[ROBSCIX]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kumaiti /img/forum/go_quote.gif Because of HD audio? That wasn't a rethorical question, I can't really much info on how Essence/Forte/Bravura behave with bluray playback. Any experience on that?

No, that is still no reason. There are two cards avialable right now that can handle HD audio. The HTHD 7.1 and the HDAV 1.3. These cards both handle blueray audio standards such as Dolby Digital plus, Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HDMA and pass it through analog. No other cards will do this out of the box...

They both work fine with those formats using a simple BD-ROM...
You can still go the receiver route as many of them sound great. I was just getting at the point that reasons to use them are getting smaller and smaller. PC gear handles many features and formats that used to only be available through a HT receiver. I will still probably get one down the road but it would be for routing or amplification.

 

[jalyst]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ROBSCIX /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yes, many use receivers for routing features and amplification. a good HTPC would have all the features of a receiver, except maybe the routing and the amplification as the PC offers line level signal I/O. I was going to buy a receiver but figured why bother? Just for amplification? I am working with a 6 channel class-D amplifer instead and using the PC. All the latest formats can be handled either with add-in hardware or coding. Not sure if that is what you were getting at but, hope it helps.

Yeah I'm the same,
I think the only things I'll end-up with outside of my HTPC are; amp for spkrs (maybe cans too), and switching gear.

I guess what I was wanting to be sure of is....
With the right sound-card & software, can one do everything these devices are capable of?

After looking at both closely I'm pretty sure the answer is yes.
But I'm just concerned I'm missing something!

 

[kumaiti]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ROBSCIX /img/forum/go_quote.gif No, that is still no reason. There are two cards avialable right now that can handle HD audio. The HTHD 7.1 and the HDAV 1.3. These cards both handle blueray audio standards such as Dolby Digital plus, Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HDMA and pass it through analog. No other cards will do this out of the box...

Not totally O/T because this is relevant to the ST as well:
did you actually try to watch any bluray movies during the Forte or STX reviews and it didn't work or are you going by the manufacturer specs?

Just to make it clear, I am not talking about bitstreaming but listening to the movie with the headphones.

 

[jalyst]

He means that they're the only two cards that can do BD standard audio.
I was in an in-depth convo with a Linux dev last yr & he seemed to think it wasn't out of the realm of possibility for the ST/X to be PAP compliant
Xonar HDAV1.3 deluxe V Essence ST 'deluxe' - AVS Forum
I'll be getting back to this post very soon......

 

[kumaiti]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jalyst /img/forum/go_quote.gif He means that they're the only two cards that can do BD standard audio. I was in an in-depth convo with a Linux dev last yr & he seemed to think it wasn't out of the realm of possibility for the ST/X to be PAP compliant Xonar HDAV1.3 deluxe V Essence ST 'deluxe' - AVS Forum I'll be getting back to this post very soon......

Very interesting thread over at AVS.

Let's see if ROB has any words about the new BETA drivers from ASUS. Maybe they did implement PAP.

 

[jalyst]

I'm yet to chase further, the guy wanted me to test a few things, will be picking-up again soon.
ST/X dvr not being being fully PAP compliant may turn out to be entirely deliberate and unfixable, so don't get your hopes up!

 

[ROBSCIX]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kumaiti /img/forum/go_quote.gif Not totally O/T because this is relevant to the ST as well: did you actually try to watch any bluray movies during the Forte or STX reviews and it didn't work or are you going by the manufacturer specs? Just to make it clear, I am not talking about bitstreaming but listening to the movie with the headphones.

When I talk about these cards it is from first hand experience. I have tested both for HD audio compliance. If a card does not have PAP compliance such in the case od the STX/ST it will still give you the audio but it will downsample it to 16/48...
With these 'HDMI" cards the audio will be full resolution to what the studios wanted.
Yes, just listening to the soundcard using headphones or amp and cans.


Does that answer your question?

Edit:
Quote:

Originally Posted by kumaiti /img/forum/go_quote.gif Very interesting thread over at AVS. Let's see if ROB has any words about the new BETA drivers from ASUS. Maybe they did implement PAP.

There is always informaiton about hacks and possible work arounds. Which is why I said "out of the box"
AFAIK, the drivers will not be PAP compliant for bluray as that is usually researved for cards meant for HT with HDMI routines and hardware.

