[buke9]

Talk about luck - they arrived sooner than planned

Congrats on the purchase they do take a while to get used to them. The bass is the only thing I have against them not too bad but not that great. It is still a serious headphone. I love mine.

 

[mscott58]

Are those your pictures of your personal pair? If so how did you manage to score SN 001? That number makes me suspect those might be stock photos. Cheers 

 

[akg fanboy]

it looks so sexy*, I'm surprised you got no. 001 as well
 
@buke9 how come you didn't like their bass? From my understanding, the k812 has a major uplift in bass quantity compared to the trio and any previous akgs, and the k872 should have slightly more due to being a closed back. I heard some people say the bass is muddy though

 

[Traveller]

Sorry guys,
 
I never "publish" my SNs online. The AKG SN is actually 6 digits and I simply removed the last 3. Maybe for the next set I'll think of a less confusing way to do it

 
Quote:

Are those your pictures of your personal pair? If so how did you manage to score SN 001?

so look so sexy, I'm surprised you got no. 001 as well

 

[batracom]

Way to go! Have you had a chance to listen to these, and could you share your thoughts on bass quantity and quality, and whether the initial impressions have been confirmed?

 

[Traveller]

^ I've only had a couple of hours with them so I'm not ready to go into detail. I will be comparing them to my only other closed cans...

 

 

[buke9]

so look so sexy, I'm surprised you got no. 001 as well

@buke9
 how come you didn't like their bass? From my understanding, the k812 has a major uplift in bass quantity compared to the trio and any previous akgs, and the k872 should have slightly more due to being a closed back. I heard some people say the bass is muddy though

It is not as tight as I would like but I don't think muddy a little loose maybe but it doesn't ruin it for me at all. If it could have the quality of bass of my Ether-C's it would be a almost perfect headphone for me. They will be staying with me for sure.

 

[EvilKillaruna]

I am currently having AKG K872 on my desk, writing a review and comparing them with other closed and open cans, such as mentioned Beyerdynamic T5p v2 but also HD800 and K1000 (unfortunately no K812 for direct comparison at this moment). I have also plenty of other various AKG's (AKG fan) and with some reputation, such as K240 DF (LP) but also K270 Playback or K340 (BH). Mostly they are running from my Burson Conductor V2+ and NuForce DAC-80 + HAP-100 combo. More details about all gear I have and short sound descriptions are in my profile, and here - some quick impressions (few days of listening at the moment).
 

 
 
The good
Putting construction and comfort aside (both very good, except FPWA and main cable), they have very coherent and user-friendly tonality, tuned to be a slightly warm sounding headphones. Their sound can be described as much more advanced approach to the K271 MKII / K550 MKI style of creating sound. Headphones are trying to portrait everything with optimal way, where nothing is wrong or too exaggerated. I can hear efforts of adressing issues with K812, such as excessive tizzyness in highs, which is very good approach.
 
As a side note: when comparing them versus other their vintage headpohones, I am surprised that they sound like a combination of K280 Parabolic (warmth + midrange distance) and K340 (style and bass vs highs ratio).
 
The bad
But at the same time K872 is unfortunately not a kind of end-gamer in any way, even if we will limit our perspective to closed cans only. My bigger complains are focused around:
- the lowest bass, its shallow depth and dry character
- nasal timbre of highs with tendency of becoming harsh, metallic and thin
- small soundstage
 
The "tizzyness" is still there, but much less pronounced. I can accept reduced soundstage (as for closed cans) and bass (as I am not the basshead myself and quite tolerant with K1000 or even less bassy DF's) but nasal highs are the one thing that preventing me from full enjoyment of this pair. K872 have strong peaks in 5 and 8 kHz points. This sections should be more even than in K812, but still with thinner manner, causing some instruments to become unpleasant and unnatural. No other headphones from mentioned at the beginning are portraying their timbre like K872 do. To be sure I checked it on many well mastered tracks from various genres.
 
