[SeanS]

Hi Dan.

I've been enjoying my pair (s/n A664) for a while now. They're the best all-around headphones I've owned. I prefer the sound over my Audeze-LCD-XC's if that says anything. I pair it with a Burson Virtuoso V2 amp. I notice that the sound seems to change after 15-20 min of listening moderate-to-loud. The sound is a little more distorted...not bad at all, but slightly noticeable, especially at higher volumes. If I let phones go unused for a few hours, the sharper sound returns.

I'm curious if tempurature affects in the closed environment are changing the properties of the driver slightly. What are your thoughts on this? The Audeze pair also seemed to behave in this way.


Thanks,
Sean

 

[phthora]

Hi Dan.

I've been enjoying my pair (s/n A664) for a while now. They're the best all-around headphones I've owned. I prefer the sound over my Audeze-LCD-XC's if that says anything. I pair it with a Burson Virtuoso V2 amp. I notice that the sound seems to change after 15-20 min of listening moderate-to-loud. The sound is a little more distorted...not bad at all, but slightly noticeable, especially at higher volumes. If I let phones go unused for a few hours, the sharper sound returns.

I'm curious if tempurature affects in the closed environment are changing the properties of the driver slightly. What are your thoughts on this? The Audeze pair also seemed to behave in this way.


Thanks,
Sean

I'll throw my guess out there before we hear from The Man Himself... I'm guessing pad warm-up is the culprit. I've noticed on mine, it takes a bit of head time for the foam in the pads and the protein leather to soften up enough to get a good seal, which changes the sound. This applies to just about every headphone I have with leather or protein leather pads.

 

[SeanS]

I'll throw my guess out there before we hear from The Man Himself... I'm guessing pad warm-up is the culprit. I've noticed on mine, it takes a bit of head time for the foam in the pads and the protein leather to soften up enough to get a good seal, which changes the sound. This applies to just about every headphone I have with leather or protein leather pads.

Interesting. To me the sound deteriorates slightly after it's warmed up. I prefer the sound when it's cold. If your theory is correct, then I prefer an incomplete seal (although I have a crew cut, so I don't really have seal problems).

I just played around with this idea by adjusting the seal, and I can say that I don't think it's seal related.

To me it sounds as if the driver is having more "break-up" distortion at moderately loud volumes after it is warm.

Maybe I should listen with them "pre-warmed" by the environment vs. being driven. Then I could put them in the freezer or something an listen and see if the sound takes longer to deteriorate.

Maybe the diaphragms are "pre-warmed" before they are mounted. I wouldn't suppose the diaphragm material itself can stretch, but the fact that the Aeon uses a pleated diaphragm, I would think, would lead to more susceptibility for it's dimensions to be modulated by temperature.

Just a curious person here.

BTW, I still think these are great headphones.

Thanks,
Sean

 

[phthora]

Interesting. To me the sound deteriorates slightly after it's warmed up. I prefer the sound when it's cold. If your theory is correct, then I prefer an incomplete seal (although I have a crew cut, so I don't really have seal problems).

I just played around with this idea by adjusting the seal, and I can say that I don't think it's seal related.

To me it sounds as if the driver is having more "break-up" distortion at moderately loud volumes after it is warm.

Maybe I should listen with them "pre-warmed" by the environment vs. being driven. Then I could put them in the freezer or something an listen and see if the sound takes longer to deteriorate.

Maybe the diaphragms are "pre-warmed" before they are mounted. I wouldn't suppose the diaphragm material itself can stretch, but the fact that the Aeon uses a pleated diaphragm, I would think, would lead to more susceptibility for it's dimensions to be modulated by temperature.

Just a curious person here.

Thanks,
Sean

I admire your methodical thinking. If we are ruling out variables, I would suggest making sure that your amp and DAC are sufficiently warmed up, as well. (I have one solid state amp that I swear needs a five-minute warm-up to sound right.)

