[hawat]

The hd800 is not as bassy as the hd650 and my d7000 is more bassy than my hd650 as well.

 

[fjrabon]

I don't really think that headroom graphs are wrong, per se, its just that you can't compare open and closed headphones directly based on FR charts. FR charts don't take into account that a closed design traps bass and thus sounds bassier. If two headphones read even close on a FR chart and one is closed and the other is open, the closed one is going to sound waaaayyyy bassier. Also, closed designs tend to make 6kHz to 9 kHz go away (not sure why they do this acoustically, they just do.

FR charts aren't usually wrong, if you take them for what they are and know how to read them.

 

[fjrabon]

Quote:

Originally Posted by hawat /img/forum/go_quote.gif The hd800 is not as bassy as the hd650 and my d7000 is more bassy than my hd650 as well.

I'd rather say that the HD650 is less trebly, which makes it sound bassier. Another thing about FR graphs is people just look at one portion of the graph. You can't do that, you have to compare the whole thing.

Even though the bass levels are almost identical, it's the fact that the HD800 has a spike at 6kHz, while the HD650 has a trough there that makes the HD650 sound bassier, despite the fact that their bass levels are almost identical.

 

[hawat]

Quote:

Originally Posted by fjrabon /img/forum/go_quote.gif I'd rather say that the HD650 is less trebly, which makes it sound bassier. Another thing about FR graphs is people just look at one portion of the graph. You can't do that, you have to compare the whole thing. Even though the bass levels are almost identical, it's the fact that the HD800 has a spike at 6kHz, while the HD650 has a trough there that makes the HD650 sound bassier, despite the fact that their bass levels are almost identical.

Yeah and my hd650 is much more trebly than my d7000 as well.

I' m talking about the bass here, at the same volume they will be more present on the hd650 than on the hd800. If you dont believe it, use your hd800 and hd650 find a place with much low frequency bass use a software to cut every part of the song but the bassy part and listen again.

 

[brat]

Quote:

Originally Posted by hawat /img/forum/go_quote.gif You listen to the headphone not to the graph and I don't believe much in graphs anymore after seeing something like this. In this graph it shows the d7000 as having less bass than the t1 and the hd800 when its the opposite, they actually have much more bass than both. It also shows the t1 as having more lower bass than the hd800 and I actually noticed the opposite as well.

No, this graph shows that D7000 is slightly less efficient than the others.

Graphs show more quality (freq.response features) than quantity characteristics. And they're strongly influenced by the amp that you use. These graphs are precise measurements but they do not correspond to the presentation of these headphones with every system. The headphone's sound is a product of the entire system. I never rely on graphs.

 

[Necrolic]

Quote:

Originally Posted by brat /img/forum/go_quote.gif No, this graph shows that D7000 is slightly less efficient than the others. Graphs show more quality (freq.response features) than quantity characteristics.

dB = decibels = volume = quantity

And again, D7000 is like 10x more efficient than the T1/HD800, so I fail to see your point.

 

[hawat]

What do you mean by less efficient?

 

[brat]

Quote:

Originally Posted by hawat /img/forum/go_quote.gif What do you mean by less efficient?

Those who've ever listened to both headphones know that (apart from quality discrepancy) HD201 have much more bass than K701. But they're harder to drive.

P.S. If you trust this graph you'll have totally wrong idea of the freq. characteristics of both headphones

These graphs mean nothing.

 

[hawat]

Quote:

Originally Posted by brat /img/forum/go_quote.gif Those who've ever listened to both headphones know that (apart from quality discrepancy) HD201 have much more bass than K701. But they're harder to drive. P.S. If you trust this graph you'll have totally wrong idea of the freq. characteristics of both headphones These graphs mean nothing.

As necrolic already pointed it, the d7000 are actually much easier to drive than the hd800 or the t1.

 

[sokolov91]

THIS is what I am more worried about than closed/open or how true FR response graphs are... phase is phase...

The D7000 looks like the bad ones Headroom showed... AD700 and RS1

 

[Necrolic]

Quote:

Originally Posted by brat /img/forum/go_quote.gif Those who've ever listened to both headphones know that (apart from quality discrepancy) HD201 have much more bass than K701. But they're harder to drive. P.S. If you trust this graph you'll have totally wrong idea of the freq. characteristics of both headphones These graphs mean nothing.

Same point I made above applies here. The K701 are some of the hardest to drive headphones out there, whereas the HD201 will drive out of an iPod.

So again, I fail to see your point, especially on the original graph, as D7000 drive far easier than T1/HD800.

 

[brat]

Quote:

Originally Posted by hawat /img/forum/go_quote.gif As necrolic already pointed it, the d7000 are actually much easier to drive than the hd800 or the t1.

Then:
Quote:

Originally Posted by brat /img/forum/go_quote.gif These graphs mean nothing.

But the main point of my words is that you cannot get a notion about the bass/mids/trebles absolute quantities. Headphone's linearity is perceived as an indivisible picture for all audible frequencies. Raised mids and trebles make bass sound silent. And contrariwize.

 

[brat]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Necrolic /img/forum/go_quote.gif Same point I made above applies here. The K701 are some of the hardest to drive headphones out there, whereas the HD201 will drive out of an iPod.

You must have a powerful iPod.

Both are hard to drive but the senns are harder. I own both.

 

[Necrolic]

Quote:

Originally Posted by brat /img/forum/go_quote.gif You must have a powerful iPod. Both are hard to drive but the senns are harder. I own both.

I've had them in the past, they drove just fine from an iPod.

Dunno if there's a new version, but that's just my experience.

 

[mypasswordis]

brat, you've got it completely wrong. The graphs are all referenced to 0dBr at 1kHz, it has nothing to do with sensitivity.