I can't describe their soundstage as "open cans like" since they can't go near most of my other open/semi-open AKGs in that aspect. And as versus other closed cans, for me ATH-W1000Z has much more involving and breathtaking soundstage, T5p v2 has it larger and wider too, even K270 can grab your attention by its width (depth is actually very reduced on these, almost "flat" elipse). In K872 everything is nicely balanced, but still most of the time sound events are going on inside your head, slightly away from your very center just like in T1 first-gen, but also not far away when traveling across the stage. It is good for control of the sound, but "meh" for the possible enjoyment. I believe even on "master reference" headphones you should have some.
 
versus Beyerdynamic T5p v2
This pair has much more pronounced bass with ability to loose control much easier than in K872. The greatest difference is in the lowest part of bass section. Combined with better quality highs it is much more involving and exciting pair than AKG and with more basic quality, matching their price tag better. Also their soundstage is larger than in AKG, with slightly greater feel of airiness. For the record, I am considering T5p v2 as overall better headphones than their T1 v2 where their highs were too much for me (and sounded thin too). T5 are also not perfect (I would like to see their 600 Ohm variant), but at the same time very good closed headphones and very hard rival to beat for K872 in terms of pure quality, not tonality (here I prefer balanced nature of AKG more). So when it comes to summary between those two, I would go into T5p v2 for much more euphonic, involving sound with better quality highs, even if my tolerance for their bass is quite low and I mostly complain about its ability to sound bloated. But if Beyerdynamic somehow managed to close them, tune them down on highs and avoid many traps, like mentioned nasal tone or lower resolution due to its closed nature, then AKG should be able to do it too. I am still wondering where the source of this problem lies and I suspect FPWA + main cable as main culprits. It is only a blind guess but I don't think this is acoustic/frame issue.
 
versus K1000
This would be nothing new, since they are in different league, really. Of course if we ignore the fact of different frame and type of those two, when talking about tone and frequency response, you'll get the instant impression of much better and natural reproduction of sound. More lifelike piano, much better hi-hats, bells and cymbals, although portrayed as sharper, crispier and brighter, forcing you to adapt your hearing to new sound signature. K872 has also less intimate mids, vocals are more distant, but bass is stronger, even with similar light attitude of the lowest department. It is not fair to compare them on soundstage, since K1000 sometimes can't be even considered as a headphones, but more like earspeakers. But out of simple curiosity: much more open and spacious on K1000 with still good focus on the center. 
 
versus HD800
For me the bass of this headphones is a perfect example of non ideal, but still damn well balanced section. The midrange is somewhat less involving than in K872, slighty drier without some help from the amplifier or even whole feeding chain. Highs is a clear win for the HD800 in terms of tone and voicing. Even when K872 performs better, when I manage to get to the point where highs are coming to light, the magic from AKG will suddenly dissapear. HD800, even with their 6 kHz peak, can't leave me with impression of harsh, thin highs on many well recorded tracks. The soundstage due to different type of both is once again incomparable and easy to expect: much more 3D presentation of HD800, while strong 2D on K872. 
 
End words
As I've already stated, I am kind of AKG fan, so my hopes were quite high, especially after reading some initial feedback and making very interesting observations from T5p v2 myself. But right now I am very pleased with opportunity to check them properly in my own environment before making any serious buying decitions, not after. This pair was on my short list of very interesting headphones possibly worth buying for the sake of my test gear and future reviews. Was, since I have a kind of mixed feeling about them at this stage. But still, it is an interesting pair, never the less and I will definitely spend some more time with them looking for any positive changes.
 
As always sorry for my less-than-ideal grammar.

 

[batracom]

  I am currently having AKG K872 on my desk, writing a review and comparing them with other closed and open cans, such as mentioned Beyerdynamic T5p v2 but also HD800 and K1000 (unfortunately no K812 for direct comparison at this moment). I have also plenty of other various AKG's (AKG fan) and with some reputation, such as K240 DF (LP) but also K270 Playback or K340 (BH). Mostly they are running from my Burson Conductor V2+ and NuForce DAC-80 + HAP-100 combo. More details about all gear I have and short sound descriptions are in my profile, and here - some quick impressions (few days of listening at the moment).
 

Thanks for all of this, will be interesting to see what Traveller makes of the K872-T5P comparison, as well as writing his own post. I will just say that perhaps more comparison with current-production closed backs would be probably more on the point, HD800 and K1000 are virtually unapproachable in the open-back realm at that price level, let alone closed back!

 

[EvilKillaruna]

Thank you. Those are only quick impressions after few days of continuous listening. I will try to focus on them some more for the sake of full review in order to get as much hours as possible. To be honest, I'm not so sure if anything will change for the better, but we will see.
 
I think it is critical to have the widest orientation in other schools of sound in order to properly judge their highs articulation. HD800 and K1000 were mentioned only out of curiosity how "master reference" closed-back headphones can perform against such high tier, but still very open, headphones in terms of reality and tonal portrayal. From their price range, besides T5p v2, I can additionally compare them at the moment to other closed back headphones like ATH-W5000, mentioned already W1000Z, Denons D7100 and Audeze LCD-XC. 

