[warriorpoet]

Surface area in BAs is not nearly as important as with DDs. In DDs you absolutely need surface area to aid with things like modal breakup, as well as messing around with diaphragm stiffness and material composition (something Sony is incredibly good at, of course). I’m not exactly 100% sure why BAs are so much better at detail retrieval than DDs, but I can speculate that it’s down to diaphragm lightness and the way the driving pin concept works in comparison to the way the voice coil in a dynamic driver works.

That sounds an awful lot like moving mass to me...

 

[BassicScience]

The treble is where things get wonky. I have not a fraction of a clue what on earth is treble tuning is supposed to be aiming for, but it isn’t good. They seem to have recessed the lower treble and boosted the mid treble with little extension to go with it. This leaves us with particularly lacking stick impact and copious, if not overbearing, amounts of crash and ring, and only a little bit of glimmer with subpar decay. Gorguts’ Obscura has such a strange cymbal tonality, where you have far too much mid treble but not enough lower treble to back it up. This kind of mid-treble oriented tuning gets real fatiguing, real fast. PiL’s Albatross had me wincing at the cymbalwork. Maybe I’m just complaining about something most people wouldn’t care about but I definitely find it noticeable. It’s a treble tonality which I simply can’t appreciate very much.

Listening just now to both Albatross and Obscura on a known high fidelity setup, I can state unequivocally that the cymbal sound on both tracks (as recorded) is crap. On the PiL track, the cymbals sound splashy and digital. It's hard to describe their sound on Obscura since the whole thing is so heavily processed. My point here is that the cymbals on either of the tracks is entirely likely to sound better on a transducer that isn't accurate. For judging cymbal tone, I prefer any number of acoustic jazz records (often recorded live). I'm not saying your preferences are wrong (for you), but based on the material you're using to make judgments, I'm having a hard time putting a lot of stock in your ratings. OTOH, they're fun to read. Cheers.

 

[aminus]

On the PiL track, the cymbals sound splashy and digital.

Ironic description considering that album was recorded entirely on tape.

It's hard to describe their sound on Obscura since the whole thing is so heavily processed.

As it should be. I mean, it's a metal record.

the cymbals on either of the tracks is entirely likely to sound better on a transducer that isn't accurate.

Here's your problem: You're assuming I don't know how these albums are supposed to sound. I've heard these tracks on so many IEMs and headphones that I lost count ages ago. I know when they sound accurate and when they don't. And yes, they might sound more pleasing on an inaccurate transducer, but in the case of the FH7, it's neither accurate or pleasing. And that's not to say that those are the only two tracks that I tried on the FH7, I sat there for an hour and a half listening to my usual group of demo tracks and making notes. Those two songs are the ones that stood out as exceptionally bad and unusual to me. So I'm not even sure what you're trying to criticize, because you're off the mark.

 

[pstickne]

I don't understand why these companies are making hybrid. Many BA drivers are able to produce good quality bass now a days.

No “fun whump” feeling to my K10UA (10BA) bass vs several DD/hybrid IEMs, although K10 is relatively ‘bass tuned’. (I’m not a fan of the tuning though - too much low-bass leaving the bass feeling compressed, like a steep cliff.)

Maybe with some of the vented BA designs, which I’ve not tried. However, standard BA is .. standard.

 

[BassicScience]

Ironic description considering that album was recorded entirely on tape.

As it should be. I mean, it's a metal record.

Here's your problem: You're assuming I don't know how these albums are supposed to sound. I've heard these tracks on so many IEMs and headphones that I lost count ages ago. I know when they sound accurate and when they don't. And yes, they might sound more pleasing on an inaccurate transducer, but in the case of the FH7, it's neither accurate or pleasing. And that's not to say that those are the only two tracks that I tried on the FH7, I sat there for an hour and a half listening to my usual group of demo tracks and making notes. Those two songs are the ones that stood out as exceptionally bad and unusual to me. So I'm not even sure what you're trying to criticize, because you're off the mark.

Not ironic at all considering neither of us is listening to the tape, but rather a (crappy) transfer to PCM.

I'm not making an aesthetic judgment about the sound of Obscura (although unlike PiL, it's not of interest to me musically), just noting that you have zero credibility in making the claim that you know how anything that's so heavily processed should sound (unless you were at the sessions).

I'm not trying to defend the FH7. I've never heard it and probably never will. It may be total crap. I just find your test material of dubious value in reaching the conclusion you did. But who really cares? It's your thread. I'm out................................

 

[aminus]

Not ironic at all considering neither of us is listening to the tape, but rather a (crappy) transfer to PCM.

That’s doubly ironic considering I so happen to have the DSD remaster of the release from 2015 as my definitive version of it.

just noting that you have zero credibility in making the claim that you know how anything that's so heavily processed should sound

Maybe I don’t. But what I do know is that whatever I heard on the FH7 isn’t how the track has sounded on any other transducer. So the case here is either the FH7 is supremely accurate and the dozens of headphones I’ve tried are really all bad representations of it, or the FH7 just has a bad tweeter and I’m just using whatever songs it sounds especially bad on to illustrate the point. I dunno.

