary job is just putting that final polish in the sound so that for example that last bit of sharpness in the sound won't be there or at least not make a headphone that has some peaks in the response that an amp could otherwise exacerbate.

Basically, don't expect the amp to drastically change the sound, and that goes beyond just turning it into a "bass monster."

Think of it in other terms. If the amp's effect on the sound is like a whetstone, using it like an EQ is like putting a knife on a 320grit stone at a different angle than the edge it has to reprofile it; ideally it should just be like an 8000grit to smooth out any remaining microscopic jagged bits of metal still left on the edge. because if you stop at 1000grit, the knife might be sharp, but the edge is still kind of rough that even a pull cut won't have it go through paper (let alone tomatoes or raw fish) smoothly.

And even if you don't expect it to be like an EQ as described here, the thing is you still have to be aware that what you're asking for is either going to be as excessive, or possiblyitually inaudible to you and worse, by your standards, disproportionate to what you'd spend to get that little bit of improvement. I can tell you that if you really wanted that improvement in the vocals to try a Violectric V200, or maybe a Meier Jazz FF, or heck, a WooAudio WA6se with the upgraded tubes, but even if you can easily hear the difference, would you consider the cost worth it? You have to be aware of that.

I believe that this is me making a mistake on using vocabulary, LOL.
At first, I was one step away from ordering a Valhalla directly from Schiit before I read some user reviews.
From the reviews I read, products from Schiit including Valhalla, Lyr do run at higher temperature even comparing to other amps which leads to slight distortion. (I'm not sure about the distortion since I own neither Valhalla nor Lyr.

I'm not sure I understand how THD and temperature are related. AFAIK either the tube is too cold to work properly or it's too hot you're going to break it.

Maybe you misunderstand what they meant about Class A/B topology where if the headphone or speaker needs enough power the amp switches over to Class B operation. So listening to an HE400S hooked up to a Lyr3 for example will at moderate levels very likely have it stay in Class A operation, but switch to a harder to drive headphone either by lower sensitivity or very low impedance and high current requirements, and the Lyr3 will run in Class B to remain stable.

I do appreciate your reply a lot. I looked for the Heed CanAmp and found less information. Is there any other amp recommended to fit my headphone?

If you're looking to warm up the vocals, very likely not without risks with OTL amps.

If you just expect it to be more of not exacerbating the treble as much as what you're using now, maybe try the Meier Jazz FF.

If you can spend more, maybe the Violectric V200 or Burson Soloist.