 

[batracom]

  Thank you. Those are only quick impressions after few days of continuous listening. I will try to focus on them some more for the sake of full review in order to get as much hours as possible. To be honest, I'm not so sure if anything will change for the better, but we will see.
 
I think it is critical to have the widest orientation in other schools of sound in order to properly judge their highs articulation. HD800 and K1000 were mentioned only out of curiosity how "master reference" closed-back headphones can perform against such high tier, but still very open, headphones in terms of reality and tonal portrayal. From their price range, besides T5p v2, I can additionally compare them at the moment to other closed back headphones like ATH-W5000, mentioned already W1000Z, Denons D7100 and Audeze LCD-XC. 

Indeed - your work was very good. I think these additional comparisons you mention would be really spot-on. I too have the HD800 and the HD800S, and the sound they put out is not comparable to any other headphone or speaker system I have tried. It has ruined the latter completely for me. I am looking at the K872 as a mythical beast, a closed back finally having as little flaws as possible, given the design limitations. Your conclusions and the comparison with T5P is quite different from the rest, although not necessarily wrong. I did try the T5P some time ago, and my complaints were the earpad material, which was not really nice on the skin for me, and the sound which was overly warm and to some extent constricted. 

 

[EvilKillaruna]

Sorry to create some doubts about it. In theory I should praise them just because they are AKG, but as you can see I am far from that. Actually I am quite surprised as being at the moment the most critical on them. Of course many impressions are based on different experiences and preferences, but mine are mostly aroud "balanced" headphones with small variations in both directions. I like for example LCD-2 with brighter gear and some mods for soundstage, but have nothing major against polished HD800/K1000 from warmer amplifiers. That is why I've had or still have them. For people like me, probably SRS-3100 is the way to go, but I am trying to find the same pair as you do - with the least number of flaws and at the same time suitable enough for making even more accurate reviews (sensitivity is an important feature). At the moment the strongest candidate is HD800 non-S and fighting with their 6 kHz peak. If I buy them now, it would be the third time. That is the reason why I am still searching for possible substitute.
 
If you've tried T5p (I assume second generation) and felt them as constricted, probably with K872 you'll feel even worse. It is not the kind of cramped headphones, but still less involving soundstage than T5p. This is because K872 have their two peaks in exactly 5 and 7 kHz surrounded by pits in 2,4 kHz with slowly raising left slope and 7,4-8 kHz right after the second peak. At the same time T5p, except for few pits, has quite even frequency response. But for the sake of testing I would not pick them over HD800 because of their bass and electrical properities getting in the way too much.
 
Almost every headphone have flaws and we will never escape from some compromises. My K1000, even with bass mod, still have them. Actually K872 would be very close to the title if not their nasal timbre. This is the real deal breaker for me, followed by smaller than expected soundstage and the lowest bass. But both those allegations are less important for me than highs (STAX spoiled me hard on this). During longer listening sessions I can get used to it, but after short break the whole adaptation process has to start again. Sometimes this is the best sign of something going wrong with tonality of your pair. 

 

[Traveller]

Please note - these are my first AKGs. I consider both the K872 and T5p.2s TOTL closed headphones and I am fortunate and pleased to own both

 
EDIT!

... Mostly they are running from my Burson Conductor V2+ and NuForce DAC-80 + HAP-100 combo...

Ah yes, good place to start! My sessions, both at the audition and with my own units were all done with Chord's Mojo and LG G4 as transport. I have no fool-proof way to vol-match things, but using my standard "tuning" song I estimated the K872 to require an increase of three steps (3dB) of the Mojo's output.
T5p.2: 32 ohms, 102dB spl. K872: 36 ohms, 112dB spl
 
 
Quote:

... Actually, the very moment I started to listen to the 872s (having just spend ~15mins, 2 songs on each of the other three) I didn't understand what was going on. The sound was so different. It took me a whole song to realize that what I was hearing was the sound of open cans... woah. If these are closed cans... I'll be damned. But they certainly are ... I had neither the time nor the recent experience to compare them to open cans so I have no clue how they compare to TOTL open cans like the HD800(S) or Focal's latest and greatest, but again, this is a closed can...

Quote:

Originally Posted by EvilKillaruna /img/forum/go_quote.gif... If you've tried T5p (I assume second generation) and felt them as constricted, probably with K872 you'll feel even worse. It is not the kind of cramped headphones, but still less involving soundstage than T5p. This is because K872 have their two peaks in exactly 5 and 7 kHz surrounded by pits in 2,4 kHz with slowly raising left slope and 7,4-8 kHz right after the second peak. At the same time T5p, except for few pits, has quite even frequency response...