 

[ROBSCIX]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jalyst /img/forum/go_quote.gif I'm yet to chase further, the guy wanted me to test a few things, will be picking-up again soon. ST/X dvr not being being fully PAP compliant may turn out to be entirely deliberate and unfixable, so don't get your hopes up!

I just don't think it is a priority with these cards as they were originally meant for headphones. The ST offers surround over analog and S/pdif but no high resolution digital such as HDMI. The ST and I would say the HDAV 1.3 are aimed at different user types
There may be ways to workaroudn it by chaning the audio on the fly as I have heard about some doing but it is still doing a bunch of other stuff to get compatibility that others cards offer out of the box.

If you are into into true support from Blue Ray audio standards such as Dolby Digital PLus, Dolby TrueHD or DTS-HDMA I would recommend that you go for a HDMI compatible card as they still allow these standards to be available through analog.

 

[jalyst]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ROBSCIX /img/forum/go_quote.gif I just don't think it is a priority with these cards as they were originally meant for headphones. The ST offers surround over analog and S/pdif but no high resolution digital such as HDMI. The ST and I would say the HDAV 1.3 are aimed at different user types There may be ways to workaroudn it by chaning the audio on the fly as I have heard about some doing but it is still doign abunch of other stuff to get compatibility that others cards offer out of the box.

It's not a "biggy" for me personally, as any HD content like BR will simply be ripped & transcoded and sound just as good.
T'was more a curiosity thing which I intend to chase when/if I have time...

Any bitstreaming of HD content will most likely not be done, but if I need to, the functionality is there in my Core i3-530.

 

[ROBSCIX]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jalyst /img/forum/go_quote.gif It's not a "biggy" for me personally, as any HD content like BR will simply be ripped & transcoded and sound just as good. T'was more a curiosity thing which I intend to chase when/if I have time... Any bitstreaming of HD content will most likely not be done, but if I need to, the functionality is there in my Core i3-530.

Well that is what I mean, if you are ripping and transcoding..etc then having this support on your card is a moot point. It is not only bitstreaming but the cards decode to analog which is a great features for many. If that is also not something you care about then these HDMI cards are not really what you need.
Are you still torn between the ST Deluxe and the HDAV 1.3?

 

[jalyst]

Oh no, I got the ST Deluxe ages ago....

I just got interested in the possibility of PAP via analogue-out, as it works for the HDAV1.3.
HDMI/digital has nothing to do with what I'm talking about...

But it's all very low priority as I already have a working solution.

night.

 

[kumaiti]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ROBSCIX /img/forum/go_quote.gif Does that answer your question?

Indeed it does, thank you.

Please understand that I didn't mean to sound a smartass or anything. I read both your reviews (Forte and STX) and since they didn't mention anything about bluray playback, I wanted to confirm.

 

[ROBSCIX]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jalyst /img/forum/go_quote.gif Oh no, I got the ST Deluxe ages ago.... I just got interested in the possibility of PAP via analogue-out, as it works for the HDAV1.3. HDMI/digital has nothing to do with what I'm talking about... But it's all very low priority as I already have a working solution. night.

Yes, I thought you had the ST. The hardware differences between the ST and the HDAV are many. While HDMI and digital has nothing to do with what your talking about in one sense, it does because it is all related to what you're after. DRM is a bugger and Vista and the HDMI technology as a whole are wrapped up in it. Personally, I was very surprised either card ended up allowing these audio specs to be sent to analog outputs because of DRM.

To note, originally the HDAV 1.3 would downsample to 16/48 as would other cards for analog but it was fixed along time ago. If you find any options for these audio standards on other cards, aside from ripping and transcoding them, let me know. If I find anything I will do the same.

 

[mojave]

Because I rip Blu-rays with lossless FLAC for the audio, i don't have to worry about PAP or downsampling with the Essence ST. Have you read this thread at AVSForum: Is a PAP relevant at all for practically any listener and/or source material??

 

[ROBSCIX]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kumaiti /img/forum/go_quote.gif Indeed it does, thank you. Please understand that I didn't mean to sound a smartass or anything. I read both your reviews (Forte and STX) and since they didn't mention anything about bluray playback, I wanted to confirm.

No,no I didn't think you were sounding smartass..or anything like that.
I just asked if it answer your question as I was unsure if I was explaining it properly.