I will see if I can recreate some of your findings later. I haven't experienced anything like break-up or distortion from these headphones, no matter what the conditions, but perhaps there is a difference in sound anyway.

The pad warm-up issue is something I noticed early on, but then I have long hair and glasses so it is most difficult for me to get a good seal anyway. On that note though, there is also the fact that the earpads compress more when they are warmed up, bringing the driver closer. Not that that would cause distortion, but I find that it changes the sound a bit.

 

[tuby sound]

Interesting. To me the sound deteriorates slightly after it's warmed up. I prefer the sound when it's cold. If your theory is correct, then I prefer an incomplete seal (although I have a crew cut, so I don't really have seal problems).

I just played around with this idea by adjusting the seal, and I can say that I don't think it's seal related.

To me it sounds as if the driver is having more "break-up" distortion at moderately loud volumes after it is warm.

Maybe I should listen with them "pre-warmed" by the environment vs. being driven. Then I could put them in the freezer or something an listen and see if the sound takes longer to deteriorate.

Maybe the diaphragms are "pre-warmed" before they are mounted. I wouldn't suppose the diaphragm material itself can stretch, but the fact that the Aeon uses a pleated diaphragm, I would think, would lead to more susceptibility for it's dimensions to be modulated by temperature.

Just a curious person here.

BTW, I still think these are great headphones.

Thanks,
Sean

Both the X and the Aeon were driven by the same amp? I'll check the amp first since it happens around 20mns...

Kelvin

 

[mrspeakers]

There's nothing about the headphone that can cause distortion just due to "warming up," the driver is so thin and low mass that any "warm up" is near instant.

Generally whenever anyone tells us the headphone is "distorting" it's the amp or they are hearing issues in the DAC. This has been true for 100% of "distortion" questions that affect both channels since the day we started the company, the only rare exception has been a broken trace which buzzed on one side, I think that happened twice. There is no failure mode for the driver that distorts both channels and warmup does not change the driver, it's warm within moments. That said, I'm not really sure what you're hearing, as distortion brightens the sound, and you say it's "sharper" cold, so I don't understand sonically what you are describing and can't hazard a response. Can you clarify?

 

[SeanS]

There's nothing about the headphone that can cause distortion just due to "warming up," the driver is so thin and low mass that any "warm up" is near instant.

Generally whenever anyone tells us the headphone is "distorting" it's the amp or they are hearing issues in the DAC. This has been true for 100% of "distortion" questions that affect both channels since the day we started the company, the only rare exception has been a broken trace which buzzed on one side, I think that happened twice. There is no failure mode for the driver that distorts both channels and warmup does not change the driver, it's warm within moments. That said, I'm not really sure what you're hearing, as distortion brightens the sound, and you say it's "sharper" cold, so I don't understand sonically what you are describing and can't hazard a response. Can you clarify?

Hello. Thanks for responding. Thanks for the information. The change in sound resembles the breakup sound of when an amp's distortion rises when driven loudly. However, I haven't experienced this with the Burson on other cans.I'm just curious. The combination of the Burson and ConceroHD is pretty quiet. But I suppose with the combination of their gain profiles THD might go up on the Burson at high power when driving the lower impedance Aeons, maybe that's the ultimate cause. I leave all the equipment on continuously. I don't think the Burson, PC, DAC or power equipment has been switched off in over a year (it's at my office).

On the Aeons, I was making the assumption, correct me if I'm wrong, that the planar diaphragm needs to be mounted in tension.

So I was thinking that maybe the driver diaphragm expanded by the heat from being driven (assuming more so than the heat from my head, but I could be wrong) causing a little more distortioin; however, your comment about the driver instantly getting up to temperature makes sense.

I'm just curious. It just bums me out a little that the sound deteriorates (although just a little) if I listen continuously with my setup. Again, I'll admit the Aeons are only part of the chain.

Again, thanks for responding and making such a good product here in the U.S.

