50 Cent feud (rant): Who understands those rap guys anyway?
Mar 8, 2005 at 6:41 PM Post #61 of 81
Quote:

Originally Posted by EyeAmEye
Couldn't it be entirely possible that the good rap you speak of isn't made because not enough people actually like it?


Of course. Frankly, underground rap often has subject matter most people would label boring. Afrocentrism and "getting back to the music" are not exactly themes I want to listen to for hours and hours. Beyond that, the production is often a bit less club-friendly, and of course there is a strong correlation between popular music and dance clubs. However, if the thing that turns you off from rap is specifically the gangster imagery, there are talented rappers who don't do that, and this point has been made and examples given.

If the thing that turns you off from rap is lack of talent, then you are just plain mistaken. Even in the mainstream, there is an abundance of talent. I don't know why some people hear a power chord on a guitar and think it's some master craft, or think singing on pitch is God's gift, but think rapping is just some simple thing anyone can do. Sure, some rappers manage a few years of fame with relatively little talent, based on their image. But they are no less talented than their counterparts in pop music. 50 Cent is no less talented than Jessica Simpson. I will go so far as to say 50 Cent is no less talented than Linkin Park. Even Vanilla Ice was as much of an artist as Paula Abdul. At the same time, when you actually start moving to the serious rappers in the mainstream, they are raising the bar for all forms of music in terms of lyrical depth and vocal delivery.

If you don't like rap because you prefer a bigger focus on melodic or harmonic music instead of rhythm and lyrics, that's fine. For some people, melody is the essence of music, and pure rap is pretty much anti-melodic by definition. Like any type of music, it's a matter of taste. But you should be able to at least appreciate that a flow is a type of musical technique, telling a story in rhyme patterns, syncopating the placement of rhymes against the beat for dramatic effect: this can be pretty complex and powerful, and I think we are still pretty early in the development in terms of rap being a serious artform.
 
Mar 8, 2005 at 8:04 PM Post #63 of 81
In my last post I mentioned watered down versions of prototype rappers lacking skill. This skill isn't musical skill. I like many of their beats and tunes . The skill I'm thinking is lyrical insight.

I guess that with rap being spoken rather than sung, there's a lot at stake in their message, because the music seems to be just a side dish. So there's all this focus on lyrics, and then being taken seriously, and all this junk about propping up your image to be taken seriously.

I think that this idea of hip-hop consumers turning the system upside down is just waiting for the right moment. Rating rap stars based on insight, rather than on how credible they look isn't hard to do. And then the proper stars of today wouldn't get dragged back into violence (like that Godfather quote about trying to get out of the mob underworld). Then they could just perform like bards - without having to get dirty to show how real they are.

Rehashing inner city tales might be meaningful to inner city kids, but rap has become so vibrant today, there must be other urban issues that its growing audience can relate to. Hopefully someday themes about pimping, and shooting will be as uncool as bell-bottoms.
 
Mar 8, 2005 at 9:01 PM Post #64 of 81
Quote:

Originally Posted by NormanBates
this coming from a guy who listens to heavy metal. no offense, but metal music's washed up. so's punk
frown.gif



LOL, so what is not washed up to you? I see your point though, again, it is the public's fault on both accounts as well.

I have said all I want to say on this issue because there is only so much we can do about it. The whole public has to improve their taste in music for anything to change for the better.
 
Mar 8, 2005 at 10:17 PM Post #65 of 81
Quote:

Originally Posted by morphie
If you have enough time to judge other people's music preferences i suggest you use that time to listen to your own music. Nuff said, I'm off this thread.


Strong words, but realize that many of the anti-rap people used to be devout fans, until it went to hell. As was mentioned before, the reason that good rap isn't popular is cause noone wants to hear it. They all want the glorious, alcohol-toting, womanizing, gangster music. I'll tell you right now, real gangters are not cool.
 
Mar 9, 2005 at 5:39 AM Post #68 of 81
And the moral of the thread is...

[size=small]A whole lot of mainstream music sucks and shouldn't be considered representative of the entire genre.[/size] Dismissing an entire style of music because of a few "artists" is pure ignorance, and if you want to be blissfully ignorant, that's fine too, but don't act as if you're being objective.

