ZMF Verite Open

[Pharmaboy]

Listening to my OG silkwood VO on the Icon Audio HP8 (tc-tube amp) is one of life's consistent pleasures. In the past 1-2 years I stumbled across a true Goldilocks tube roll with the HP8 and have been reluctant to mess with that very good thing. But of course, recently I did just that:

• Picked up a matched NOS pair of Brimar 6SN7GT power tubes from the UK. Paid >2X more than for any previous pairs of NOS tubes of any kind
• Took out my beloved pair of NOS 1951 Sylvania 2-rivet, black plate "Bad Boy" 6SN7GTs and replaced with the Brimars
• Which sounded totally wonderful but also totally different than the Sylvanias (will go into more detail on this in the HP8 thread)
• Ever since I've tried to find the perfect NOS input tube (of the 12AT7s & 12AX7s on hand) to bring the Brimars up to the sonic height I suspect they can go. Last night it was the turn of the NOS '60s Brimar 12AX7 recently purchased from Langrex/UK. So I checked out this 3-tube Brimar set using the VO last night.

Wow! I was bowled over amazing, enveloping sound. The input vs power tube synergy I hoped for was 100% there.

The punchline is I had great trouble taking the VO off my head last night. This headphone effortlessly scales up to any level the equipment on hand can attain; it certainly did that last night.

I can't imagine being without this VO. It became my favorite dynamic driver headphone the 1st day I owned it, and nothing has changed....

 

[Leto Dal]

VO is special. Even with Immanis on my table I regulary reach for Verite. Aside of being very transparent of changes in the chain, it scales beautifully on summit gear. First jump was with Envy from Bliss with HA-3A, now with AIC-10 from Envy. Its just beautiful how much punch and sheer technicalities like layering, holography and detail it can show, still being euphonic, effortless and lush.

 

[dude120]

VO FTW. Love them. Was foolish enough to sell my first VO. Had to buy a new pair after three weeks.

Are you pre-amping envy with the decware ?
Which do you prefer with the VO?

 

[LE9000]

Are you pre-amping envy with the decware ?
Which do you prefer with the VO?

No - I haven’t experimented with preamping these two amps.
For VO I prefer the Envy. It simply enhances all the traits that I love about the ZMFs. I’m not sure it is the Ultimate VO amp though.
The Decware is a Taboo - I prefer planar on this one.

I did preamp the Taboo with a CSP2+ That was fantastic.

 

[ThanatosVI]

What's everyone's experience with the resale value of these headphones? I've bought and sold many of the top end headphones over the years, Utopia, Meze Empyrean, Meze Elite, LCD4, HE 1000 SE etc. but I've never struggled to get 50% of RRP on any of them.

I've had my African Blackwood with new drivers listed at £1400 for months (£2700 RRP), finally dropped it to £1200 and still no interest?

It's crazy because this headphone is amazing! £1200 for a headphone of this quality is an absolute steal. What's everyone else's experience with resale on these? Why are they a hard sell?

Several reasons could apply here

1. The economy has been brutal I recent years and money sits tighter than ever. As you've seen yourself 50% resale value is no rarity anymore.

2. It's "just past" ZMF November and most people interested in a ZMF got one recently

3. The custom shop is supposed to come "soonish"

4. You sell from GB which means a lot of additional VAT to the buyer. Your previous price of 1400GBP would translate to 1680GBP = 2020€ if I were to buy it. Which is not so enticing anymore.

5. You don't have a lot of seller feedback and in recent months we have seen counterfeit ZMFs rising

 

[Exekuhtor]

What's everyone's experience with the resale value of these headphones? I've bought and sold many of the top end headphones over the years, Utopia, Meze Empyrean, Meze Elite, LCD4, HE 1000 SE etc. but I've never struggled to get 50% of RRP on any of them.

I've had my African Blackwood with new drivers listed at £1400 for months (£2700 RRP), finally dropped it to £1200 and still no interest?

It's crazy because this headphone is amazing! £1200 for a headphone of this quality is an absolute steal. What's everyone else's experience with resale on these? Why are they a hard sell?

I'll also chime in because i had a pair and it was really hard to sell, i had to let it go for a really low price in the end. And it was blackwood with black grills. A truly stunning beauty, but i also bought it for cheap (outside the classified).

