[Hutnicks]

Good questions. I know that Gene Haas couldn't express enough just how complicated these power units are. You'd think that Honda would just figure one thing out and catch right up but obviously it's not so simple somehow. As to the cost of F1, you need it to not be an open checkbook. Our US commentators were lamenting the 30 spot grid penalty on Alonso and how "ridiculous" it is, but if you just give them free reign, there will be 2 teams in F1 and everyone else will leave. It almost happened in Moto GP and it wasn't pretty. I don't want to watch a race with a grid of less than 10 cars.

I think letting Honda/McLaren spend and break token rules at the cost of basically forfeiting every race is fair. Let them spend their way back to being competitive and all the private teams can score points and make/save $ in the meantime. It's kind of a self policing system, if you think you can score points you wont sacrifice a race to break an engine rule for the mid teams, and for sure the top teams wont put a championship in danger just to gain 0.1 second at the cost of grid penalties when they can gain that in aero development or something. The only danger is a team leaving one of their 2 drivers to whither and test new stuff while another goes for a championship, but if you keep the reward for placement in constructor's championship high enough they wont do that either.

The penalties to the driver are ridiculous, until, as you point out you take the overall tableau into consideration. There is really no other way of penalizing a team fairly. If you say we will dock constructors points then you give teams like Mac carte blanc to do whatever they want as they know there will be no points to be docked anyway. There should be a limit on the maximum grid places to be set back though as penalizing more places than their are on the grid makes the show look like clowns are running it.

When Mac first decided to partner with Honda I figured that it might be a fairly brilliant strategic move. If Honda had come out swinging it might have been a great end run to a high perf motor without suffering through the development Renault and Ferrari were having to do. After all Merc got it right on the first go. It could have been a very different story alltogether. As it turned out it was not to be and we have the mess now in progress. I still wonder if in fact there were FIA regs in effect in the initial development that hampered Honda or if in fact they just underestimated the task, made harder by Ronbo's insistence on size 0.

I really hope some employee writes a book about this fiasco. It would be a fascinating read.


Oh yeah. The FIA asserting its presence by forcing the Halo through. Come on guys. The best engineers in the world and you come up with something that hideous and obstructive?

 

[jimmers]

... I really hope some employee writes a book about this fiasco. It would be a fascinating read....

Like "Such Sweet Thunder", but more "Embarassing Fart"

 

[Muinarc]

The halo is about as knee-jerk as they come. If you want to see human nature and corporate bureaucracy at work in one simple example, that would be it. Tell me, how many lives per decade does this stand to save? In the tens of thousands of open cockpit races (even including the olden days with no helmets, a riding mechanic where your odds were doubled, and crap flew off cars in front of you all the time), how many deaths have occurred by being hit in the head by debris? I bet it's an astoundingly small number compared to death by collision with walls, hay bales, trees, horses, other cars, etc. etc.

There's no way it would have saved Jules Bianchi I can pretty much guarantee that. Any structure in front of his face would have been shoved.... into his face. I seriously doubt any halo type structure could have saved Greg Moore. Justin Wilson? Possibly.

 

[Hutnicks]

The halo is about as knee-jerk as they come. If you want to see human nature and corporate bureaucracy at work in one simple example, that would be it. Tell me, how many lives per decade does this stand to save? In the tens of thousands of open cockpit races (even including the olden days with no helmets, a riding mechanic where your odds were doubled, and crap flew off cars in front of you all the time), how many deaths have occurred by being hit in the head by debris? I bet it's an astoundingly small number compared to death by collision with walls, hay bales, trees, horses, other cars, etc. etc.

There's no way it would have saved Jules Bianchi I can pretty much guarantee that. Any structure in front of his face would have been shoved.... into his face. I seriously doubt any halo type structure could have saved Greg Moore. Justin Wilson? Possibly.

I think it is still fall out from Senna getting hit on the head with a wheel. It strikes me as one of those ideas who's foolishness will not become apparent until it is in use and the inevitable troubles it causes come to light.

 

[gr8soundz]

I recall the halo talk started after Massa's injury when a piece of Jensen Button's Brawn hit him in the head. He was lucky to fully recover from that scare but a halo might have worked in cases like that.

 

[Muinarc]

I recall the halo talk started after Massa's injury when a piece of Jensen Button's Brawn hit him in the head. He was lucky to fully recover from that scare but a halo might have worked in cases like that.

What if the halo diverted the spring that hit up near the temple of Massa's helmet downward and the spring just lodged through the visor and killed him? They either completely change the sport and go full cockpit like Le Mans prototypes or they stay open. Various fairings, screens, and bars aren't going to do anything worthwhile.

 

[gr8soundz]

What if the halo diverted the spring that hit up near the temple of Massa's helmet downward and the spring just lodged through the visor and killed him? They either completely change the sport and go full cockpit like Le Mans prototypes or they stay open. Various fairings, screens, and bars aren't going to do anything worthwhile.

Anything deflecting the spring (thus absorbing some of the force) would have made any resulting injury much less severe.

However, neither solution will protect drivers in more direct crashes. The halo or full canopy will only be good for deflecting debris but both will make it harder for drivers to exit the car; not to mention something extra to hit their head on during a collision.

 

[Hutnicks]

I wonder. The Halo leaves a lot of open space for debris to come through so i am suspicious as to it's overall effectiveness.

 

[oqvist]

Security wise it could help for sure it´s not stupid in that regard. To hit head on or have something that may actually slow the car down enough so you don´t hit head on or hit at lower speeds.

Halo plus visir ideally. Or we make f1 more a gladiator game. But we have moto GP for that

 

[Roen]

Even better remove the legacy money from teams like Mclaren, Ferrari and the likes and we will have a more competitive formulae.

That hybrid power is hard is no obvious. Look at the P1 attrition at the Lemans 24H race. There used to be a saying that it was nowadays a 24h sprint race but not anymore as hybrid systems develope and bring in a lot more components that can brake down. Electrical power is the way forward though so no turning back.

McLaren gets legacy money? I thought it was just Ferrari?

 

[Roen]

They could replace it with Le Mans. Would be interesting to see them race in lowest downforce configurations. Puts more demands on the drivers.

Better take out the chicanes at La Sarthe too. Make for proper high speed racing.

 

[oqvist]

McLaren gets legacy money? I thought it was just Ferrari?

Ferrari get the biggest share then mclaren is the second biggest sharetaker. Red Bull and Williams get quite a bit as well though. I think merc is in on the deal some also. Sauber get a symbolic sum

 

[Hutnicks]

McLaren gets legacy money? I thought it was just Ferrari?

This explains it quite well. It is a confusing schedule to say the least.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/129388



Oh yes, and... https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/lauda-halo-fia-detroys-popularity-933175/?s=1

Good old Nick the Pri##, when he's right he's right

 

[Hutnicks]

And on the eve of the Hungaroring and the begining of Silly Season.

http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12...gp-pit-stop-that-ended-a-mclaren-relationship

They overlooked the part where it was the emails referred to were used to attempt to get Ron to short fuel Lewis's car during the race.

I cannot help but think that this is the press trying well and trully to keep Alonso out of the picture at Merc. All the character repair he has done since leaving the SCUD seems to be for naught.

 

[MuZo2]

Sauber signs multi-year Ferrari engine deal
Where would Honda go now?