Nobody has mentioned 2pac thus far, but he had a lot of very deep songs as well as pure and simple poetry that was never recorded, and never intended to be recorded.

All of the mainstream rappers have to sell an image to keep themselves afloat...2pac wasn't a gun-toting gangster, but he kept that image in order to make money and get his other messages out.
 
Mar 9, 2005 at 1:01 PM Post #70 of 81
Tupac is a great illustration of my last post . By all accounts he was an artsy guy who got dragged into some petty feud that cost him his life.


Edit: I think I'm getting tired of this thread too. For all the folks who take offense, and who add their 2c without reading the thread, I refer you to post #50.
 
Mar 9, 2005 at 4:04 PM Post #71 of 81
Trying to convince people who have never liked rap; that rap isn't pointless is a complete waste. It's easy to point out the bad in a genre you don't like or prefer. You aren't going to magically awaken and begin to see the appeal of it. Its easy to see that rap isn't the only music genre that has it's negative downsides. So this thread will never go anywhere.
 
Mar 9, 2005 at 7:16 PM Post #72 of 81
Quote:

Originally Posted by blip
...
It is my belief that much of what holds rap back is the attitude that it should not be a respected form of music. This belief prevents the creation of a true rap revolution.



i agree. if punk rock had been greeted by that same attitude, all that would have come out of it would have been sid vicious.

BUT (another half-baked analogy): in his prime, chuck berry had to cope with "this is all crap", too (and also with the latent racism of some generalizing critics whose only positive examples are accidentally all white). but it didn't deter him or others then, on the contrary - "roll over, beethoven" was a powerful statement... rock'n'roll has definitely outlasted its critics. negative attitude toward "all rock" nowadays is rare. but with rap it went differently. that negative attitude wasn't there at the start, it developed later.

early rap's artistic impact and power was similar to that of early rock'n'roll (and apparently some of this prevails in the underground, it's just that i know little of recent artists or developments), but it was not generally put down by serious music critics and fans, on the contrary. there was a time when rappers like de la soul, the jungle brothers, krs one, public enemy and others were not only thought of as true artists by many (off-mainstream) music critics, but as the ONLY relevant artists - contemporary "classic" rock and pop being (often rightfully) considered stale, stagnant and sold-out.

note that those were the mainstream rappers of their time... quality, relevance and success was one. now when and how did the attitude that "all rap is crap" develop? my guess: at the same time that commercial success and artistic value became separated. what happened? i guess it's the same thing that happened to pop, rock, r'n'b, soul... to ANY "music for the proles" (george orwell):
corporate entertainment vampires suck music dry and let it rot... jackass, pimp-hop, paris hilton: that's entertainment.

(ha! now that i'm done i can see why blip labeled his original post a 'rant'.. this isn't half as coherent as i wanted it to be... well... lack of sleep...
biggrin.gif
)
 
Mar 9, 2005 at 9:54 PM Post #73 of 81
BREAKING NEWS:

50 Cent & The Game have decided to lay their beef to rest & will make a formal announcement at a press conference today (March 9) at the Schomburg Center For Research in Black Culture in NYC at 2:00 pm. "Game & I need to set an example in the community," 50 said today. "50 and I are proving that real situations and real problems can be solved with real talk," Game added.

For the full story log on: http://www.allhiphop.com/hiphopnews/?ID=4163

rolleyes.gif
 
Mar 9, 2005 at 10:42 PM Post #74 of 81
Quote:

Originally Posted by MrJoshua
BREAKING NEWS:

50 Cent & The Game have decided to lay their beef to rest & will make a formal announcement at a press conference today (March 9) at the Schomburg Center For Research in Black Culture in NYC at 2:00 pm. "Game & I need to set an example in the community," 50 said today. "50 and I are proving that real situations and real problems can be solved with real talk," Game added.

For the full story log on: http://www.allhiphop.com/hiphopnews/?ID=4163

rolleyes.gif



*cough*PR*cough*
 
Mar 9, 2005 at 10:46 PM Post #75 of 81
Quote:

Originally Posted by bln
Some people are saying this 50/Game rift (even the shooting) was planned to drum up publicity for both, especially for 50's second album, coincidentally just about to be released.


I called it days ago. Cough.
 

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