2. It's "just past" ZMF November and most people interested in a ZMF got one recently

4. You sell from GB which means a lot of additional VAT to the buyer. Your previous price of 1400GBP would translate to 1680GBP = 2020€ if I were to buy it. Which is not so enticing anymore.

I think those two are the main reasons. Being in the UK and trying to sell stuff sucks, it just does. Same as buying from people inside it. I'll try to avoid it whenever i can.
I think the other reason is even bigger.
People either know the VO's sound, or are not interested in it, which is sad. I highly recommend it every single time when someone asks for a dynamic driver, because for me it's the best DD flagship from ZMF that exists. I highly prefer it over the Atrium and (OG) Utopia. It's just that it is old at this time, but honestly dynamic drivers have not gotten any better, they have seriously plateaued since the VO / OG Utopia. It's all tuning preferences from there on. Even on a cheap tube amp they sound incredible.
In the end, i can't do more than highly recommend them for people who love bass and treble extension with a more laid-back midrange. It still is one of the very best dynamic drivers that exists and will be forever. It also doesn't get recommended anymore in any video from any reviewer.... I hate that. It got completely forgotten by reviewers... They all gush over the Atrium and repeat how much of an endgame that one is for "people who like a 6XX", but don't even mention the VO as a counterpart for people who dislike it, because it has not enough extension on both ends and a too forward midrange. I think the VO and the OG Utopia (in my opinion you need a tube amp for that one) are one of the very best deals in audio a person can make. And the ZMF comes with a better cable / more readily available connectors.

 

[ThanatosVI]

It also doesn't get recommended anymore in any video from any reviewer.... I hate that

Yeah for example Judes Can jam Preview today, mentions the Caldera as Planar flagship and Atrium as dynamic driver flagship and completely leaves the Verite out of the picture. No mention of co flagship whatsoever.

I mean sure it's older by now, but it never actually lost its flagship spot

 

[phthora]

Possibly another factor is the prices and quality of the b-stock that ZMF offers. I bought my VO b-stock direct and the price was only slightly more than what I had seen in the used market. At the time, I was open to either option, but getting the driver warranty on the b-stock pushed me towards those. Honestly, that will probably be my first stop next time around.

 

[Fresco94]

Hi,

First post here and it's concerning the ZMF Verite opens, so hopefully all questions here are valid for this thread.

I'm coming from a Turntable Hi-fi system but looking to expand into audiophile headphones also as my current living situation doesn't really let me play to a sound-level that utilises my setup that well.

I should probably pre-face this with the knowledge that I am pretty unknowledgeable with jargon and electronics in general, but I absolutely love music and everything that I listen to, and therefore am wanting great equipment to play my music on.

In my Hi-Fi system I have a Rega Planar 6 with Ania MC Cartridge, MC Phono, Rega Elex-R, Klipsch RP-500m. I don't believe the Elex-R has a headphone connectivity to be able to plug headphones in, but am wondering if there's a way?

I listen to a lot of metal, particularly Prog and Doom and have heard very good things about the ZMF Verite open headphones. I've tried to read about the difference between the open and closed and understand that the opens bring a wider soundstage as a benefit, and the closed provide a deeper bass? I am wondering, as I'm assuming neither are noise cancelling, to which degree these don't allow outside noise to come through listening (for indoor listening).

In addition to this I've read but don't really understand about tube amp pairing, particularly Feliks. I don't fully understand but have read that the synergy between the two is because Verite aren't Planar. In this instance, if I were to get these two, I wouldn't be able to, down the line, purchase Planar cans and run them through this headphone amp? Moreover, I'm a bit unsure about spending £1.5k on an amp that is specifically for headhpnones (unless, of course, they're particularly great and really do show the music in such a way to warrant the price), so am wondering if this amp (there's a couple recommended Felix amps?) could also be used in my TT Hi-Fi setup also in replacement of the Elex-R also.

In addition to this, I'm not entirely sure how this set-up works. If I were to go Verite Open and a Felix amp, how do I connect media to it? Is this directly connected to a Mac for example? I've read DACs also being involved but don't really understand how or why.

In my TT system I have a DAC connected to the TV and to the Elex-R which allows me to run my Xbox/Spotify through that amp and the Klipsch.