Sean

 

[mrspeakers]

Hello. Thanks for responding. Thanks for the information. The change in sound resembles the breakup sound of when an amp's distortion rises when driven loudly. However, I haven't experienced this with the Burson on other cans.I'm just curious. The combination of the Burson and ConceroHD is pretty quiet. But I suppose with the combination of their gain profiles THD might go up on the Burson at high power when driving the lower impedance Aeons, maybe that's the ultimate cause. I leave all the equipment on continuously. I don't think the Burson, PC, DAC or power equipment has been switched off in over a year (it's at my office).

Sean

Do you mean the Conductor Virtuoso V2? If so it should in theory put 8W into 16 ohms, so it's not the amp.

There is no thermal effect on the diaphragm, tension achieves a steady state after burn in.

PM me and we can take this offline to see if we can sort it out.

 

[menuki]

Received the AEON Flow Closed about a week ago and I really really like them, like a lot.

This morning I wanted to give them a listen like usual but noticed that the ear-pad on the right side slightly came loose due to the glue. I managed to stick the ear-pad to the cup again, but I'm generally a bit worried that the glue might give up after a while and the pads come loose. Do you guys have any tips regarding this or is there some known glue for this kind of application so that if they were to came loose I can just re-glue them again?

 

[mrspeakers]

No glue needed, if the pad doesn’t stick we will replace it. Usually just pressing it firmly to the baffle will keep it in place...

 

[gb21011971]

Received my AFC. First impressions are ambiguous. I really like the clarity and ease with which mids and trebles are portrayed. Really good resolution and separation.

The negative for me so far: Sounds very thin. Even though bass quality is good, quantity is lacking for my taste. Many reviewers call the tonality of the AFC very neutral. I don't agree. I would call it thin.

I am coming from a Focal Clear. Which I find neutral, but only just. The Clear has slightly too forward mids and could also do with a bit more bass punch IMO.

 

[menuki]

Received my AFC. First impressions are ambiguous. I really like the clarity and ease with which mids and trebles are portrayed. Really good resolution and separation.

The negative for me so far: Sounds very thin. Even though bass quality is good, quantity is lacking for my taste. Many reviewers call the tonality of the AFC very neutral. I don't agree. I would call it thin.

I am coming from a Focal Clear. Which I find neutral, but only just. The Clear has slightly too forward mids and could also do with a bit more bass punch IMO.

I have to agree more or less. I wouldn't really call them "very thin" though, but the bass quantity feels lacking in a lot of tracks. Now, they do make up for it with clarity, a beautiful midrange and sizzling treble, but if I listen to the Aurvana Trio (which are admittedly bass heavy) I do miss a little bit of bass quanitity in the AEONS. Now, I also own the JBL 530 Studio Monitors and they are known to be a bit bright, but they do actually have a bit more bass than the AEONs as well (comparing apples to oranges, I'm aware).

I guess it's all about preference, but the AEONs can feel a bit bass light from track to track IMHO, even though this statement is not easy to make since they're such great headphones in terms of technicallity.

 

[LarryMagoo]

One of the things I love about the AFC's is their Slam and their Bass but needs some good power to demonstrate that. I find then incredibly musical and very fun to listen to....

 

[nickosiris]

I'm with LarryMagoo. I would never use a phrase like 'very thin' or 'lacking bass'. I very much admire the amount and quality of the bass response from the AFC but each to their own and this would be a very boring website indeed if we all liked the same things!

 

[Satir]

Looking at AFC and powering them with amp/DAC. See Dan's collection of amps (the ones listed anyway) and list does not include Chord Hugo 2. Read some posts about pairing AFC with tube gear though not seeing much here, or in independent reviews about AFC/Hugo 2 pairing. Would appreciate impressions from those who have spent more than a little time with AFC/Hugo 2. In past had several tube based systems (spent a small fortune on tubes roll merry-go-round as well, but these days prefer convenience of digital portable/desktop systems.