I just find your test material of dubious value in reaching the conclusion you did.

As mentioned, my test material is pretty much every track I’ve repeated throughout every transducer I’ve written on for consistency. And I know I sound super defensive and obnoxious here with how I’m reacting to the criticism (which I do apologize for since there’s no real other way to convey this next point) but if you’re going to criticize me, at least do recognize that whatever tracks I’m mentioning as reference points to make a statement aren’t the only reference points I’m using. It’s a conclusion formed from the entire listening session, conveyed by noteworthy songs I think explain my point of view the best.

 

[papa_mia]

64 Noir

Score: 2/10

Bruh...

 

[BassicScience]

That’s doubly ironic considering I so happen to have the DSD remaster of the release from 2015 as my definitive version of it.

Maybe I don’t. But what I do know is that whatever I heard on the FH7 isn’t how the track has sounded on any other transducer. So the case here is either the FH7 is supremely accurate and the dozens of headphones I’ve tried are really all bad representations of it, or the FH7 just has a bad tweeter and I’m just using whatever songs it sounds especially bad on to illustrate the point. I dunno.

As mentioned, my test material is pretty much every track I’ve repeated throughout every transducer I’ve written on for consistency. And I know I sound super defensive and obnoxious here with how I’m reacting to the criticism (which I do apologize for since there’s no real other way to convey this next point) but if you’re going to criticize me, at least do recognize that whatever tracks I’m mentioning as reference points to make a statement aren’t the only reference points I’m using. It’s a conclusion formed from the entire listening session, conveyed by noteworthy songs I think explain my point of view the best.

DSD releases are all over the map sonically. In many cases they sound worse than their PCM counterparts. I haven't heard the PiL SACDs, but I hope they're better than the "remastered" CDs from several years ago, which were well-nigh indistinguishable from the original releases to my ears. I got burned on the terrible Roxy Music and VdGG SHM-SACDs from a few years back, and since have refused to spend money on SACD anymore. But I digress.

I can totally believe that you are correct in your assessment of the FH7's treble quality. My point was that the examples you chose to publish didn't convince me (by themselves). Sorry if you took any of my comments personally. They weren't intended that way.

 

[aminus]

DSD releases are all over the map sonically. In many cases they sound worse than their PCM counterparts. I haven't heard the PiL SACDs, but I hope they're better than the "remastered" CDs from several years ago, which were well-nigh indistinguishable from the original releases to my ears. I got burned on the terrible Roxy Music and VdGG SHM-SACDs from a few years back, and since have refused to spend money on SACD anymore. But I digress.

I’m not big into the whole PCM vs DSD war but generally speaking if a release’s best version is an SACD, I’ll grab the DSD rip of it. And I do think the PiL SACD of Metal Box is pretty damn good compared to the other versions of it that I’ve heard.

I can totally believe that you are correct in your assessment of the FH7's treble quality. My point was that the examples you chose to publish didn't convince me (by themselves). Sorry if you took any of my comments personally. They weren't intended that way.

I definitely get what you mean. Refraining from using questionable tracks as reference points is probably a good idea.

 

[Evoke]

What is your opinion on andromeda? I am curious to hear about it

 

[hiflofi]

What is your opinion on andromeda? I am curious to hear about it

Something about upper mids and bass I'm sure.

 

[aminus]

What is your opinion on andromeda? I am curious to hear about it

It’s more positive than that of the Solaris, but yes, the bass is very lacking on it in my opinion, and upper mids are simply not compensated for the pinna properly. I haven’t heard it in a while though, and definitely not through what would be considered a decent source for it.

 

[Elite_Force]

Aminus, what might be your opinion on such appraised specimens as:

- AAW Canary
- Jomo Trinity
- Jomo Flamenco
- Orioulus Mellianus
- Anove VX/8SH

The latter one (Anole VX) is considered to be the true gem of iem by sevral respectable members of the forum.

 

[autosleeper]

Have you tried Xelento?

 

[aminus]

Aminus, what might be your opinion on such appraised specimens as:

- AAW Canary
- Jomo Trinity
- Jomo Flamenco
- Orioulus Mellianus
- Anove VX/8SH

The latter one (Anole VX) is considered to be the true gem of iem by sevral respectable members of the forum.

I have not spent a lot of time with AAW’s lineup, or with Jomo’s, although I have heard the Flamenco pretty extensively and I am unfortunately not a fan of the staging and timbre. Oriolus is also a company I’m a bit in the dark about, although I intend to rectify that shortly. The VX is probably one of the best full BA IEMs I’ve ever heard, and the 8SH/SL don’t slack either. The Gemini has a slight midrange harshness which I’m not keen on but the technicalities of this group in general are nothing short of impressive.

Have you tried Xelento?

Yes, and I do think it’s one of the best single DD IEMs on the market at the moment.