Apologies if these are really dumb questions, I realise how strange it is to be jumping in to some high-end equipment without much or any knowledge.

Any an all input is very much welcome, really wanting to have equipment that really punches and has clearness to the instruents with a nice punchy/tight bass that can show the music in a great way!

Edit: also how are the VO with Cayin HA-3A? Is this amp suitable for my TT setup as well as headphone listening? I've also realised that these headphones are quite a bit old now, and am wondering how the Caldera's are in regards to all of this?

 

[dbull12]

Hi,

First post here and it's concerning the ZMF Verite opens, so hopefully all questions here are valid for this thread.

I'm coming from a Turntable Hi-fi system but looking to expand into audiophile headphones also as my current living situation doesn't really let me play to a sound-level that utilises my setup that well.

I should probably pre-face this with the knowledge that I am pretty unknowledgeable with jargon and electronics in general, but I absolutely love music and everything that I listen to, and therefore am wanting great equipment to play my music on.

In my Hi-Fi system I have a Rega Planar 6 with Ania MC Cartridge, MC Phono, Rega Elex-R, Klipsch RP-500m. I don't believe the Elex-R has a headphone connectivity to be able to plug headphones in, but am wondering if there's a way?

I listen to a lot of metal, particularly Prog and Doom and have heard very good things about the ZMF Verite open headphones. I've tried to read about the difference between the open and closed and understand that the opens bring a wider soundstage as a benefit, and the closed provide a deeper bass? I am wondering, as I'm assuming neither are noise cancelling, to which degree these don't allow outside noise to come through listening (for indoor listening).

In addition to this I've read but don't really understand about tube amp pairing, particularly Feliks. I don't fully understand but have read that the synergy between the two is because Verite aren't Planar. In this instance, if I were to get these two, I wouldn't be able to, down the line, purchase Planar cans and run them through this headphone amp? Moreover, I'm a bit unsure about spending £1.5k on an amp that is specifically for headhpnones (unless, of course, they're particularly great and really do show the music in such a way to warrant the price), so am wondering if this amp (there's a couple recommended Felix amps?) could also be used in my TT Hi-Fi setup also in replacement of the Elex-R also.

In addition to this, I'm not entirely sure how this set-up works. If I were to go Verite Open and a Felix amp, how do I connect media to it? Is this directly connected to a Mac for example? I've read DACs also being involved but don't really understand how or why.

In my TT system I have a DAC connected to the TV and to the Elex-R which allows me to run my Xbox/Spotify through that amp and the Klipsch.

Apologies if these are really dumb questions, I realise how strange it is to be jumping in to some high-end equipment without much or any knowledge.

Any an all input is very much welcome, really wanting to have equipment that really punches and has clearness to the instruents with a nice punchy/tight bass that can show the music in a great way!

Edit: also how are the VO with Cayin HA-3A? Is this amp suitable for my TT setup as well as headphone listening? I've also realised that these headphones are quite a bit old now, and am wondering how the Caldera's are in regards to all of this?

I love my Verite Open for metal, but for doom in particular I think the Atrium Closed would be worth taking a look at especially since it seems like you value noise isolation. ZMF's open back headphones provide a bit more isolation than most open backs, but closed backs will always just be much better in that regard.

If you prefer a slightly more recessed midrange that leads to more emphasis on percussion while being super fast and snappy sounding, then Verite Open or Closed is your best bet, with mids being a bit less recessed on the Closed. You can also bring the mids forward a little bit with shallower earpads like the BE2 pads.

If you want really rumbly sub-bass with a lush, thick, textural presentation and impressive stage and layering for a closed back then Atrium Closed is what you're looking for, plus it'll give some isolation. Here are my impressions.

If you want similar to Atrium Closed but less sub-bass and more mid-bass punch with a bit of emphasis on the midrange and great staging capabilities, then Atrium Open.

Auteur Classic is slightly less resolving, slightly smaller stage, and a bit more "neutral" with more sub-bass extension than Atrium Open.

Caldera Open and Closed would be excellent all-rounders with the most speed and resolution of any of the ZMFs, with the Closed leaning a bit warmer/darker than the Open. Won't be quite as thick, textured, and romantic as the Atriums or Auteur though, and some people like myself just prefer dyamic drivers for their timbre, microdynamics, and impact.