 
That's an amazing contrast in opinion so I think a second "1st opinion" is necessary here... . My own new unit is not as "wow - open can sound" as I honestly thought AKGs "demo" pair were. I don't know why the demos, compared to the T5p.2s sounded like night and day; they are not night & day, but they certainly are still quite different and I do not share @EvilKillaruna view / comparison of the two. But my updated impressions are still based on too few hours of use and nothing more than that.
 
~~~
 
1. It appears that EvilKillaruna has much more experience than me, based on his terminology as well as being a self-proclaimed AKG fan 

So in him you can trust (apart from maybe me, as I hear what I hear and I like what I like

)
 
2. Soundstage - the definition for me is somewhat cryptic; maybe EvilKillaruna knows and makes use of the standard, glossary definition. Having said that, I find the "physical room size" portrayed by both the T5p.2 and the K872 to be roughly the same. Same width, same depth. Very good in width, okay in depth. When an instrument is far off to the left, that's cool. When it sounds like it's just outside of the headphone's left side, it's pushing reality.
 
3. LF - The T5p.2 has a more prominent LF range. What is too much, lacking in, or just the right amount of LF portrayal is quite subjective. I am okay with both signatures although I tend to see the K872s as more... accurate in this area. Which signature is more musically engaging / fun remains to be seen. I think it takes some days of usage (without critical analysis) to come to that conclusion.
 
4. Mid~HF - Maybe EvilKillaruna wins again with more sensitive hearing. All I can say is that the K872 delivers more information in the higher frequencies without being bright in any way. I never winced once when throwing all kinds of music at it. As far as potentially being tiring, not enough hours to say.
 
5. Air - Again, I may not be using the correct term (or not in the correct manner) but my interpretation of "air" is what separated the K872 apart from the other closed candidates I listened to during the audition and it is what still defines the signature to me. So going back to my perception that both cans portray the same sized room; the K872s provide better instrument separation and allow one to easily isolate an instrument. I am, of course, working with well-recorded media. I've only noticed this kind of separation with open cans as hence my overly-zealous conclusion that these sound like open cans. In truth, I haven't heard any modern-day open cans and I can easily imagine the K872s don't have a chance against the HD800(s) etc. But then again I never expected them to compete against such titans of the (open-can) arena.
 
6. Resolution - the K872s resolve better than the T5p.2s. This goes for both the case of "I never heard that before in this recording" to simply more complex sounds (timbre?) of the instruments. With the T5p.2s, many instruments sound luscious, thick, engaging and so on; with the K872s, you can hear the nuances within a single chord emanating from the instrument.
 
~~~
 
So now back to Evilkillaruna's statement. I'm baffled considering I feel the exact opposite about the two cans. I would be curious to hear his opinion of this reviewer's findings on "fit":
 
http://majorhifi.com/akg-k872-review/
 
"When the headphone is fighting you and not positioning itself correctly the sound quality heavily spikes in the mid-range making everything sound incredibly boxy, so if you start noticing a hotter mid-range work on the positioning the headphone"
 
I haven't noticed any amazing change in any area of the FR by slightly shifting the fit of the K872s on my head but again, I have zero problem accepting the very real possibility that my hearing is not as sharp as yours or the reviewer's

 
Speaking of fit... now this is where the two are really worlds apart. The T5p.2s have more clamping force than the K872s (not that either set will work for a head-banging session...) and the pads are also very different. The T5p.2s fit very snugly whereas the K872s are much larger than my ears causing a "sea-shell" effect when in place. I assumed it was due to that (assumed) lack of port but now I have no idea if it's just the fit. Despite the T5p.2's huge ports, both "leak" about the same (which is not very much, but neither are silent, particularly in the HFs). As I use full cans only when I'm at my workstation or I'm on the couch relaxing, stability is not the most important aspect but I can say that the K872s cannot handle any kind of serious movement on the part of the wearer. If you drop something on the floor and bend over to pick it up, I know the K872s won't be on your head anymore and there's a good chance your T5ps will be lob-sided

 
~~~
 
Once more, the above is only a refined 1st opinion and I look forward to spending more time listening (vs. critical listening) to the K872s. Then and only then will I have a better opinion. My hope is not to find one closed can that can satisfy all of my needs, but rather that with both of them, I can cover a whole range of music keeping it all fun and engaging!

 
 

 

 

[Traveller]

So enough talk for now, how about a few more pics of this beauty...

 
An "unboxing" of sorts...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Traveller]

Devil.
Details.