Sorry I won't be much help when it comes to your questions about amps, but tube amps work great with planars as long as they aren't OTL tube amps. HA-3A for instance would work for Caldera. You'll need to use your DAC into the tube amp. There are also plenty of tube speaker amps that have headphone outputs as well, but the ones I know of are summit-fi and insanely expensive so hopefully others can give some suggestions that would work.

 

[TheMiddleSky]

Several reasons could apply here

1. The economy has been brutal I recent years and money sits tighter than ever. As you've seen yourself 50% resale value is no rarity anymore.

2. It's "just past" ZMF November and most people interested in a ZMF got one recently

3. The custom shop is supposed to come "soonish"

4. You sell from GB which means a lot of additional VAT to the buyer. Your previous price of 1400GBP would translate to 1680GBP = 2020€ if I were to buy it. Which is not so enticing anymore.

5. You don't have a lot of seller feedback and in recent months we have seen counterfeit ZMFs rising

6. Atrium exist

In more serious note, I think the current most favourite (flagship) headphone from ZMF is Atrium, which is the biggest competitor of Verite. Personally, I would choose Verite any time any day over Atrium.

 

[sp33ls]

The Verite is one of those models that are sort of more "nuanced" and, (IMO) difficult to fully appreciate as a relative newcomer. I know I didn't... I sold mine because I didn't know what I truly had with it, and ultimately regretted it. I know that sounds bougie and snobby like wine connoisseurs, but I think the analogue holds true.

It wasn't until going through the high-end merry-go-round that I came to realize that my favorite headphones were often times the ones that reviewers claimed were less competitive or "wonky." (e.g., Verite Open, Sony Z1R, ZMF Atrium Closed [less contentious but still a love or hate].)

Ultimately, I'm a music lover over a pure audiophile. Don't get me wrong, I love high-fidelity playback, but just not at the expense of musical enjoyment.

but I absolutely love music and everything that I listen to, and therefore am wanting great equipment to play my music on.

Your comment above makes me confident you're in the right place if you're considering a ZMF, so well done on your research.

+1 to all of the comments above from @dbull12

Your Rega integrated amplifier doesn't have a headphone output, so you'd either need a separate headphone amplifier or swap out your Rega with an integrated that has a headphone output.

One consideration could also be to look at a mid-to-high-end, restored, vintage amplifier. They tend to have a slightly higher output impedance which works beautifully with ZMF headphones, and also have a phono input for your turntable. When it comes to some things, newer doesn't always equal better. I find this to be true with Hi-Fi, personally; the best amplifiers I've experienced to date are 50 years old lol

Just wanted to throw that out there as a potential option. The folks here in the ZMF forums are amazing, so you're in good hands.

 

[LE9000]

One consideration could also be to look at a mid-to-high-end, restored, vintage amplifier. They tend to have a slightly higher output impedance which works beautifully with ZMF headphones

Interesting. I have a fully restored Sansui AU-9900 that I haven’t used for months. Never thought of trying the HP out. Maybe worth the effort.

 

[dbull12]

So I know I said in my Atrium Closed impressions that I linked above that it's now my favorite headphone and that I prefer just having one headphone, but since then I've given the AC a break due to the closed backs aggravating my tinnitus a bit, and I've just been listening to my VO again. Verite just sounds so amazing and does things no other headphone can. Really don't think I can say I have a favorite, and it's also so nice to listen to one headphone for a few weeks and then switch to an entirely different headphone and presentation the next few weeks. There's no way I can let go of my VO though. Those dynamics, the speed and snappiness while managing to be non-fatiguing (to me) and having that dynamic driver tactility is really addicting. I'm probably going to be buying an Atrium Open since my ears don't get along with closed back designs, but my Verite will remain and I doubt it'll be surpassed by the Atrium, just complemented by it. I love the Atriums for their textural information and how huge guitars sound, but if the Verite somehow had the vocals and guitar tonality of the Atriums then it would be the perfect headphone.

 

[sp33ls]

Interesting. I have a fully restored Sansui AU-9900 that I haven’t used for months. Never thought of trying the HP out. Maybe worth the effort.

both of those are awesome pieces. I love vintage Sansui. Let us know how it goes for you!